SGOTM21 Lurker's Thread

Oracle summary

Spoiler :

FE
MM - Metal Casting (?) leading to 750BC Collosus - 1560 BC

JAE
Pericles - Metal Casting (?) - 1200 BC (!!!!!!!)

MGN
Louis - ? - 1440 BC

PD
Pericles - Currency - 1560 BC

TSR
Isa - Monarchy - 1240 BC

Xteam
Pericles - Code of Laws Civil Service - 1240 BC (!!)

PR
Louis (?) - ? - 1480 BC

Xteam and JAE, who managed to get Oracle, had 2 LATEST Oracle date
PDucks had a really great date, but they would lose Oracle in our game to Mansa (anyone confirms it if dates are the same?)
TSR should easily win Oracle if they went it.

 

Thanks
Also see dates from our tests http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=13809765&postcount=261
in one game it wasn't built before 0 AD.
Still I'm surprised/impressed with getting CS.
We wanted Oracle to be possible but risky.

 

Who got CS? Did I miss sth?

EDIT
Oh, I got it. Changed to Xteam in summary.

To be sincere - They wouldnt have a chance in any other games except JAE

 

Yeah, JAE did not plan early for an Oracle strategy. Just saw the possibility with 1-2 turn build and took it. It would have been lots better to have Mansa find us in turn 20 and trade for MC. Without MC, workboat exploring to Mansa was more risky. But to be honest we had other priorities than exploration (Shaka's untimely DOW comes to mind).

I thought it was well-designed. The Oracle was there for choosing, but was not the only compettive path. Good mapmaking design. The silver pop... well, since there are ways to prevent it, (no hills, or resource on hills near capitol) that's a possibility for improvement.

 

I'm fairly sure our caravels were already out exploring by then. But yeah, early game was quite focused towards astro bulb. I think Oracle wasn't even discussed until t62 when we saw it wasn't built, and that we could have it up in 10 turns without too much investment. Trade for religious techs and pre-chop, then build it with chops and whip overflow in 2 turns, so not much risk of losing hammers.

Overall we were very lucky with getting late goodies. Apart from Oracle we also got the Music Great Artist close to 500AD. That was another one of those that we had given up on, but at some point we noticed he wasn't taken yet and that we could tech music in 2-3 turns. Then there was of course Taj Mahal. Mansa had Nationalism and he got a Great Engineer 2 turns before we were to finish Taj. He rushed Versailles.

 

Tie goes to the player because it's based on turn order. The human player always goes first in turn order and then the AI go in alphabetical order.

 

Another thing that I was unsure prior to the game and am sure now. Thanx!

Also at pre-game test 1560 BC was the earliest date

 

You're right, although the AI aren't organized alphabetically, but by the order of leader picks made before the game starts. The human is always Team 1, and the barbarians the last. In this game, Tokugawa went before Mao, and Mansa was the final regular AI, IIRC.

Regardless, I don't think the Oracle was a problem here. As long as there is at least one AI consistently willing to build it by ~1300 BC, +/– a few turns, then a human team can't snipe it without compromising in other areas. Oracling Classical techs 2-deep into the tech tree (Currency/Construction/Calendar etc.) usually requires skipping Granaries or building fewer cities, while Oracling any Medieval tech (other than Feudalism) magnifies this effect several times over.

The wonder can only becomes OP when a team starts with Silver/Gold/Gems immediately available in the capital, and can reach a big tech freebie without doing much harm to their expansion and development of infra/military elsewhere (edit: especially if a soft neighbor provides several free Workers). Also, if you turn off tech trading, the wonder becomes much weaker.

 

Thanks for the clarification. I've seen the alphabetical order thing mentioned a couple of times by Sulla, but that may have been how the leaders were setup in those games of his. He usually knows what he's talking about.

 

Thx for that info Doshin! Mansa on last place 4ever!

 

Touché. I wonder which team gifted broken Armata for the parade FSB will hunt you down!