SGOTM8 - Durkz

[Niklas]

Sorry Niklas, wasn't listening .

I guess it's alright since you showed the Japanzees the way off the island anyway.
But I really don't understand why you didn't take the ROP with Rome.

These turns take forever, and I am too tired to continue. Sorry, will have to play tomorrow as well, or someone will have to take over from here.

Well, my policy has been to keep rotating, but I would feel bad telling you to stop after only two turns, in particular since they would (hopefully ) be your last in this game. On the other hand, it's been two rather eventful turns, and as you said they did take quite some time to play.

However, my guess it that the next three turns will be mostly building up for the next massive hit. They should play a lot faster since there won't be that much fighting done. So perhaps it's only fair that you play the next three "boring" turns as well, and leave off to WD at a more "fun" point.

Long rant for a simple conclusion: play the rest as well, tonight.

Some quick comments:

• What counts now is the last town we take out. We should concentrate all efforts on lowering that, how fast we take the other towns are of no consequence.
• We have more than enough tanks for what we need them for, but they're stuck in the wrong place. We need more airports to get them out. Disband some for quick shields?
• We can run at much lower lux rate now with the ivory. 0% research.
• We want settlers on the Gävle and Tatung islands. One of our helis can do an airdrop close to the colony near Tatung already this turn. I say load up a settler and two infantry and let them fly. You can use the cavs to check that there are no units on the landing site, whichever one you choose.
• The other heli could rebase to Methburg, then do a drop next turn right outside the borders of Caesarea. Gävle is too remote to be useful.
• We don't need more tanks so much as we need more helis and infantry. Lots of towns should switch.

Probably won't have time for more comments.

 

[zyxy]

Turn 2, 1260AD (cont): at 0 lux, 0 sci we'll make > 500 gpt. Only Corinth and Canton are unhappy and need specialists. Chopper a settler, infantry and worker to Tatung island. Just to see if it works, I rebase a loaded chopper to Corinth - it works, and the loaded troops can still move! Kago hurries airport aided by some cav disbands. Jerusalem has rifle defense. Bombers rebase to New Orleans, to strike at Tatung Island. Switch some builds to heli and infantry.

IT: Cumae is attacked by barbs and loses 3 gold. Barbs nearly sink an English galley for us .

Turn 3, 1265AD: Tatung Again founded. With the help of the worker I rush an airport. We cannot see the landing zone, but I gamble and drop an infantry-settler-worker triple near Caesarea - it goes ok. Drop 3 inf near Delphi, 1 near Plebos.
Our bombers cause widespread destruction on Tatung island. Bizen taken.
Agan disband some cavs and tanks to rush airports in Osaka and Cumae.

IT: Edo flips back .

Turn 4, 1270AD: March some tanks towards Edo, but it will take another turn. Drop a small army in Tatung. Found

Romanum Eunt Domum near Caesarea and rush airport. Abandon Yokohama, Tokyo, Izumo, Izumi and Satsuma because they are still resisting. Drop some infantry near Warwick.

IT: Japan lands near Kago. Our palace expands. Romans declare because of their MPP with England.

Turn 5, 1275AD: take back Edo and burn it to the ground. Take Echizen and Fukushima. Greece still has no rifles, so we declare and take Plebos. Two inf die al Delphi, it should fall next turn... Argos as well, the road was blocked.
Drop a small army (TM) in Romanum. lux has to go to 10%.

Notes:

• Tatung island should fall in about 4 turns. The largest Roman-Vik island shouldn't take much longer. On the next turn you can airlift a bunch of cavs there to round up the Viks (they lack rifles). I would not rush airport in Gavle, as money can be used better to rush infantry and airports elsewhere.
• Romans generally have rifles everywhere, Viks may have anything from spears to muskets IIRC. Japs sometimes rifles, sometimes spears.
• This leaves a bunch of smaller islands, and they are trickier, as you need to chopper infantry over to each. Some ideas:
  • On the next turn the heli in Plebos can be rebased back to Vikland with 2 infantry on board. The infantry can then board the heli in Linkoping and drop to Kalmar. You can rush another inf in Lutetia to add.
  • Try to get infantry to Tientsin next turn. Bombers are already in place for support, so this will save time. There's a chopper in Canton.
  • Once we take Warwick we have a base on that island. Rush airport and finish. English defenses seem low .
  • The heli in Adjanta can reach Warwick island as well as Hippo-Nico island. To take Nico island you can use the settler from Denver and rush airport.
  • In Vasteras we'll need an airport, or chopper infantry over. Viks are weak, so infantry with small (or no) bomber support might be enough here. Better to use airports for the Romans.
  • To get to Tarentum island, rebase a chopper loaded with infantry to Hakodate and drop from there. You'll need bomber support I think. To scout whether the mountain is safe to drop, just use a bomb run .
  • Lund can be taken by infantry. I think that's all islands.
• There's a bunch of fortified workers on Rome-Jap island, near Cumae.
• You may have to check lux tax at the end of the turn. I just save, then Mapstat will tell me about riots .
• We'll have to pray that there are no boat settlers anywhere. Could become timeconsuming. Apart from that, maybe 10 turns to go.

The save.

 

[Niklas]

Great going zyxy.
The 15 turns I predicted will probably not hold, but I blame that on the cancelled double-slam on Japan and Rome (which would probably have slowed us down due to spreading too thin had we tried it). Maybe 10 turns to go you say, that means I'll get to play another turnset after all. I was so hoping I wouldn't have to.

The calendar:
Oct 12: Turnset 1 (940 - 1010, 7 turns) - Methos
Oct 16: Turnset 2 (1010 - 1070, 7 turns) - zyxy
Oct 18: Turnset 3 (1070 - 1130, 6 turns) - WarDance
Oct 20: Turnset 4 (1130 - 1200, 7 turns) - Niklas
Oct 22: Turnset 5 (1200 - 1250, 5 turns) - Methos
Oct 25: Turnset 6 (1250 - 1275, 5 turns) - zyxy
Oct 26: Turnset 7 (1275 - 1300, 5 turns) - WarDance
Oct 28: Turnset 8 (1300 - 1325, 5 turns) - Niklas
Oct 30: Turnset 9 (1325 - 1350, 5 turns) - Methos
Nov 1: Turnset 10 (1350 - 1375, 5 turns) - zyxy

WD, as a personal favor to me, won't you finish this off in 5 turns to spare me another turnset?

 

[Methos]

Wow! Great turns zyxy!

Now things are happening extremely quick! Looks like we may make the November date after all.

 

[Niklas]

Hmm... jokes aside, when I look at the save I can't help but think that we can actually do this in 5 turns from now. I haven't counted the number of helis and infantry though, so it may be too few of those that will delay us a few turns more.
I'll try to get the time to do a full analysis, but time is short for me.

 

[zyxy]

The two main islands can be done in 5 I think (I believe I calculated 4 turns from now for Tatung island, the other one should not take much longer). The main problem is the small islands. It takes time to get there, and infantry needs bomber support against rifles. Meaning the southern Roman islands are a pain: either infantry + bombers (and even then expect losses), or airports. The three Vik islands might be more doable, and the Greek islands are nearly done.

We can rush about 1 airport per turn, slightly less. All heli flights and all airlifts from Rome-Japan and our island have been used for this turn.

If Niklas has no time, I might be able to whip up a turn-by-turn plan tomorrow. Careful planning can save some few turns here, it's all logistics rather than firepower.

Wow! Great turns zyxy!

Now things are happening extremely quick! Looks like we may make the November date after all.

Thanks! Someone left me this huge tank army to play with .

 

[Niklas]

Tatung island: could go down in 3 even, if the troops we have are enough.

Roman home island: goes down in 4 or 5 depending on how hard the Viks fight. Needs more tanks next turn.

Vik island: should go down in 5, but we must take Lugdunum already next turn.

These three islands need detailed logistical plans.

Greek island: goes down next turn.

Tientsin island: no rifles here I suppose, so just drop a few infantry and take it.

Hippo-Nico:

1. airdrop settler/infantry/worker on the horses.
2. build town, disband worker, rush airport.
3. airlift tanks.
4. take out both towns.

Warwick island:

1. take Warwick, disband infantry, rush airport.
2. airlift tanks.
3. take Artaxata.
4. take Nicopolis.

Tarentum island:

1. rebase a heli with infantry to Hakodate, and a bomber escort.
2. make a bombing run on the mountain to make sure no unit is there, then airdrop infantry on mountain.
3. capture Tarentum.

Tarentum is tricky, what if there is a unit on the mountain? If this is the case, I hope it runs into cover after we bomb it, so make another test bombing run the next turn before airdropping anything. If it's still there, you should break and we need to think of a backup plan.

Kalmar island:

1. rebase a heli with infantry to Nidaros, and a bomber escort.
2. make a bombing run on some tile outside to make sure no unit is there, then airdrop infantry on that tile.
3. capture Kalmar.

Lund:

1. re-base a heli to Aurelioranum with infantry, and with a bomber escort.
2. do a test bombing run outside Lund, then airdrop infantry.
3. capture Lund.

Västerås island:

1. (rush airport on 0) airlift cavs.
2. move cavs to mountain outside Göteborg. Airlift cavs or tanks.
3. capture Göteborg. Move reinforcements to nearest forest.
4. move towards Jönköping.
5. capture Jönköping.

This is from looking at each island in isolation. Those islands that take fewer turns could be scheduled for later so that we have enough infantry and helis for each listed operation. It would be great if one of you could make a complete turn-by-turn schedule, for each island, and for all islands together.

Regarding the rushing of airports, we can sell off all unis and libs, and all barracks in towns that won't produce anything within 5 turns. There are also a few improvements in captured towns that we won't really need. Perhaps even an airport or two in our core, we have more than we can airlift troops from. We should be able to get quite some money this way, and our gpt will clearly go up as well. We need only three more airports, on three different turns it would seem, so this should certainly be doable.

 

[zyxy]

You missed Kalmar island, I think. Apart from that, looks good.
I can make a turn-by-turn tonight.

 

[Niklas]

Aye, I missed Kalmar, another rebase-airdrop-invade like Tarentum then.
I edited the post above to include this.

@WD: Since we're clearly close to finishing, you don't have to play your full turns tonight (or even start), as long as you have your turns down before the weekend.

 

[WarDance]

@WD: Since we're clearly close to finishing, you don't have to play your full turns tonight (or even start), as long as you have your turns down before the weekend.

Good. I just got home from working all night and will be quite out of it all day most likely. So my plan is to play thursday morning.

 

[zyxy]

Here's an attempt at a turn-by-turn.

General notes:

• If we sell all libs/unis now and we cannot get a foothold on every island, then we're in trouble as we might have to research up to missiles. Otoh, we could use the money right now to rush units on the mainland. (Like Niklas said, we have enough money to rush all airports). Our biggest bottleneck is that Kago island can only lift 5 units per turn, while the mainland cannot build units fast enough to use all its airlifts. In the scheme below I assumed we don't sell libs. If we do, I would (short-)rush tanks on the mainland.
• Selling a building gives 1/8-th of its shield cost in gold. I didn't count libs/unis, but assuming about two dozen of each gives around 850 gold - enough for (short-)rushing about 4-5 tanks I guess. You can also use forestry operations to cut build times on the mainland.
• RoP with Viks lasts for another 3 turns in 1275AD.
• I assume that the last city you take from a civ doesn't have resistance. Otherwise we'll need another turn to rush airport in Warwick.
• Here's a pic of all the islands:
  
  
  
  Names and ownership of the islands:
  • 1 - Main. America.
  • 2 - Tientsin. Roman.
  • 3 - Romanum. Am, Rom, Vik.
  • 4 - Tatung. Am, Rom, Jap
  • 5 - Warwick. Eng, Rom.
  • 6 - Lund. Am, Vik.
  • 7 - Kago. Am.
  • 8 - Vasteras. Am, Vik.
  • 9 - uninhabited. Keep it that way .
  • 10 - Vikland. Am, Rom, Vik.
  • 11 - Kalmar. Vik.
  • 12 - Syra. Am, Rom.
  • 13 - Caesar. Am.
  • 14 - Tarentum. Rom.
  • 15 - Plebos. Am.
  • 16 - Argos. Gre.
  • 17 - Hera. Am.
  • 18 - Hippo. Rom.
  Islands to be taken by infantry: 2, 6, 11, 14, 16
  Islands to be taken using tanks/cavs: 3, 4, 5*, 8*, 10, 12, 18* [* means airport need to be constructed].
• We have 5 choppers now, current locations: thermo, canton, adjanta, plebos, linkoping. We don't need more it seems.
• I probably forgot one or two things so please check before you play!

Turn 0 (1275AD): Airlift some tanks from mainland to Romanum, I forgot to do this. You may want to keep a few on main island, the Jap boats near Beijing didn't unload yet.
Sell markets, banks, harbors and barracks on Kago island, as well as improvements in Bizen, Lutetia (except rax), Bjoergvin, Stockholm, Oslo, Uppsala, Nidaros, Norkoping for about 180 gold total. Keep rax in Lutetia for healing and in case you need to rush an infantry.
Rush airport in Vasteras (560 gold). Treasury: 200 gold (roughly). We'll need the infantry from Athens, Chengdu, New Durkz, Memphis, Tantooine, others can switch back to tanks.
Perhaps do something with the workers on Kago, maybe rush settler in Hispalis this turn or next. There's a native guy somewhere that you can add to Hispalis next turn.

-----------------------

Turn 1: Buy WM (for WM) from Viks to spot barb camps.

Hippo and Tientsin: Load 2 infantry in Plebos chopper, rebase to mainland, and unload. Load 1 mainland infantry in Adjanta chopper together with settler and worker and drop on Hippo island. Drop remaining three infantry just outside Tientsin with Canton chopper.

Tatung: Tanks advance on Seleucia and attack Ise. Remaining tanks from the southern stack can advance on Suo and Sapporo. You have bomber support over Ise, remaining bombers can hit Tientsin. Will not mention Tatung for subsequent turns, it's obvious. Will finish in 3-4 turns.

Romanum: Advance on the Vik towns first, Roman towns can be done later. Will not mention this island anymore either.

Argos: Bomber from LA can help, take the two cities. Rebase choppers remaining two choppers to Argos and Delphi.

Warwick: take Warwick, and disband an infantry to rush airport (632 gold).

Vikland: take Lugdunum, proceed to Hastings.

Syra: Tank to Hako, rest for one turn, then advance to Jeru. No more mention of this island, finish on turn 5.

Airlifts: from Kago and Main to Romanum, Vikland and Vasteras, as needed. Send cavs to Vasteras for speed.

Treasury: 150 gold.

--------------------------------

Turn 2:

WM again.

Hippo: found city, disband worker to rush airport (632 gold).

Tientsin: rebase 2 bombers from LA and New Orleans to Hako and Aurelio. Others can bomb away at Tientsin, and infantry take the town.

Vasteras: straightforward. Won't mention it anymore. You'll need 3-4 turns from here with cavs, depending on RNG.

Choppers: Delphi chopper drops 3 inf at Kalmar.Can scout landing zone with a worker on the nearby hill in Vikland. Rebase a loaded chopper from Argos to Hako. Load three inf in a mainland chopper and rebase to Aurelio.

Airlifts: Warwick (3-4 tanks?), and of course reinforcements where needed.

Vikland: Declare now, and you can take Hastings, Possibly Ore. RoP is up anyway. Need about 3 turns from here.

Treasury: 100 gold.

---------------------------------

Turn 3:

Bombers, Lund and Tarentum: use bombers to scout landing zone, then drop the three inf if safe. Rebase New Orleans bombers as needed, focus on Rome probably.

Warwick: advance to Roman towns. Finish 1-2 turns from here.

Kalmar: take it!

Airlifts: Hippo I guess, 4 tanks minimum. Consider selling off libs/unis and rushing airport in Gavle, (short-)rushing tanks on mainland.

---------------------------------

Turn 4:

Tarentum and Lund: should fall this turn.

Hippo: get moving! 1-2 turns from here.

Can airlift cavs into Gavle if you built airport, or into Romanum to take out the Roman cities.

Turn 5:

Mop up. If all goes well, you could finish this turn. It depends very much on the RNG though.

 

[WarDance]

Wow, the pressure is on! I may play one turn or so this evening but count on it tomorrow. I'm worn out anyway so probably better to wait and do it while I'm more focused.

 

[zyxy]

Don't hurry. Two turnsets to go at most.

Btw, it's probably better to keep the rax in Lutetia as it's building an infantry - just in case. I changed that in the turn-by-turn.

In fact, the pressure may be too high. Part of the scheme depends on some luck with the RNG at the right moments - the infantry battles in particular can go either way. So don't feel bad if you cannot make it, and try to keep some choppers in position so that you can quickly send reinforcements.

Now dance that wardance!

 

[Niklas]

Looking really good. Only comment is regarding Romanum. If we can lift more tanks there, we should really try to send as many tanks north on the first turn as possible. It doesn't matter if we don't raze those Roman towns until turn 5, but the Vik towns will take time to reach. Besides, Caesarea is the only size-6+ town left, we could use some bomber support before going after it.

I assume that the last city you take from a civ doesn't have resistance.

You assume correctly . And even if they have a settler in a boat somewhere, our culture is so much larger than theirs that it would surprise me greatly if we got any resistors anyway.

@WD: Good luck!

 

[zyxy]

Looking really good. Only comment is regarding Romanum. If we can lift more tanks there, we should really try to send as many tanks north on the first turn as possible. It doesn't matter if we don't raze those Roman towns until turn 5, but the Vik towns will take time to reach. Besides, Caesarea is the only size-6+ town left, we could use some bomber support before going after it.

Good point. I've changed the schedule accordingly.

 

[WarDance]

Xteam has posted a 1350AD save...

Look for my turns sometime this afternoon.

 

[zyxy]

Xteam has posted a 1350AD save...

IMO that definitely means don't sell libs and unis before landings are secure. We have 15 turns, should be more than enough.

 

[Niklas]

Xteam has posted a 1350AD save...

I know I shouldn't say it, but I will anyway . Guys, we're going to win this. 15 turns means we even have time to hunt down any eventual boating settlers, or research to F-17 or espionage or whatever. We're going to win this!

On the other hand, it might just be that because of the changed starting location for Ragnar the powers that be will decide to yet again award separate laurels for PTW and Classic, which means racing against Xteam is rather pointless... but fun.

 

[WarDance]

I share your enthusiasm, Niklas, but we've got a bit of a problem. There is a worker on the mountian by Tarentum. Can a paratrooper land on him? That sure would be convenient.

I'm finishing turn 2... the first one took me a long time because I didn't want to miss anything. England and Greece are gone, of course, and things are going well. I may have to finish tonight. Will that be a problem with our schedule?

 

[Niklas]

There is a worker on the mountian by Tarentum. Can a paratrooper land on him? That sure would be convenient.

I don't know, but I think not. Would be nice if someone could figure this out. I suppose bombing him doesn't work either?

I may have to finish tonight. Will that be a problem with our schedule?

Not at all. If we need more turns, I'm going to have to pass, so it will be Methos who plays during the weekend. IIRC Methos likes (to play on) weekends.