Sid's Soushi

Merkinball

Deity
Joined
Mar 25, 2007
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6,980
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Western New York
My two favorite corporations are Mining Inc and Sid's Soushi. I really like Sid's Soushi because I can get some meager cities growing again, and really add some punch to my production cities by adding additional engineer's when it comes time to produce my spaceship.

In my last game though...I wasn't able to found Sid's Soushi in my capital. I really can't figure out why. I had already founded Standard Ethenol (don't really care for that one, but I wanted to see it's impact, this corp comes to late to be a benefit in my opinion.)

I airlifted my merchant to the home continent. Put him in my capital that had Wall Street, and it wouldn't establish Sid's Soushi (or Cereal Mills). I moved him to every other city on the continent, and each and every other city on the continent COULD found Sid's Soushi and Cereal Mills. But what's the point? You loose all kinds of money by founding Corps outside of the Wall Street city.

So how come I couldn't found Sid's Soushi in my capital?
 
I think Standard Ethanol and Sid's Sushi are competing corporations and therefore can't coexists in the same city. Just like Mining and Creative Construction can't coexists either. You have to be careful in choosing which corporations you really want.
 
If you have a Competing Corporation, then you need to

1. Have enough money to replace the existing corp
2. You can't replace an HQ

so the HQs are incompatible (so only found 1 if you are OK with blocking the other corps from this city)
 
Exactly what GrandWazoo and Krikkitone said.

Just to add, corporations are 'Competing' if they use any of the same resources. In your example that would be rice I think.
 
Corporations that use the same resources cannot exist in the same city. Therefore you can only have one out of Sid's Sushi, Cereal Mills and Standard Ethanol in a city. Mining Inc competes with Civ Jewelers, Aluminium Co and Creative Constructions. There are no other clashes.
 
Okay, that makes sense. Shouldn't be problem in the future because I can't say as I like Standard Ethanol a whole lot.
 
I definitely agree with the power of Sushi. On any map with enough water, it gives you lots of extra food (and culture, which is great in border and newly captured cities).

My corporation strategy is to try to found Mining Inc (1st one available) first, then Sid's Sushi (Medicine is good for growth anyway). I'll focus my great people cities on engineers and merchants in this time period, or if I was lucky enough to get and not need to use (Economics for example) one, I'll save it to be certain of my shot at these.

I'll generally put both into my Wall Street city. It is possible that, in the long run, I'll have more foreign branches of my corps than domestic, but in the beginning with these two I focus on keeping them at home exclusively. The AI will hoard resources if it gets these corporations, so I don't spread them to the AI.

The others get founded in some other city. It doesn't matter too much, as all cities with the money-enhancing buildings are otherwise equal. Still, if I have a holy city which isn't otherwise anything special, I may use it to hold a corp HQ simply to put all my extra-gold eggs into a few highly defended baskets.

Since both of these compete with the others, you can't put three HQ's in a city with them in. The main reason to want to do that is to maximize the Wall Street profits from your widely distributed corporations.

For my foreign corporate expansions, Standard Ethanol and Aluminum Co are good first picks, unless I absolutely want to stifle a competitor's access to oil and aluminum. If they have it, and they usually do, it doesn't help them that much to have these. But because both are later-tech corps, I'd hate to focus on trying to get them and exploit this as a major moneymaking goal in most games. The obvious critical use for either of these is to get the resource if you can't get it via trade or war.

If I get them, I do try to spread them to the AI. The AI will, at least for now, happily drop executives all over their cities once they get a corporation. The new patch may change this behavior, though I'm betting it will continue because corporation maintenance will be lowered.

Cereal Mills and Creative Constructions are my picks for "export" corporations. The benefits they give aren't amazingly good, and while they do both compete with Mining & Soushi, they don't lock out all of the good tradeable resources doing so.

The ideal plan with both of these is to seed a few cities with executives, then let the AI spread it around. Makes the investment much more effective that way. The AI won't do that if it runs State Property, which is a good reason to use the UN to force Environmentalism on everyone. Now for sure, it makes your own corporation costs higher. But if everyone else has your corporations popping out branches right and left, it easily makes up for that.

Civ Jewelers is a tricky one. Unpatched, it is only worth delivering to the AI, because maintenance consumes the money it makes. Using Solver's unofficial patch, it is a pretty good one to have to make loads of money. In which case, it is hard to spread it around much, except for cities where you don't feel a need for the Mining Inc production bonus. If you do that, try to put Sid's Soushi and Creative Contructions into it.

However, I still favor Mining Inc, because of the high potential bonuses on most maps. An extra 20 or more shields in every city, especially the new low-production ones, is useful in all circumstances. And if you do need money, just have a high production city generate wealth.
 
Inky, have you tried extorting resources from the AI before spreading Mining Inc and Sids Soushi? Even with civ's that I'm not on the best terms with, I've yet to have a trade deal dissappear from spreading the corporation to them. They just continue to spread the corporation with next to no benefit and drain their economies in the process.

Take all you can from the AI, then spam the corporation to them. Works like a charm, and is probably an exploit.

I was spreading standard ethanol to Civ's with a benefit of 2 beakers last night...
 
Before you found a corporation, you might want to go to the corporation adviser. When you hover your mouse over each corp, it will show the bonus it will bring to each city. I'd choose the corp most beneficial to my cities, e.g. then one with the most resources. Last game I played I made Sid's Sushi,
because it was more beneficial and tasty to me than cereal mills. And Mining inc because it also was good (And I didn't need any culture from create. con. or had any use for the other two)
 
In my experience I have found these two to be the best corps by far. The only downside is that the both of them compete with everything else which might be a problem if you need Standard Ethanol or Aluminum Inc.
 
I have limited myself to Sid's so far. I basically follow a lot in MrCynical's guide. The resources help in certain cities that need food/culture, but I find the spreading to foreign civs for $$$, and to screw up their economy is the real deal. The UI doesn't seem to deal with corps discriminately, they just spam them to all their cities and more often than not, gimp themselves. Meanwhile your city with Sids HQ, Wall Street, Shrine, maybe Merchant specialists, and whatever else make that city a huge $$$ resource. In my current gam,e I also have National Park in the city with Sid's. Although, I think thats not optimal, since NP probably has better synergy with a GPP farm+NE, it was the best forest I had available. It is hard for me to found/spread multiple corps and deal with all the other things going on, but that will improve with time :)
 
The Inflation can be a big problem for stability though, I await the patch to make them inflation exempt. I just played a Hammurabi Game where I went Eco because I still had lots of forrests and used the UN to lock it in. Then I spread Mining and Sushi to every city and stuck backup cities on weath to offset the science cost (Mining will make more than it costs if you set the city to wealth in my expiriance). I was doing fine beside the fact that my income fluxuated by as much as 400 GPT... It was anywhere from +450 to -80. Major instability...
 
Standard Ethanol can be good if you only have one source of Oil and your opponent is continually sabotaging your Oil well with spies.
 
Maybe I'm just being paranoid, keeping the best corporations to myself. The AI does seem to limit new trades of resources it uses for its corporations, so unless you can lock all your deals up before you spread, you still might not get as much as you could.

Extortion, though, that may still work. Even so, if the AI indicates the resource is untradeable, you can't extort it unless they're your vassal (who will give you every resource they have if you demand it).

My main reason for not spreading Mining or Soushi is that the benefits of both are generally better for the AI than the others. I'd rather give them as little in the deal as I can arrange. Though for a very friendly AI, or perhaps a tight, close vassal, I might try to do a better deal, I'd rather just get my 10 or 15 gold each and stick them with the least benefits possible.


Solver's unofficial patch makes corporations worth using. The maintenance costs are much better, and you can actually make money with them.
 
My main reason for not spreading Mining or Soushi is that the benefits of both are generally better for the AI than the others. I'd rather give them as little in the deal as I can arrange. Though for a very friendly AI, or perhaps a tight, close vassal, I might try to do a better deal, I'd rather just get my 10 or 15 gold each and stick them with the least benefits possible.

I currently have Sid's spread to two of my cities, HQ is my big money maker, one branch in my great person farm which is still growing at pop=30. Then I have spread it all over 4/5 civs, and they spread it internally to themselves. My HQ now makes 80g/turn+200% for wall street+bank+market+grocer=240g/turn. The maintenance cost in the two cities is 30g/turn. So I make 210g/turn off Sids. There are hidden costs here, I need to send spies out to keep the other civs off Mercantilism/State Property or use diplomatic means, but that is not too bad and kind of fun. "You know you can't resist my Maguro, right?" :love:

I guess the AI benefits in some ways from it, but his corp maintenance costs must be crazy, so he is paying big time for a bit of extra food and culture.
 
Before you found a corporation, you might want to go to the corporation adviser. When you hover your mouse over each corp, it will show the bonus it will bring to each city. I'd choose the corp most beneficial to my cities, e.g. then one with the most resources. Last game I played I made Sid's Sushi,
because it was more beneficial and tasty to me than cereal mills. And Mining inc because it also was good (And I didn't need any culture from create. con. or had any use for the other two)

Well, going to the corporation advisor in advance doesn't give a very accurate picture of how your corporations will look once you create them. Why? Because most AI opponents horde their extra corporation-related resources until somebody founds the relevant corporation. Then a few turns after someone else founds it, they will put them up for trade. So you need to anticipate which resources you will be able to obtain via trading after you found each corporation.
 
My AI allies are hoarding their resources! I was afraid of that, but wanted to know for sure. I spread Sid's Sushi to one city in each of Pacal and Ragnar's civs. As soon as my seafood trades expired, they no longer were willing to trade those resources. I got the "this deal is cancelled" message, with no option to renegotiate.

Instead, the resources are marked in red, "surely you must be joking". They simply are unwilling to trade away those corporation resources for any price.

This is no guarantee that some AI won't decide to trade. But Ragnar is my Friendly Defensive Pact ally and Pacal is also friendly, so I don't know that attitude would help. Not finding a need for the corporation, that might work. But I'm still going to stick with not spreading Sushi around if I want to maximize its effect myself.

Ragnar did, however, continue to trade iron and copper for Mining Inc. Neither are used by Creative Construction, right? So while it might ding my Mining resources some, it isn't a bad idea to spread Creative around to make foreign money.
 
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