alcaras
Warlord
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2005
- Messages
- 213
Round 3: Turns 31-45
Turn 31
I start the round by talking to Surya of Khmer, who warns me of his worst enemy, Hammurabi.
We set up Open Borders, allowing my scout to explore.
I notice Nidaros is 1 turn from growth so I whip the Axeman, taking it from 16/23 to 36/23, with spillover going into another Axeman.
Turn 32
Gems are now hooked up.
My scout sees Khmer's capital, Yasodunspellable, defended by a warrior.
I leave my newly created Axeman unpromoted for now, since I want to see what's inside Boudica's city before promoting. I also set a worker to chopping, since I want to get these Axes out ASAP; the other worker starts building a road towards Boudica.
Turn 33
Another axeman appears.
Turn 34
Production/scouting turn.
Turn 35
Nidaros is once again 1 turn from growth so I whip an Axe again.
Turn 36
The Axe builds.
My scout locates a copper source just outside Khmer's borders -- it'll be good to keep an eye on this after we're done with Boudica.
Turn 37
Another Axe builds, bringing us to 4 -- we'll go with 5.
My scout encounters an emissary from Paleface himself, I mean Justinian -- the last civ we have to face.
My chopper worker sets to chopping the forested hill SE of Nidaros.
Turn 38
With Nidaros once again 1 turn from growth, I whip another axe.
Turn 39
Mathematics is discovered; I queue Masonry->Construction. The fifth axe is produced and the axes set off towards Celtic lands.
Turn 40
With the road now reaching to the edge of my cultural borders, I'm tell my worker to chop the patch of forest just outside -- I figure there's no point building a road in that patch of neutral land since the river crossing will remove any benefit of taking the road.
The army marches forth -- it looks like Khmer has founded two more cities, Angkor Thom on the copper we found west of earlier, and an unknown city perhaps NE of pigs, judging by the cultural borders.
Turn 41
War with Boudica!
Turn 42
Hammurabi comes asking for Open Borders, but I ask to negotiate then take it off the table. I think OB is considered 'trading' and Khmer considers Hammurabi his worst enemy... I negotiated/took it off the table b/c that supposedly doesn't piss them off as much as 'it ain't happening.'
The army continues to march, sticking to hills/forests as much as possible.
Turn 43
Looks like two archers in Bib.
Some quick math to figure out which promotion would be better...
Clicking on my axes and holding down alt tells me the archers are 6.45 strong (modified). This means that since all Boudica has is archers, we should go with anti-archery promotion, since that's 25% reduction to the defender in this case, more than the 20% from City Raider. Also, in MP games most stack battles do not take place at cities, so City Raider is less useful.
I promote Archery (Cover):
Now we see we have 5.5 v. 5.7 and I'm now confused, since 6.45/(1.25) = 5.16...
Taking a moment to re-read the Combat Mechanics thread....
Ah yes, I forgot in Civ, nothing is multiplicative -- everything is additive.
So that archer is really 6.45 = 3 * (1+0.5+0.4+0.25) by itself, but our anti-archery promotion makes the archer only 3 * (1 + 0.5 + 0.4 + 0.25 - 0.25).
What's our R ratio? A/D -- 5.5/5.7 = 0.964912281. A higher R ratio is better.
Note: we can check that a str promotion wouldn't have been better, as it would have been (5 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.1)) / 6.45, an R of 0.80620155. And city raider is clearly inferior because 20% is less than 25%.
Normally I wouldn't want to do all this math in MP, but I only recently really grasped the combat system in Civ4 and thus am doing this illustrate stuff that I hope will become second nature.
Turn 44
There are still only two archers.
Is it wise to attack with our stack of axemen?
I stumbled across this tip in a thread (though I don't remember which one):
I'm not sure how this was derived, and I'd prefer to figure out how to get a good stack v. stack estimate from the modified strengths, but this will do for now.
So we have 24 strength against us, and we're bringing 5 strength axemen = this means we need 24/5 ~= 5 axemen to take the city. So we should feel safe in attacking.
The moment of truth:
We've got it! The first two axemen died, but the city fell.
There's a second Celtic city out there, to the north -- by the bronze.
But fortunately it won't have time to hook it up.
I tell newly conquered Bibracte to produce a rax.
Turn 45
Back at home, I set my worker to cottage a grassland river tile, since Nidaros will hit size 6 in 5 turns. Once my other worker finishes chopping, I'll have him hook up Elephants which just got grabbed into my cultural borders.
Here's the battle front -- 1 warrior in Vienne, and an archer+warrior NW of it. Also a random worker building a road -- might be able to snag him next turn if he stays in range of my Axe.
Nidaros:
Bibracte:
And a high level view of the world. Of particular note is that Khmer founded Angkor Thom on Bronze, which is something we want to deny them when we're done with the Celts.
Diplomacy, which may be good to keep in mind -- of note, Monty is -1 already... and he's -4 with Justinian (we are upset you have fallen under the sway of a heathen religion)...
And something I noticed when I went in to get the Diplo ss... Hammurabi has decided to settle a city on the rice not far south...
--
That ends this round.
Comments/complaints/critiques/suggestions are all welcome
I must say, playing the game slowly like this and thinking through turns and discussing them is improving my game play quite a bit. Thank you to all the contributors thus far!
Some questions I have:
- Raze Vienne?
- Angkor Thom or Yasodunspellable first? Angkor does have bronze, which could be a problem.
- Any production changes? We'll have catas in 8 turns -- which makes me think we should get some catapults for Yasodunspellable, since it's cultural defense will be getting pretty high.
- Was my whipping appropriate? Was there anything I could have done better?
- Ivory will be hooked up soon as well -- worth detouring to HBR (horseback riding) for 'phants (elephants)?
Attached please find the save file.
Turn 31
I start the round by talking to Surya of Khmer, who warns me of his worst enemy, Hammurabi.
We set up Open Borders, allowing my scout to explore.
I notice Nidaros is 1 turn from growth so I whip the Axeman, taking it from 16/23 to 36/23, with spillover going into another Axeman.
Turn 32
Gems are now hooked up.
My scout sees Khmer's capital, Yasodunspellable, defended by a warrior.
I leave my newly created Axeman unpromoted for now, since I want to see what's inside Boudica's city before promoting. I also set a worker to chopping, since I want to get these Axes out ASAP; the other worker starts building a road towards Boudica.
Turn 33
Another axeman appears.
Turn 34
Production/scouting turn.
Turn 35
Nidaros is once again 1 turn from growth so I whip an Axe again.
Turn 36
The Axe builds.
My scout locates a copper source just outside Khmer's borders -- it'll be good to keep an eye on this after we're done with Boudica.
Turn 37
Another Axe builds, bringing us to 4 -- we'll go with 5.
My scout encounters an emissary from Paleface himself, I mean Justinian -- the last civ we have to face.
My chopper worker sets to chopping the forested hill SE of Nidaros.
Turn 38
With Nidaros once again 1 turn from growth, I whip another axe.
Turn 39
Mathematics is discovered; I queue Masonry->Construction. The fifth axe is produced and the axes set off towards Celtic lands.
Turn 40
With the road now reaching to the edge of my cultural borders, I'm tell my worker to chop the patch of forest just outside -- I figure there's no point building a road in that patch of neutral land since the river crossing will remove any benefit of taking the road.
The army marches forth -- it looks like Khmer has founded two more cities, Angkor Thom on the copper we found west of earlier, and an unknown city perhaps NE of pigs, judging by the cultural borders.
Turn 41
War with Boudica!
Turn 42
Hammurabi comes asking for Open Borders, but I ask to negotiate then take it off the table. I think OB is considered 'trading' and Khmer considers Hammurabi his worst enemy... I negotiated/took it off the table b/c that supposedly doesn't piss them off as much as 'it ain't happening.'
The army continues to march, sticking to hills/forests as much as possible.
Turn 43
Looks like two archers in Bib.
Some quick math to figure out which promotion would be better...
Clicking on my axes and holding down alt tells me the archers are 6.45 strong (modified). This means that since all Boudica has is archers, we should go with anti-archery promotion, since that's 25% reduction to the defender in this case, more than the 20% from City Raider. Also, in MP games most stack battles do not take place at cities, so City Raider is less useful.
I promote Archery (Cover):
Now we see we have 5.5 v. 5.7 and I'm now confused, since 6.45/(1.25) = 5.16...
Taking a moment to re-read the Combat Mechanics thread....
Ah yes, I forgot in Civ, nothing is multiplicative -- everything is additive.
So that archer is really 6.45 = 3 * (1+0.5+0.4+0.25) by itself, but our anti-archery promotion makes the archer only 3 * (1 + 0.5 + 0.4 + 0.25 - 0.25).
What's our R ratio? A/D -- 5.5/5.7 = 0.964912281. A higher R ratio is better.
Note: we can check that a str promotion wouldn't have been better, as it would have been (5 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.1)) / 6.45, an R of 0.80620155. And city raider is clearly inferior because 20% is less than 25%.
Normally I wouldn't want to do all this math in MP, but I only recently really grasped the combat system in Civ4 and thus am doing this illustrate stuff that I hope will become second nature.
Turn 44
There are still only two archers.
Is it wise to attack with our stack of axemen?
I stumbled across this tip in a thread (though I don't remember which one):
I'm not sure how this was derived, and I'd prefer to figure out how to get a good stack v. stack estimate from the modified strengths, but this will do for now.
So we have 24 strength against us, and we're bringing 5 strength axemen = this means we need 24/5 ~= 5 axemen to take the city. So we should feel safe in attacking.
The moment of truth:
We've got it! The first two axemen died, but the city fell.
There's a second Celtic city out there, to the north -- by the bronze.
But fortunately it won't have time to hook it up.
I tell newly conquered Bibracte to produce a rax.
Turn 45
Back at home, I set my worker to cottage a grassland river tile, since Nidaros will hit size 6 in 5 turns. Once my other worker finishes chopping, I'll have him hook up Elephants which just got grabbed into my cultural borders.
Here's the battle front -- 1 warrior in Vienne, and an archer+warrior NW of it. Also a random worker building a road -- might be able to snag him next turn if he stays in range of my Axe.
Nidaros:
Bibracte:
And a high level view of the world. Of particular note is that Khmer founded Angkor Thom on Bronze, which is something we want to deny them when we're done with the Celts.
Diplomacy, which may be good to keep in mind -- of note, Monty is -1 already... and he's -4 with Justinian (we are upset you have fallen under the sway of a heathen religion)...
And something I noticed when I went in to get the Diplo ss... Hammurabi has decided to settle a city on the rice not far south...
--
That ends this round.
Comments/complaints/critiques/suggestions are all welcome
I must say, playing the game slowly like this and thinking through turns and discussing them is improving my game play quite a bit. Thank you to all the contributors thus far!
Some questions I have:
- Raze Vienne?
- Angkor Thom or Yasodunspellable first? Angkor does have bronze, which could be a problem.
- Any production changes? We'll have catas in 8 turns -- which makes me think we should get some catapults for Yasodunspellable, since it's cultural defense will be getting pretty high.
- Was my whipping appropriate? Was there anything I could have done better?
- Ivory will be hooked up soon as well -- worth detouring to HBR (horseback riding) for 'phants (elephants)?
Attached please find the save file.
but something occurred to me, what exactly do you gain by razing Vienna?
):
).
