Slower expansion

Hanny, thank you for your kindness. I am downloading it now and after the kid is in bed, i will try it out :) cheers

Your welcome, i already done something of this nature for my LOTR FFH mod, so it was no trouble at all.

I played the save twice to around 350 turns, ( just got to 3 or 4 citys each time, and AI was in the same order) i found the initial start to be poor, so went NE and settled there instead, to get the mana and rice resource and an oasis and river, this gave me a good start posistion for hammers so went for Godking and then to archery, what i found was that the first 120 or so turns i built warriors after i did a palisade when i had to dug in at the city.

Good posistions to expand lies east and then SE, and the goody huts were very kind both games to me.

Barb rush was very fierce and lost some units, but gained a lot of exp for those that survived, you cant build to may units!!, if you surve the Barb rush, the first AI`s you will have a problem with is the Devolio or Calabim.

Any problems let me know, and ill explain how to edit the files to tone down barbs, increae or decreae unit costs, whatever etc.

Btw i only changed Monarch and Marathorn to get what your after.
 
How about this idea:

1) you cant build settlers!
2) instead you have a counter like GP counter which increases in each city based on the population of the city (1 point per pop)
3) when it reach a threshold (just like the GP) it produces a settler
4) the counter then resets with a higher threshold and the process starts again
5) unhealthy cities and unhappy citizens also increase this "settler counter"

any thoughts on this idea chaps?

Exactly my thoughts, though I don't know ifits implementable. If it would scale with size etc, even better :)
 
Exactly my thoughts, though I don't know ifits implementable. If it would scale with size etc, even better :)

I suppose to scale it you would just need to change the thresholds used or the generation of settler points as a percentage of map size. Bigger map = higher % bonus.


I have been reading up on the forums regarding modding but i have to admit it is all a bit confusing. With two jobs, a wife and small child - dont have a lot of time but there is no hurry ;)
 
No settlers, mod Great People to be able to found cities (or convert to settlers inside a city, taking a population with them). Make a name generator for the cities when they are founded to reflect the name of the great person - Cultuumopolis, or Darkanusville.
 
Marnok was working on something that would allow huts and forts to generate culture (which I am still hoping to see and think is a very cool idea). What about using that with some of these ideas.

Settlers can not settle an area unless it is already under your control. Maybe they can't leave your borders at all unless on a boat. If you want to expand, you must build a fort or allow a village to grow your cultural border. The settler then comes in and can settle that land. Combine that with the larger distance between cities and you'd have less sprawl, more strategic placement of forts and borders and a slower expansion.

Standard problem - barbs wouldn't play well.
 
Yeah I'll put out my latest area control soonish, still got to get the basic mod out... It was just a slightly varied implementation of the starbase / claim flag code. What I am doing is, putting a list in the settings.py file in my modmod and any improvements on the list will generate culture if occupied and claimed. Anyway, point is, once I release it you can examine it and plunder the ideas for this mod, or, find the "claims flag" thread and get some idea there.
 
No settlers, mod Great People to be able to found cities (or convert to settlers inside a city, taking a population with them). Make a name generator for the cities when they are founded to reflect the name of the great person - Cultuumopolis, or Darkanusville.

Is this feature you are working on for your Mod Marnok?
 
Is this feature you are working on for your Mod Marnok?

It was just a random idea for this thread. I do like playing with no settlers though. For my modmod I'll probably do events where villages under your culture have a chance of promoting to cities. Maybe even forst/castles/citadels might attract enough settlements to become a city.
 
It was just a random idea for this thread. I do like playing with no settlers though. For my modmod I'll probably do events where villages under your culture have a chance of promoting to cities. Maybe even forst/castles/citadels might attract enough settlements to become a city.

I know this is probably not the right thread to ask but what software tools / editors do you use to modmod?
 
No settlers, mod Great People to be able to found cities (or convert to settlers inside a city, taking a population with them). Make a name generator for the cities when they are founded to reflect the name of the great person - Cultuumopolis, or Darkanusville.

I like that idea, it had not occured to me to use GP in that manner, from a fixed start you could then chose to have GP in a city, or more citys, i may tinker with this idea.

Another fairly easy fix is to make only capaitals able to create settlers by makeing capitals a building pre req for the settler unit of that civ, also make the capiatals bobuses better and you have a capaital that theb founding cities it produces, cannot match in pop size as they cannotget the same bounuses.
 
I like that idea, it had not occured to me to use GP in that manner, from a fixed start you could then chose to have GP in a city, or more citys, i may tinker with this idea.

Another fairly easy fix is to make only capaitals able to create settlers by makeing capitals a building pre req for the settler unit of that civ, also make the capiatals bobuses better and you have a capaital that theb founding cities it produces, cannot match in pop size as they cannotget the same bounuses.

Hanny been playing with thoes changes you made for me, would it be possible to run them in a pagea / small map please?

When you chaps say "easy fix" it makes me smile ;) . I opened up a the XML files in Fall Further and after spending a couple of hours trying to figure it all out, i though of my own "simple fix".

I would add <bRivalTerritoryBlock> 1<bRivalTerritoryBlock> into the settlers info to stop them from being able to enter neutral territory. Hey presto, nice simple fix that would only allow new cities within cultural border (or so i thought) but then as i started FF - i just got repeated error messages regarding schema's etc.

Any guides on how to mod for Civ 4 that you can recommend? as my programming skills are about 20 years out of date (pascal, 6502 and basic)
 
Hanny been playing with thoes changes you made for me, would it be possible to run them in a pagea / small map please?

Those files, after you swap them over for the unpacked FF2 ones, would be the default ones for any and all maps.

What maps do you prefer to play on?, as getting a map set up that you like is rather important, Ai never does well doing oversea invasions for instance.
For insatnce if you find you got a map you like and want to re use it, save it in WB. open up a game with the civs you want and options you want and save it in WB. Useing notepad, copy paste all the front end, civs and techs etc, from the one WB save, and paste it over the same info on the map you do like, this gives you the map you want with the civs you want.
When you chaps say "easy fix" it makes me smile ;) . I opened up a the XML files in Fall Further and after spending a couple of hours trying to figure it all out, i though of my own "simple fix".

Well its all relative, so a simple fix is anothers headache!!:) Im not a programer myself, rather an intrested observer of others who are.

I would add <bRivalTerritoryBlock> 1<bRivalTerritoryBlock> into the settlers info to stop them from being able to enter neutral territory. Hey presto, nice simple fix that would only allow new cities within cultural border (or so i thought) but then as i started FF - i just got repeated error messages regarding schema's etc.

Nothings as easy as it first appears!!. Even if you did solve it, what will you get?, settlers locked into your own borders that cant allow a city withinn 3 tiles, so you then change the number of layers of culture expantion to get around that problem, or you make forts give culture, and so on, butone of the principle points of citys is tom aquire access to a resource you really want, and if its already in your border why bother?.

Any guides on how to mod for Civ 4 that you can recommend? as my programming skills are about 20 years out of date (pascal, 6502 and basic)

I know what you mean, being a baby boomer myself i find keeping up with stuff gets harder each year, went back to college a few years back and was astounded how much Education teching methods had changed since i was at school.

Souce code is found here, to compare to what was to what now is and therfore see what changed to cause the new game function
http://63.236.94.185/2kgames/civ4/civ4SDK.php

There are a number of excellent tutorials to be found on the site, ( depending on what your looking to do) but that said, a lot of Civ is rather fickle to mod, and your now probably modding a mod, so for instance the two files i changed are linked, to what originaly controlled everything, but now Kael has changed it so that Barbs are unlimited in numbers and appear in regions, animals area seperate spawn. Or in short, those 2 files do much of what your after, but kael has also redifined a lot of the mechanics of it, so your probaly going to get more out of changing parameters that are provided, rather than getting down to code re writesto fully redefine it, which is what kael has done, to get it to target a civ.

Im currently building a LOTR map for the Dec release, ( massivly large, and with intent to have civs already settled and no more settlers with wide empty regions in between) one ive had since 0.21 and updated with each release, and since its bare of lairs/goblin forts etc, you can see how many barbs and where they spawn and where they goto very easily, which is another way of seeing what effects the changes have had without looking at code. So, haveing rage barbs doubles the number spawned, changing the game speed paremters changes what turn numbers they first appear, changing the game difficulty, numbers of unssen tiles etc, spawns more of them, and lastly lair spawn number increases lair spawn rate.

Forgot to mention, in the game diff file there is a global Ai unit build value, if you halve it, builds twice as quick as half the hammers are now required, asa broadsword, this value can be usfull for cahnging the unit density in game.
 
I kept thinking that maybe it should be impossible to found Cities on certain kinds of terrain until you research technologies. Like, you can't cut down a jungle until Sanitation (I think), so why should you be able to build a city in one?

For extra flavour, various civs could circumvent the usual limits as a feature - say, the Clan of Embers CAN found jungle cities right form the start. Thius would have the side effect of encouraging civs to gravitate toward the terrain associated with their theme.

Another mechanism might be Kuriotates-style hard limits on how many cities one may build, which can be raised by researching techs.

If that seems too limiting, how about making the "number of cities" maintenance costs more punishing? And again, researching a tec could permanently reduce it.
 
Been pondering this settlerish GPs idea, to settle a city is a spell like any other if i remember correctly so it should just be a simple case of copy/paste in some of the XMLs right? Offcourse, getting the AI to understand how to found cities and prioritise GPs would be a whole different matter, one out of my league I'm afraid. But I'll tinker some with the XMLs when i get home for sure.

I've been playing with no settlers and barbarian world some, but since 0.34 I find the "barbarian hordes" to be quite boring actually. Their challenging to a point, but after that they become less of a threat and more of a major annoyance. So I really hope something can come out of this discussion :)

Another mechanism might be Kuriotates-style hard limits on how many cities one may build, which can be raised by researching techs.

anyone knows where this function is located, and if it can be simply copy/pasted to all civs? would work for me, in the short term :)
 
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