1. We have added the ability to collapse/expand forum categories and widgets on forum home.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. All Civ avatars are brought back and available for selection in the Avatar Gallery! There are 945 avatars total.
    Dismiss Notice
  3. To make the site more secure, we have installed SSL certificates and enabled HTTPS for both the main site and forums.
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Civ6 is released! Order now! (Amazon US | Amazon UK | Amazon CA | Amazon DE | Amazon FR)
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Dismiss Notice
  6. Forum account upgrades are available for ad-free browsing.
    Dismiss Notice

Small but decisive balance changes you'd like to see for R&F

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by Tomice, Jan 11, 2018.

  1. drubell

    drubell Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2010
    Messages:
    431
    My experience is that a unit goes obsolete after about 1.5 Eras, but I can concede that maybe 4 units could be okay, but light cavalry needs to have more than 3. Horsemen not having an upgrade until Industrial is very frustrating.
     
    Japper007 and SammyKhalifa like this.
  2. Stringer1313

    Stringer1313 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    632
    Shockingly, I agree with like 95% of the suggestions on here. These are all changes that could be very quick to make but have significant impact. I also love the Eureka idea making it apply only to the first half. I am a casual player and only discovered that trick very recently; it does feel very gamey and not right.

    I don't like how quickly UUs became obsolete in past Civs, and I like how much lasting value they have so I'm wary about adding units per line. Having said that, it does feel ridiculous not having a unit between Pikeman and AT bazooka whatever (which expansion is providing), between horseman and calvary, and between knight and tank. I appreciate what they tried to do by distinguishing light and heavy calvary but it creates odd situations having so few units between them. The most natural thing to do is to merge the two, but then we lose the two different promotional trees. I dunno.

    Also, I'd be OK with helicopters traversing shallow water but not ocean :) No one flies helicopters across the ocean (DO THEY?!?!)
     
  3. Trengilly

    Trengilly Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2017
    Messages:
    209
    Location:
    California
    I'd quite like the Eureka boosts to be randomized - say a range between 30% to 50%. Then you can't plan exactly how much of the tech you need to research ahead of time. I'd also love for there to be 2 or 3 different eureka's for each tech - and these would be different (random) each game.
     
  4. steveg700

    steveg700 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    2,260
    We need a policy to give a discount to siege units. This seems like a major blind spot that becomes REALLY apparent if you play Khmer. 220 hammers, no discount possible.

    Where's the outrage, peeps?

    Seems to fly in the face of the thread's parameters. :)

    Ranged need an information era upgrade, instead of topping out at machine gun.

    No idea what you'd call that unit (sniper team?), but players should not be punished at the late game for the fact that ranged units rule in the early game.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2018
  5. UWHabs

    UWHabs Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2008
    Messages:
    2,978
    Location:
    Toronto
    One thing I thought might be a cool change to eurekas would be that instead of just giving a flat 50% of the tech, it would instead double your science while researching the tech. So if you get the boost before starting, it would still effectively give you the full 50% bonus, but you can't half-research a tech waiting for the boost to finish it. You'd have to search out the boosts well before you could research the tech to get a maximal benefit.
     
    Thormodr and Stringer1313 like this.
  6. darkace77450

    darkace77450 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Messages:
    546
    It's probably not the answer most of us want, but fighters are supposed to be the late game ranged units.
     
    steveg700 likes this.
  7. Hammurabbit

    Hammurabbit Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 9, 2017
    Messages:
    70
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Sweden
    Agree with this. It's ok when you have a couple of slots, but in later game, it's quite tedious. I think they could be fixed though by tweaking the UI and the workflow.
     
  8. Aussie_Lurker

    Aussie_Lurker Warlord

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2003
    Messages:
    7,403
    Location:
    Adelaide, South Australia
    Massively disliked Civ 5's Social Policy System......was a massive backwards step after Civ 4's civics. Civ 6, IMHO, gives us the best of 4 & 5, whilst scrapping the bad.
     
  9. steveg700

    steveg700 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    2,260
    Hey, I can live with that. Just give me an upgrade that turns my machine guns into a fighter. I'd be happy to slot a card to do it.

    Maybe stretches the premise a bit, but.....

    Provide a dialogue option under the Discuss diplomacy screen "What can I do to improve our relationship?", and the AI civ will respond by saying that they would respond seeking a gift of gold or resources, a treaty, a diplomatic promise, a denouncement of another cvi, etc. Or they just tell us to kick rocks.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2018
  10. mitsho

    mitsho Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2003
    Messages:
    6,421
    Location:
    Europe, more or less
    Make Deserts and Snow Tiles cost 2 movement points. It should be difficult to cross the desert. Give discount to certain unique units.

    A lot of my other ideas would reduce micro-management or just improve the ui so that you need less clicks, but those suggestions are not necessarily liked inhere. ;-)
     
  11. Pythakoreas

    Pythakoreas Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2013
    Messages:
    458
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Canada
    How about receiving attrition damage instead?
     
    steveg700 and Thormodr like this.
  12. Haggbart

    Haggbart Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2010
    Messages:
    795
    Location:
    Norway

    Not only do I not agree, I'd even say that a lot of eurekas/inspirations are sub-optimal in a whole lot of cases. So I'd argue people will play more diversely because of the eurekas, simply because there will be a divide between people who want to play more optimal, and people who want to max out on the eurekas (of course, there are some that are pretty standard and you want to hit every time, but far from all of them).
     
    Japper007 likes this.
  13. Trengilly

    Trengilly Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2017
    Messages:
    209
    Location:
    California
    Flat 100 gold gift - works every time.
     
    Aussie_Lurker likes this.
  14. steveg700

    steveg700 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    2,260
    I also would want the AI to avail itself of any options the player gets. That's why I don't gift. To my knowledge, the AI can't/won't.

    Upon sighting an enemy, units doing multi-turn movement do a hard STOP.

    Units doing multi-turn movement will not travel around the world to get to a destination just because something is momentarily blocking their route. If there's a differential of more than a few turns from the previous turn, they do a hard STOP.

    How about some kind of visual indicator that a player has reached the halfway-point in unlock a tech or civic?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 12, 2018
  15. Phoenix1595

    Phoenix1595 Lord of the Two Lands

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2005
    Messages:
    686
    You posted this before today's Let's Play stream, so excuse me if you heard this today, but the designers did say that the governor system is meant to be a throwback to Civ5's permanent social policy trees, in a way. Maybe not exactly what you were anticipating, but they do know that some players missed the permanancy of selecting certain buffs to last forever, and the governor trees are an homage to this.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
    Thormodr likes this.
  16. clapyourhands

    clapyourhands Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2017
    Messages:
    306
    Gender:
    Male
    1. A balance pass for pantheons / beliefs. The best pantheons are, unsurprisingly, always the best ones. I get that because many of them are resource-based it's difficult to balance them since many of them are situationally powerful, but the strongest ones that don't have conditional terrain/resource requirements could be toned down a bit. Ideally the nonconditionals would be reliable if you don't have many of any one resource/terrain, but at the moment unless you have obscene amounts of luxuries or some other resource the respective pantheons are lackluster.

    2. Harder Eurekas/Inspirations. As many have said, they're a bit too easy to obtain through normal play. They could be strengthened to compensate, but they should not be easy enough to obtain as a side-project while focusing something else; rather, they should be something along the way of whatever you're already focusing. Founding a coastal city for sailing is a good one; you might not aim for that Eureka unless you already want a coastal city or are planning one in the near future.

    3. Related to above, slower science overall. Even the AI on prince is reaching the modern era hundreds of years early--alternatively, if the science rate is too drastic to change, just adjust the pace of the in-game years. I can accept faster science to speed up gameplay, but the year counter should at least match up roughly with tech eras at lower levels of play; it's simple, but helps a lot with flavor and immersion.

    4. Chopping nerf. I personally have never chopped woods for production in any game of Civ VI, but I don't want the feature to go away because it makes sense from a historical perspective. Gameplay-wise though, it's currently incredibly strong and only looks to be getting stronger in VI with the governor that boosts it. It could use some tweaking.

    5. District adjustments. CHs and Harbors were at least looked at already, but Theater Squares could use some touching up as well; they do fine for holding Great Works but a bit more leniency with adjacency bonuses would make them more viable early game. More variability in district choice is nice for gameplay, and flavorwise once your discover Drama and Poetry and the like it does make sense that you'd at least have a few TSs. IZs could be boosted a hair too, but overall they're alright in the later game.

    6. Trade routes giving something to the receiving city. It doesn't have to be huge, but at the moment making your cities ideal for trade routes isn't very rewarding. You get roads to travel on and traders to pillage, but even then those same roads could be used to go into your city. There's also the fact that other civs are somewhat economically reliant on you if you're a main trade destination, but that's an indirect bonus that doesn't feel like much during actual gameplay. Even something superficial like a bit of gold at least presents something tangible to say "this city is the heart of trade".

    7. AI adjustments. There are a lot of tiny things that added together make it leave a far worst taste in the mouth than it should. Most glaringly, joint wars should be looked at so that they make a bit more sense on the player's side. Sure, behind the scenes your ally may have been offered enough to declare war against you, but that doesn't stop it from feeling unwarranted and arbitrary. Less nagging with deals that you've already declined would be nice too.

    8. The ability to ask an ally to declare war once you've been declared war on. Seriously, I'm not sure how this isn't already an option. This might be the military alliance in RnF, hopefully.

    9. UI changes. Not much to say that hasn't been said already. They're not really balance changes, but they improve QoL enough to be a top priority, IMO.

    10. Auto-selecting the search bar when opening the Civilopedia. Please. I know it's technically also a UI change but I really just want to emphasize this thing especially. 99% of the time when you open the Civilopedia, you're not just planning on staring at the welcome page.

    I really like Civ VI's new ideas and gameplay, and am hoping that RnF polishes up the implementations of these ideas and improves on the lackluster aspects of gameplay. Fingers crossed.
     
  17. Tomice

    Tomice Passionate Smart-Ass

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2009
    Messages:
    2,173
    Location:
    Austria, EU, no kangaroos ;)
    Oh, I forgot: A terra mapscript, please!
     
    Japper007 likes this.
  18. Wielki Hegemon

    Wielki Hegemon Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 27, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Location:
    Warsaw
    You mean THAT small?

    (Sorry couldn't resist :lol:)
     
    Thormodr and ChocolateShake like this.
  19. Starwars

    Starwars Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2017
    Messages:
    48
    1) Even with the recent Religion changes, I still feel like Religion needs to be buffed overall, or changed. Probably both

    I think I'm still in favor of letting everyone in the game found a Religion. Even though it's a lot easier to get one now, it's still a significant investment at the start of the game for something that may not pay off at all. And even if you *do* get a Religion, it still feels way more efficient to just skip it in exchange for building other things. The whole Religious victory still feels so... narrow to me, it doesn't quite fit into the game very well. Feels more like this weird off-shoot victory rather than a "natural" way to play the game.

    2) Give something back for failed wonders. Some cash or whatever would be nice but it just feels bad to see all those turns completely wasted. Risk and reward, yes, but... something.

    3) I would like to see Tourism tied into the rest of the game in a meaningful way. Perhaps affecting the loyalty of cities or whatever.
     
    Japper007 likes this.
  20. Synth

    Synth Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2013
    Messages:
    120
    I'd like to see movement rules reverted to what they were in 5. Will never happen, though.

    I'd rather see wonders boosted. I like the idea of losing your production if you lose the wonder race, but I feel like the wonders in Civ 6 are not really that powerful. In fact, I barely build wonders, it's just not usually worth it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018

Share This Page