Something I miss

[sav]

Something I miss from the older versions of Civ - maybe even just the first two - is how the leaders used to change their setting and clothing over time.

Meeting Washington in 3500BC dressed how he is takes a bit of the immersive experience away - not to mention how hilarious I always thought it was seeing leaders like Genghis and Alexander dressed up in suits (I could be remembering that wrong..)

I know it would probably cost a fortune to make new graphics in 3D and everything, but it would add so much, without taking anything away or annoying anyone. Would it?

 

[Vidszhite]

Something I miss from the older versions of Civ - maybe even just the first two - is how the leaders used to change their setting and clothing over time.

Meeting Washington in 3500BC dressed how he is takes a bit of the immersive experience away - not to mention how hilarious I always thought it was seeing leaders like Genghis and Alexander dressed up in suits (I could be remembering that wrong..)

I know it would probably cost a fortune to make new graphics in 3D and everything, but it would add so much, without taking anything away or annoying anyone. Would it?

But that's just it--it would cost a fortune and doesn't really add any new gameplay elements. Remember, in Civ 3 when they did it, the picture was very tiny and cropped, so that you could basically only see their face or parts of their face. What we have in civ 5 is a fully animated scene, with unique intro scenes. If they did this, they would have to make new animations for all the eras in the game, including intro scenes for all the eras. This would not only cost a fortune, it would vastly raise the costs of adding new civs to the game in the future, which we do not want.

 

[sav]

But that's just it--it would cost a fortune and doesn't really add any new gameplay elements. Remember, in Civ 3 when they did it, the picture was very tiny and cropped, so that you could basically only see their face or parts of their face. What we have in civ 5 is a fully animated scene, with unique intro scenes. If they did this, they would have to make new animations for all the eras in the game, including intro scenes for all the eras. This would not only cost a fortune, it would vastly raise the costs of adding new civs to the game in the future, which we do not want.

Couldn't they just change the clothes and keep the animations? Obviously I know nothing of 3D programming...

 

[Stellarnight]

If i am not wrong, the clothes have to be animated as well as it is very unlikely that an ancient clothing style have the same shape and form as say modern clothing. Too much work for something that probably only a minority would appreciate. For me, it would be a nice addition but not essential. Rather they use that animation juice on more leaders

 

[Vidszhite]

Couldn't they just change the clothes and keep the animations? Obviously I know nothing of 3D programming...

The scenes are designed with a particular aesthetic in mind. If all you change is the clothes, it will clash with the entire rest of the scene. Can you imagine Hiawatha standing in the forest, wearing a suit? It would look ridiculous.

 

[sav]

The scenes are designed with a particular aesthetic in mind. If all you change is the clothes, it will clash with the entire rest of the scene. Can you imagine Hiawatha standing in the forest, wearing a suit? It would look ridiculous.

Haha, or Pacahuti... or Kamehameha

 

[Shimmler]

Haha, or Pacahuti... or Kamehameha

I just imagined Monty near sacrificial altar wearing European Renaissance clothing.

 

[Tagma]

I suppose that's the trade-off then: simple scenes that change with the era, or complex scenes that stay the same through the whole game.
On a side note, I wonder what leader scenes Civ 6 will have- I like the thought of Julius Caesar in a crowded senate, or Napoleon standing in front of thousands of soldiers...

 

[Zenstrive]

Or you can simply say that in their civilization, that is how they put on their clothes.
Remember, in parallel universes, the norm that all "modern people wear suits to official setting" is not a must.

 

[Greizer85]

Imo the Civ III leader pics were the perfect compromise between economy (computer resorces,ease of making new ones) and aesthetics (added immersion,visible attitudes). One of the few things Civ III did right. As for Civ V, I've never once listened to what the various leaders say; oh how badloy I wish the resources they squandered on those comp-friers would've been spent on the combat AI instead.

 

[EK834]

But that's just it--it would cost a fortune and doesn't really add any new gameplay elements.

Cost a fortune? Not in 2013, it's a myth. Having 7 sets of backgrounds and clothing/hair for each civ (the basic model, attitudes, voice overs would be re-used) woudn't have much of an impact on the game's budget - not for a game on the scale of Civ (and there's a reason why selling extra outfits and furnitures are literally a cash-cow for franchises like The Sims...) Other considerations might come into play, such as media space. What is costly regarding civs is all the work involved in developing them in terms of game play and incorporating extra civilizations in the existing game, making sure they're balanced etc. Artwork costs are really negligible in comparison - 3D costs a fraction of what it used to cost nowadays, especially in gaming where the artists are on salary at the developers.

 

[Dralix]

I don't know about costing a fortune, but in my opinion, it will cost more than it's worth in terms of value add.

 

[El Caballerion]

I think they should just do away with the whole 3D rendered leaders. They're exciting perhaps the first 2 times you interact with them, and then become dull. Plus, they take too much time to load and sometimes crash my computer. Because of this, I leave my Leaderscreen graphic settings at MINIMAL.

I would prefer really stylized drawings of them wearing outfits that match their respective eras. Then, they can cut out the countless dollars spent on these worthless leader screens and use them to make the AI more efficient.

 

[Ninakoru]

I think that should not be a great investment, but I prefer as it is now, less immersive, yeah, but Monty in suit is just ridiculous.

 

[EK834]

Then, they can cut out the countless dollars spent on these worthless leader screens and use them to make the AI more efficient.

That really wouldn't get them very far. With today's technology and its low price the difference between creating illustrations in 2D or creating the kind of basic 3D animations over backgrounds they've put in Civ 5 is not big (especially considering the research/art direction costs would be the same in the two cases). That wouldn't buy the programmers and developers enough extra days of work to make any difference.

 

[Aaron90495]

That really wouldn't get them very far. With today's technology and its low price the difference between creating illustrations in 2D or creating the kind of basic 3D animations over backgrounds they've put in Civ 5 is not big (especially considering the research/art direction costs would be the same in the two cases). That wouldn't buy the programmers and developers enough extra days of work to make any difference.

Actually, I'm pretty sure one of the devs himself said that leader scenes take by far the most work of anything. (IIRC, Beach or Shirk said on PolyCast that it takes a month to fully produce leader scene.) So yes, despite how it appears, it really takes a lot of resources to make them.

That said, I like them and would rather have them than leaders who look meh and change each age.

 

[Callonia]

I think they should just do away with the whole 3D rendered leaders. They're exciting perhaps the first 2 times you interact with them, and then become dull. Plus, they take too much time to load and sometimes crash my computer. Because of this, I leave my Leaderscreen graphic settings at MINIMAL.

I would prefer really stylized drawings of them wearing outfits that match their respective eras. Then, they can cut out the countless dollars spent on these worthless leader screens and use them to make the AI more efficient.

Solution: Stop playing on the toaster from 1999 you have and buy a new pc.

 

[EK834]

Actually, I'm pretty sure one of the devs himself said that leader scenes take by far the most work of anything. (IIRC, Beach or Shirk said on PolyCast that it takes a month to fully produce leader scene.) So yes, despite how it appears, it really takes a lot of resources to make them.

That said, I like them and would rather have them than leaders who look meh and change each age.

As someone who's worked as CG artist for decades I have to say this must be misleading. Yeah, for sure adding a new leader, researching and making the concepts for the visuals (a large part of the work), producing everything from scratch including voice over work/mixing. the compositing work to integrate the 3D elements in the 2D digital paintings all the way to final integration in the game probably indeed takes a month. The 3D work itself isn't the biggest part of that, though. There's probably a full week of work going just into that (a few thousand dollars). Rendering the same models and scenes with different clothing designed for each era (especially since they wouldn't do that, they'd have about 3-4 each), wouldn't be that expensive in itself, though now after 2 expansions and plenty of DLC Civs added and the game not ready to just take this all in, it sure would be an undertaking, requiring additional programming, personel not currently working on the game etc. - and people wouldn't want to pay for an expensive DLC just to get era-based clothing for the game. But if they decided to start like this for Civ 6, it wouldn't be that much more expensive than having a single version of the leaders.

 

[El Caballerion]

Solution: Stop playing on the toaster from 1999 you have and buy a new pc.

Never. On what other device can I simultaneously heat up bread AND play CIV slowly???