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Spectral Sequences I: LeftAdjoint's Immortal Shadow

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by LeftAdjoint, Jun 22, 2011.

  1. ben-jammin

    ben-jammin Emperor

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    Wow for some reason or another between the pyramids and the huge happy cap and the diplo situation, this might be the easiest immortal game I've ever played.
     
  2. MarigoldRan

    MarigoldRan WARLORD

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    Get two chariots first and own your potentially unpleasant neighbor. Small investment, excellent return.

    Then decide between Wonders or HA rushing. Both are fine. Depends on style.
     
  3. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Radio silence on my question so I'll just assume that means "shut up and play the game". :)

    Spoiler :
    Here's the new plan:



    I really like the floodplains site but there is no good way to produce a monument there quickly. I would be forced to get bronze working very quickly and awkwardly. So for now, I'm expanding to the juicier NW, with two good tiles in the first ring. There's just enough time to get my warrior up there.

    I'm not 100% set on a rush, but writing seems like a versatile tech choice at this point. If I need to pick up horseback riding, a settled scientist can do that. It will also make some of the more expensive techs, e.g. bronze working, seem less daunting.

    Paris finishes the warrior it grew on earlier, and grows to size 5 on two chariots:





    Lyons is founded:



    Getting our rush on: (it's looking like more of an amble, but our production capacity will be high so I'm not so concerned)



    And, production begins:



    Yes, it's pretty late to get started, but I think it makes sense to take advantage of the decent sites and high happy cap. I stopped by pottery for granaries because every city will benefit from some whipping, and Lyons is nearly useless without it.

    Nobody is very happy with Stalin so I should be able to help myself to his land without consequence. Hopefully he'll make the pyramids sometime soon. :)

    Incidentally, Tours is positioned to borrow mines from the capital, so that Paris doesn't feel too bad about whipping and regrowing on farms.
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Berkobob

    Berkobob Warlord

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    Hi Left - I neglected to answer your question, sorry!

    I would have teched writing (library to get research going) --> HBR (start building stables in 2 main prod cities) --> archery (to get HA's started) --> pottery (to get cottages online for eventual recovery phase).

    However as you have gone a bit further - a few queries I had with your game. Posting these more to learn myself rather than try to knock you down, I appreciate the time and effort it takes to post your game on the forums!

    1 - are we planning to chop and whip HAs? Our capital is at health cap and needs worker turns to hook up agri resources once we start chopping forests. I think too many farms built in Lyons, could have used those turns to road all our resources.

    As a side note I think you will need to go really heavy on chops and whips to get enough HA for the war??

    2 - why did we settle tours now? Just to work gold tile? As we are going for HA rush would it have been better to use those hammers for extra HA's and save a bit more on maintenance?

    3 - GS in three turns - what is plan for him? I see no immediate use, he will bulb math, we dont have the $$ to build an academy and research at 100%, settling is best option at this stage IMO. Would it have been better to delay the first GS (or generate from say Lyons (which has poor hammers/food) and focus Paris on hammers to get HA war started faster?

    4 - we are two techs from Currency and have 5 cities - once we start warring how do we pay for city/unit upkeep? are we going to raze all of Stalin's cities? Other option I can see is to research math and bulb alpha with GS to get to currency faster?

    I quite like the look of this map, so I might play my shadow to the same date as your game. If you prefer shadows left out please PM or post in this thread and I will withhold until your game is done :)
     
  5. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Good point about health. Yes, I'm planning on leaning heavily on production to catch up to where the rush would be if I had gone with fewer techs and fewer cities. You're right that there may be a very slight shortage of worker turns. In particular, I may not realize my dream of building farms in the capital to assist with whipping.

    Also a good point. Tours will not contribute much until the fish is online, but the rush will be mostly over by then! I lost a couple of turns on archery by accidentally turning scientists off for a bit, and ended up with extra hammers around. But I see now that the city is really not urgent.

    The GS should have come a little earlier, and then settling would have also allowed for faster HBR+archery. Generating from Lyons is a good idea. I think I tend to build my first library in the capital by instinct, not strategy.

    Why not bulb math and research currency? In any case, I suspect that the slider will have to go to 0 after fishing, and for some time, so I'll probably settle the GS and try to stabilize the economy before currency. The gold and seafood will help us, and transitioning the capital into cottages is probably a good move. The cash from conquest should prevent economic collapse, with some planning.

    I do plan to explore Stalin's territory with chariots to come up with a plan. Hopefully he only has one source of metal. I will certainly raze any city that I don't think I can support.

    Go ahead and post whatever, with spoiler tags of course. :)
     
  6. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Next session.


    In some of the screens, you may notice me building a palace. This is because of an interface bug plus the fact that I click too fast when building wealth. :) A bad habit I'm trying to correct...

    Spoiler :
    IMG]http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee401/LeftAdjoint/Tradin0000.jpg[/IMG]



    Good news! He has only one source of metal! (though later, much to my dismay, he trades for iron from Willem)



    First, the capital.



    I tech to currency:





    I took peace for some tech, the screen shot didn't get written for some reason though.

    And finally:



    At about the same time, I've gotten civil service. Here's the tech picture:



    The game is looking great. I still have a shot at The Great Library and liberalism, but I've got a superior number of cities and a good bureaucracy capital. (I haven't switched, but I probably will on this turn, and also into Judaism)

    I should take the barbarian cities soon so nobody else gets them, followed by expansions in the northeast to take the whale, deer, and fur.

    There's only one teensy little problem:



    It's probably me. I'm not too worried, as I can be at feudalism in half a dozen turns if I want, but it could require some planning.

    Any thoughts? You can easily find some mistakes, I'm sure. :)

     

    Attached Files:

  7. MarigoldRan

    MarigoldRan WARLORD

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    This is a little late, but it is possible to go for the Oracle in a HA rush. The idea is to Oracle HBR. AZ and Obsolete have discussed this, along with Yanner, in his Diety game with Genghis Khan, though I think for the most part they try to avoid it for obvious reasons.

    I saw the map too. It made some sense, the reason being that the surrounding land is so bad there was no point in building a second city.

    Edit: I think a really important part of civ IV is picking your fights and knowing what to go for. All good players do this. Don't you agree?
     
  8. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    I'm not sure I see the point of doing a 1-city horse archer rush.

    You may want to look up how to spell "diety". Unless it's a mod where you eat salads.
     
  9. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Gave this one a quick spin today, went the long-route...

    Spoiler :


    Doesn't feel like immortal at all, something more like settler.
     
  10. Mylene

    Mylene Deity

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    Doing this too atm to take a break from all the Deity stuff, good lord this must be the easiest starting area i ever played. Seriously, there is no need to even stop a second to think where to settle or what to do next oO
     
  11. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Fortunately I've posted more than one blatant fail-game in the past, so hopefully I have some credibility when I say that I picked this one at random. :D

    Or maybe I did accidentally set it to settler...
     
  12. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Alright, I'll try a second run this time... but go for a quicker rush type style and see what happens...
     
  13. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Well, that was a little... too easy again.

    Knocked out one leader asap.. then took out the other while I left just one city so I could extort stuff, ahah. And after chewing off the front door of the third leader, while still using my HA's, I decided to retire from the game.

    Spoiler :
     
  14. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Well, the Joao situation was more serious than I realized. He will declare in two turns.

    The loss of my eastern city is guaranteed, and then it will be a tough war. I think the right move here is to trade for monarchy, then research feudalism, but I may lose multiple cities before longbows.

    I think the game is still winnable, as I can stay competitive in city count, and later capture the two western barbarian cities. (and make cities in the north, one just for the fur)

    I'm a bit discouraged from continuing this game without some input on the position, and whether I completely botched my "rush", but I'll start another game soon that will hopefully be more fun for the readers. :)
     
  15. Gumbolt

    Gumbolt Phoenix Rising

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    Yep JoaII looks like he is in war mode!!! I think you will probably need to draw a line of defence. if he has a big stack you have no real force to hold him back.

    You need to whip a few units and a city wall maybe? Pends what he throws at you. In any case he will only be taking recently captured small cities at best.


    Oh that stone/fish/ gold city really does suck!! :lol:
     
  16. GenerallyGreat

    GenerallyGreat Prince

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    I did a really fun HA rush from just my capital in my last immortal game. Granted I chose unrestricted leaders for Hannibal/Mongols and had a very nice capital. Peter gave me 7 cities that I used to whip out enough extra HA's to take out another civ and seal the win. First game I can remember that I never built a single settler. :D
     
  17. GenerallyGreat

    GenerallyGreat Prince

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    I gave this one a go and it turns out I built the same second and third cities as the OP although in different order. I didn't need to get the horse city up quick as I had cultured the horse by building stonehenge in quick time. I kinda got distracted and didn't even build a stone city until about 700AD. :)

    Spoiler :
    I HA rushed Stalin and killed him then teched to MT and vassaled Egypt around 1250 AD. Jao was a pain as he bee-lined rifles so it took a bit of a slog to kill him off. I was concerned about making the domination limit so I'd planned to outright kill him and the Dutch. I'm not used to normal speed so a lot of my timing was out of kilter and WVO got to Infantry and I hadn't bothered teching to flight. In the end I decided to go planes and tanks to finish him off and did so at 1840AD. Unfortunetely that only got me to 62% of the land limit and I couldn't be bothered building a navy so I turned up culture and had to hit enter for 60 years to get the win. :lol:
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  18. LeftAdjoint

    LeftAdjoint Warlord

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    Probably going to abandon this one. The position is certainly winnable, but it's awkward, and my city management has improved so much lately that I'm very annoyed at how I left my empire, and the slowness of my "rush". :)

    Not like there's been a huge amount of interest anyway. I'll try to make current and future games a bit more viewer-friendly.
     
  19. kossin

    kossin Deity

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    Don't worry too much about replies, look at number of viewers to gauge interest.
     
  20. obsolete

    obsolete Deity

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    Come on Lefty, we don't want to see any more Immortal FAIL threads this week. And remember, Quitters Never Win! :p
     

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