Speculation on enemy AI's. {Long}

[anton_z1]

Wow i love this descriptions.
However some comments.

Washington: is a pain if starting in right location. He exapnds like crazy. (Has more cities then anybody. Also he keeps his military very up to date. Taking his cities is a pain in the ass.

Monte ... I love this guy. He is so, so dumb, that i use him to promote my units and then use these promoted units to crush his empire.

Tokugawa ... You are 100% right. This guy is the most ******ed civilization of all. Bless god if he is next to you since you can easily Langrab Him. Did i said he never have iron .

Huayna Capac: try immortal with him. He will scrap your whole game. His early rush with chariots (moving on jungle) and his UU will slow you down like hell.

Ghenghis Khan. Another blessed opponent. Loves to attack spearmen with Keshniks . Declare war to him. This is the best way to Upgrade your units.

FRD : Had him once. one word BAD AI.

Ghandi: I totally agree with the review. Tis guy manages to be top in tech even having the worst cities in the world.

Napoleon is maybe not a good warmonger, but he is the second biggest opportunist in the game (After alexander ). Will attack you when you are unprepared. Also watch out for navy. This guy had build up over 40 destroyers and battleships on a standart map!!!! (luckily he put them in his cities )

Also Ai do shop trees if his name is not Ghenghis or Tokugawa .

 

[Jass]

Nice write-up!

I have to agree about Tokugawa being a lousy AI. But I disagree about his traits being weak. Organized is (for me) the best trait in combination with aggressive. You can afford a big army and it gives you the opportunity to capture cities and not have to worry about the finance. And you can afford more production improvements instead of cottages around your cities. The only thing left to worry about is the culture flip from newly conquered borders. But by then you should be invading the next line of cities.

Cyrus is in a lot of my games as well. And Montezuma is a crazy crazy voodoo person.

 

[spiceant]

on a huge emperor difficulty game on continents i started with alexander julias caesar and montezuma. frederick covering my eastern border and julias my north, before AD hits alexander comes.
alexander was the first as he came knocking my door with 5 units, 2phalanxes 1 archer 1 chariot and an axeman as i had just build my 2nd expansion from the other side of germany, this was BC.
some turns later julias caesar moves a settler to my razed 3rd expand, i am forced to declare war so he doesnt use it and so i get a free worker, even more turns later i have made peace with julias and then montezuma whom barely knows me declares war out of nowhere! (we werent even neighbours, he was on the other side of germany). ofcourse i made peace with julias, and as the 10 turn timer expires he declares war again!! i cant blaim it on my military status as i havent lost any citys after that first one to alexander.
**** i hate starting with all of the 3 agressive civs that declare war before 200 AD, the 4 of us are now at the bottom of the scores, with julias being the lowest (huge game).

 

[Dairuka]

I'd like to update that I've noticed a pattern with Montezuma.

He likes to declare war on you around the same time you're researching steel, while beelining for Railroad.

Even if you're fully prepared for him, and capable of destroying his entire army in the process, he'll still charge for your weakest defended city and throw everything he has got you. He only does it when hes Furious at you though. {Which is all the freaking time...}

Whats weird is. He ALWAYS does this when you're researching Steel. This is the 7th time hes done this to me.

 

[AmnesiaA]

The only time I ever had FDR, which was only once, he was the smallest civilization in the game in the amount of cities he had, but was a heavy builder. He formed a bunch of super cities and then went on to win the space race victory. He also managed to form a great defensive military so AI wars with him did little but slow him down a bit. In the end he wasn't a warmonger, was usually in good relations with me and the AI, traded a lot, and even formed a defensive pack with me. A GREAT peaceful AI who makes super cities an obsession. He ranked up there with Gandhi and Musa for me.

(On another note, the one game I had catherine, she spread all over the pangea map like an ugly virus, and split the entire continent in half. It really pissed me off. Luckily her long and thin nation slowly got eaten up by expanding culture borders on both sides by the AI and me, and this made it easy for her to lose.)

 

[BruceLeeee]

My easiest monarch game had a pleased to friendly with caesar whole game. My advice is to let him infest with his religion. Then make him beat up 2 weak civs. I was free to super tech without military to a 1920 space victory.

 

[Pie-es-Tasty]

I totally disagree on Washington. In my game he very nearly beat me to the space race (I was Gandhi no less) and I had to declare war on him and drag it out til I just managed to snag the space ship (I had marines; he had mech. infantry). Also Mao was a late game super power in one game. He beat me to every late game wonder and finished most of his space ship before I even built the Apollo Program.

As for Isabella, oooh I hate her. She's really pushy, always trying to get you do stuff you don't want to, but of course I didn't start next to her so I didn't get to box her in. And Monte, I hate him too. I once met him and only had one relationship modifier: "+1 Years of peace have strenghened our relationship", and he was still annoyed with me!

Tokogawa invaded me once, with a huge force when I was off fighting egypt (At Monte's request) and took a city I had won from the egyptians. Eventually I beat back his forces, pillaged his land til there was nothing left and captured Edo, but he really caught me by suprise.

I was once playing against Napoleon and Louis XIV at the same time and they managed a tag team thing; Louis declared, and while I was off fighting him, Napoleon snuck around back and captured my only source of iron! It took me a long time to get it back too.

 

[baptiste]

About Julius Cesar.

After being annoyed on european maps always fighting him, since a few games i tried a new approach.

If Cesar is you usual hell, force him to respect and befriend, totally, with him. He is a great ally.

Religion or gifts won't be enough, be a limitary ally, by accepting to go on war at his side. At this point, he will become a REAL friend. And a precious one, able to declare war on some ennemies if they attack you, even without defensive pact.

If both Cesar and Alexander are in the game, crush Alexander using Cesar's help/conivence Both are agressive so they will be easily fight each other (especially on european maps since they are neighbours).

 

[Napo981]

Propose your post to be in the archive/strategy guide!!

 

[Puppeteer]

I've seen Frederick a fair bit. In a Monarch Lakes map game this weekend I had Frederick on one side and Caesar on the other, but my land border with Caesar was small due to a large lake. Washington and one of the M guys were also bordering me, and Alexander and Tokugawa were across the world from me. Given my starting point I went for and got the 3 early religions before expanding so I was stunted and small. But Bhuddism spread rapidly and everyone but Frederick and Alexander adopted it (they went Confuscist). Caesar was the big dog on all counts, and I just knew he was going to wipe me out, but while I was spamming Frederick with Bhuddist Missionaries he declared on me and attacked. I fended him off and made peace. Alexander declared and sent units through Caesar's territory and nearly captured my city. I was desperates so I asked Caesar to declare on Alexander and to my surprise he did so happily and continued until he wiped Alexander out!

Last night I started a Monarch Continents game and had Montezuma as a neighbor. I pressed his cities hoping to push him culturally as my expansion plans were set back by a barb killing my settler (defended by an archer on a jungle hill...grrrr). After the barb threats were gone (all the space taken up) I relaxed and thought now's the time to catch up on infrastructure. Montezuma offered open borders. Cool, no worries there. Next turn he declared on me! Changes his mind fast I guess. I barely kept my city and then he was gassed; I made peace at first opportunity but built up my forces and 3 settlers during the 10 turns and attacked him immediately after the 10 turns was up taking 3 cities and razing another poorly placed one to make way for 3 more cities. I made peace, but he was crippled. The idiot later attacked his weakest neighbor and will probably be wiped out soon.

 

[joelzhl]

George Washington: {Financial & Organized}

Definitely weak and peaceful leader, but I've seen him catch up from dead last in score to 3rd by just building peacefully. He also keep up with the tech race fairly well even though he had the smallest empire.

Franklin D Roosevelt - {Industrious & Organized)

Stronger then Washington, though they share similar personalities.

Arabs -

Saladin - {Philosophical & Spiritual}

In the games I've had him, he usually does pretty well throughout the whole game. He's advanced technologically but also has a lot of enemies.

Aztecs -

Montezuma - {Aggressive & Spiritual}

A complete nuts. Impossible to befriend and never lives pass middle ages. He tends to do very well at ancient and classic ages with a large empire, huge army, and fairly advanced technology. Beyond the middle ages his empire usually crumples to failed diplomacy and swallowed up by the AI and me.

Barbarians -

I've seen infantry from these guys, but never Mech Inf. They are free military academy for me to train my troops during peace time.

China -

Mao Zedong - {Philosophical & Organized}

Isolationist and poorly cultured. But even with all his cities threatened culturally, he manages to say within the tech race.

Qin Shi Huang - {Industirous & Financial}

Haven't play him much since 1/2 the game I played, I used him.

Egypt -

Hatshepsut - {Spiritual Creative}

Gotta say something about this AI. She definitely had the strategy part of this game down. In one game she chopped rushed over 100 horse archers in an attempt to bring me down (over the 2000 years). Needless to say I had a very hard time that game when couple with her bringing Qin into the war whom I blockade down to 3 grassland cities. Eventually once the chop rush steam runs out, she's a pushover. In another game I had Hats, Alex and I in an alliance against Monte. All 4 nations were in the top of the score chart and comparable in terms of military strength, tech, and land area with Monte having a slightly larger army. Both Alex and I did very well at whooping Monte's army and actually manages to capture a few cities, but the Egyptian front crumples really fast. Later on she declare war on Monte again twice. Despite having technological and land area advantage, Hats lost both war and drop down to one of the dead last AI scores. What I can conclude is that Hats has the mind of a brilliant strategist but a total idiot when it comes to tactics.

England -

Queen Victoria - {Expansive & Financial}

She can definitely tech. Vic manages to keep up in tech with me despite having 5:1 land ratio and most of my cities were developed well up to the late industrial age.

Queen Elizabeth - {Philosophical & Financial}

All I can say is she techs even faster then Vic

France -

Louis XIV - {Creative and Industrious}

Very high culture builder. I usually stack multiple religions and build churches on his border.

Napolean - {Aggressive & Industrious}

I've seen him build a lot of wonders and kept a small military and very little expansion, but that's a rare case. He's usually aggreesive.

Germany -

Frederick - {Creative & Philosophical}

He can tech pretty well with Great People up to industrial age, then he'll use Panzers to crush you.

Bismark - {Expansive & Industrious}

Haven't met him much.

Greece -

Alexander - {Aggressive & Philosophical}

Big opportunist, he picks on the low military strength civ. Anytime you find yourself below the average army size in the statistics, you can be sure he'll attack you soon. If you keep a relatively good military and share a religion with him, he makes a good ally and obidient dog.

Inca -

Huayna Capac - {Aggressive & Financial}

Financial trait makes him an dangerous tech-er. He never fully utilizes his UU, but by early industrial age, he usually comes in top 3 score if left unchecked.

India -

Mahatma Gandhi - {Industrious & Spiritual}

I love having him in my game. Though I sometimes feel pitiful for his watery eye, I alway have the pleasure of uniting the two civilization .

Asoka - {Organized & Spiritual}

He does make a lot of cottages, but he's not that aggresive. Though he is a contender for the space race.

Japan -

Tokugawa - {Aggressive & Organized}

Complete idiot. He's a waste of such good trait combo and good UU. I have never seen him declare war on someone.

Mali -

Mansa Musa - {Financial & Spiritual}

This guy will trade anything, even if you backstabbed him multiple times and he's furious at you, he'll still trade his underware (or some very advanced tech) for something you have. Best AI to bully around and still maintain a talking relation.

Mongolia -

Genghis Khan - {Aggressive & Expansive}

I play the mongols a lot, so I haven't met him much to determine his personality.

Kublai Khan - {Aggressive & Creative}

Same as Genghis.

Persia -

Cyrus - {Expansive & Organized}

If there's anyone you can ignore and still get by, Cyrus is the man. Doesn't matter if your relationship is friendly or furious, he won't do anything .

Rome -

Julius Caeser - {Creative & Expansive}

Another aggresive AI. He's even worse then Alex since he'll backstab you even if you have friendly relationship and stronger then he is. Another thing is that he makes ridiculous demands whereas Alex and Genghis's demand and aid requests are more on the reasonable side.

Russia -

Catherine - {Creative & Financial}

One of the best builder I've seen, she's also capable of fast expansion also. I had a game where she has 5 costal cities and 2 inland cottage farms all producing around 200 breakers. Needless to say she keep with in science with me even though I own close to 50% of the land mass.

Peter - {Expansive & Philosophical}

Haven't seen him much, and even in the games he played, he doesn't raise my alarm to be someone of importance.

Spain -

Queen Isabella - {Expansive & Spiritual}

Very annoying personalities. She's makes outrageous demands and usually have quite a few friends to back her up. She also gets angry easily.

 

[slothman]

Barbarians -
Although they can beat you to the construction of the space ship. {Weird huh?}

Do you have any screenshots or saves of that?
Can they do that if they don't steal a plethora number of your cities?

Mao Zedong - {Philosophical & Organized}
For some reason he almost never trades with the human player.
At least the bugger-ball never traded with me.
He also seems to be one of three leaders that almost never get picked in the random civ Generator.

He was picked in my game.
He trades with me alot.
In fact since he is tech deficient and rich he gives alot of gold to me.
Really good for upgrading and rushing.
Almost like a subciv of me.

Hatshepsut - {Spiritual Creative}
It seems the thing she hates the most is when cultural borders impede on her borders.
If you're on her bad side, just switch to her religion and she'll never bother you again.

I have that, it is even gett worse for her.
Since she's my religion she is friendly with me though.

Frederick - {Creative & Philosophical}

He doesn't seem too bad.
Of course I am playing him so I can't tell.

Alexander - {Aggressive & Philosophical}
I'd vote him, "Most likely to steal a city early on and make you restart."

It happened to me by the French with my Ghandi.
That's the problem with peaceful games.
This one though he isn't too bad.
If you are far away with others in between then he is fine.

Huayna Capac - {Aggressive & Financial}
... they're a kitten with a tuba.
Their existance makes no sense.

That is one of the funniest things I read here.
Definately LOL.

India
Mahatma Gandhi - {Industrious & Spiritual}
Asoka - {Organized & Spiritual}

From your description both Indians seem hard to defeat.
Possibly easy to play as well.

Tokugawa - {Aggressive & Organized}
He will always be the one at the bottom of your ranking scores.

He is, well actually Montezuma is but I got rid of him.
I "needed" breathing room.

Mansa Musa - {Financial & Spiritual}
A great peace-time AI.

I like him alot.
He's my neighbor, and my friend.

Cyrus - {Expansive & Organized}
Then when you declare war on him, you notice hes got like 7 freaking cities that're all sprawled around like a ******ed baby was the one who did the placement.
Who would plant in the middle of the desert anyways?

Some times 1 extra city may generate more gold than it uses.
It then becomes an asset rather than a liability.

Catherine - {Creative & Financial}
I think shes one of the few AI's that is crucial to befriend.
Really. I've gotten friendly with her, ...

Have you seen her picture?
I really got friendly with her.





Many of these do seem well written and useful.
What difficulties have you tested them on?
What map sizes and rivels are there?
Where are the opponents compared to you.
Many of the warlike civs are much friendlier when far away.
Peaceful might be more aggressive when nearby also.

 

[Dairuka]

Holy monkey bejeebus this thread lives!

Many of these do seem well written as useful.

Thank you very much. The compliment is appreciated. =)

What difficulties have you tested them on?

Most of my testing takes part on Monarchy Difficulty, however, I do play Immortal and Emperor very sporadically.

What map sizes and rivels are there?

I normally play Small or Standard Sized Maps. I like to play with 3-5 extra players than the normally recommended value of rivals for each map type though. Mostly because I like to have a challenge.

Where are the opponents compared to you.

In score? If I'm not playing Immortal, I'm usually in the lead.

Many of the warlike civs are much friendlier when far away.

The only warlike civ thats truly 'nicer' when they are farther away is Tokugawa. The only warlike civ that is meaner when they are father away is Napolean.. and maybe Isabella. I believe the XML file has proof to that attestment. However, all civilizations are more inclined to be nicer without that -2 Our close borders spark tensions penalty.

Peaceful might be more aggressive when nearby also.

Catherine who is normally peaceful, turns into a rabid bish when you start next to her. The problem with this is, shes an AWESOME bloc partner, she like Alexander will be your lapdog and attack everybody at your request. Alexander however is not as easy to befriend as Catherine.

Side Note: I love how you guys are going through the entire list of leaders and expressing your own experiences with them! I guess now I actually have to go through with writing up a comprehensive, "vs Leader" list. Yikes!

 

[Bezhukov]

In my Immortal Inca win, I was sandwiched between Monty and Alex, but managed to keep them occupied fighting other AI's long enough to convince them both that we were blood-brothers. By spaceship-time, they both just sat there with huge stacks while I took all their good tiles with culture. Kinda felt sorry for them.

In general, Monty is such a technological dunce that its pretty easy to bribe him into attacking the civ of your choice. Just make sure you have some defense too, as you'll probably be fighting that civ at Monty's side.

 

[diamond geezer]

I generally play on "earthlike" settings, i.e. continents/temperate etc. and I seem to get the same leaders much of the time. Louis XIV (except when I played him) almost every time, Alexander almost every time, Frederick most of the time, Isabella a lot, Ghandi too, with Julius, Elizabeth, Tokugawa, Mao about 50% of the time (maybe more with Mao as I play Chinese quite often). I've seen several of the others more than once, but some not at all: Roosevelt, Qin, Victoria, Asoka, either of the Khans. Is this just a quirk of the RNG, or are some leaders more likely in general or on certain settings?

 

[kroym]

Dairuka,

You mentioned you may compile this in to a "comprehensive AI strategy guide" - what's the status on that? I'd be VERY interested in such a guide - and I'm sure many others would be as well...

Thanks

kroYM

 

[Dairuka]

Dairuka,

You mentioned you may compile this in to a "comprehensive AI strategy guide" - what's the status on that? I'd be VERY interested in such a guide - and I'm sure many others would be as well...

Thanks

11 days from now I get a two week break from college. Once that happens, I'll have the free time to write out something meaningful, rather than just a quick skim made up of mere tidbits of information from the top of my memory during my study breaks.

I do however have a complete, "vs Montezuma" strategy done so far, which I'm going to use as a foundation for other, "vs AI" strategies. I just need time.

In the meantime, I'll be collecting information from other people, and other websites.

 

[kroym]

Great!

I'll be looking forward to it! I start my break from college next week. Woo hoo!



kroYM

 

[Dairuka]

I start my break from college next week. Woo hoo!

It's a joyous occasion, isn't it? It's a direly needed break at that... All the information being forced into my fragile brain is about to make it explode.

It's gotten so bad, that I dream about Kittens playing the Tuba. They're not very good at it, thats for sure. This one tabby cat tried to play Immigrant Song on it, and it sounded like Hot Crossed Buns. Cats should not play Tubas because they butcher good Led Zeppelin songs.

Oh, also - If anybody has any combat strategies regarding fighting, "Cossacks", "Musketeers", and "Samurais", I'm eager to know. These are the few UU's I have yet to contend against, so any information would be very appreciated.

 

[Gdek]

I seem to end up with Monte, Izzy and Alex in every game that I play.

Monte - Raving psychotic. I can never get him to be friends for any worthwhile amount of time, and he'll attack at the drop of a hat. It's important to spank him hard and keep your guard up.

Alex - Even if you make him your lapdog, it's likely he's pissed every one else off, so you'll take a hit. In one game I had to eliminate him just because of that; we'd been allies since the beginning, but by the industrial age he'd angered everyone else around him, and I was taking a reputation hit just for being friends with him. Guilt by association I guess.

Izzy - Never ever likes me. Surly and mouthy, but not terribly dangerous. Watch out though, she'll grab the early religions, spread them to all her neighbours and force them to convert. Then you have a super bloc to deal with, and your god help you if she let's Caesar or Bismark off their leash.

I've only had to deal with Cossacks in force once, and my Redcoats made pretty short work of them.