Spies Like Us

[HankSSSI]

I was just curious as to how many players regularly use spies? Think they're too effective? Not effective enough?

In my latest game I had to rely completely on them in order to win. My only option for victory was points so I had to find a way to stall until 2050. With 66 turns left and three other AI's working on the spaceship, I used spies to completely destroy any chances of my rivals completing the necessary parts.

I set research and culture to 0% each to rake in $1500 a turn, money to simply fund my unsavory agents in the field. First I tried directly sabotaging construction, but it was not only very expensive but very risky and it soured relations with my rivals for every captured spy. So I started destroying their improvements. Not only is their a higher chance of success but it's very cheap to do.

One rival had only the Stasis Chamber to complete, and this was with 50 turns left in the game, and it was 15 from being completed. I destroyed every improvement around the city and then sabotaged it directly a few times. I found that taking all those hammers away and making the city starve out is nearly as effective in the long run. I also located every source of Aluminum and destroyed the improvements on that and made sure I was the one who built the Space Elevator even though I never even researched the Apollo Program.

I had figured spies to be a very last ditch strategy, a way to keep someone from building something before you did, or to slightly delay the space race. In my game it was the ONLY strategy. I amassed around 50 nukes in case it came to a point where my spies failed, but they were effective enough to do the job for 66 turns!! I won my 2nd game on Prince, on the backs of spies. Terra Map/Standard size/6 AI's, I was the Aztecs.

 

[MrCynical]

I use spies in every game, though I regard sabotage as their minor function. I regard being able to see what is going on inside the enemy cities as far more valuable, that that's what I mainly use them for. Sabotage is useful for cutting off resources and if you really don't care about diplomatic relations then wholesale sabotage of improvements can be effective as well. I've only ever sabotaged Spaceship components and the Internet in city production though, the costs don't seem worth it otherwise.

The only change I'd like to see made to spies would be the return of technology stealing.

 

[garner_adam]

Spies are incredible units. The ability to scout out rival territory and troop placement makes waging warfare a lot easier. Especially if you want to pull sneaky amphibious raids. The only down side is spending the time to build the Scotland yard.

 

[Loyran]

I was very disappointed at first when using spies. They seemed practically useless. However with time my opinion changes and although I do not rely on them to win, I use them in every game.

 

[RED DIAMOND]

Spies are great, but I felt they lacked some of the additional covert tactitcs that I like to see, so I made an Agent, Infiltrator and Sappers. Each is limited in number like missionaries, but very effective if used properly.

 

[podraza]

I've never used spies, but now I'm curious. What is the price to destroy an improvement? What is the rate of failure? Does the victim identify you as the perpetrator?

 

[EDaddy]

I love using spies

 

[AngryPants]

I love using spies. Always nice to have options.

 

[fung3]

I also like to use spies. Unless you're cruising to an easy victory they are essential. You have to know what your rivals are doing.

Like Mr Cynical, in previous games tech stealing was possible with spies. A practice I indulged in a great deal. However, stealing tech seemed to make getting a tech lead a little too easy.

 

[fung3]

Spies are great, but I felt they lacked some of the additional covert tactitcs that I like to see, so I made an Agent, Infiltrator and Sappers. Each is limited in number like missionaries, but very effective if used properly.

Where can I download your funky covert units?

 

[Blazer6]

I make an effort to create a couple defensive pacts and then send spies to get a strong civ to declare war on me.

 

[punchandpie]

I've found spies very useful as scouts and destroying unit/wonder production althought that part can get exspensive. But being able to scout enemy units, especially at higher levels is always helpful.

 

[Loyran]

I've never used spies, but now I'm curious. What is the price to destroy an improvement? What is the rate of failure? Does the victim identify you as the perpetrator?

It costs 200 gold (in epic speed at least) to destroy an improvement. The odds given by the computer is usually something like 21% - 71%, whatever that means. From my experience, your spie is succesful at least 4 times out of 5.

If he's caught, you lose the gold and the improvement isn't destroyed. Also that will give a -1 'you used a spy against us' diplomatic modifier with the civ.

If he's not caught, their attidue towards you will not change.

 

[Landmonitor]

I only ever used spies once and I don't play that often, so this may be a stupid question, but how can you tell what is being built in a given city? I went into cities to investigate units and I blew up improvements, but how do you tell what is being built in the city?

 

[RED DIAMOND]

Where can I download your funky covert units?

Well, these were things I modded into my game, but were not really intended for general use. Really, the only reason why I have not released these as modded units is that no two people will agree on stats, abilities etc... and I don't want to really hear anything from the play it like it was designed nitpickers.

I guess I can walk you through the easy process to change things the way "you" want them.

Here are the unit descriptions. Infiltrator(Special National Unit limit 5) Can explore rival lands, invisible to most units except spies and can expose spies. The real purpoose of the unit is to plant the plaque in rival cities. The plaque is a force built building that has unhealthy/unhappiness features attached to it.

The only cure is the Antidote building. This is a force built building that can only be built by the Hazmat unit(National unit limit 1).

Sappers are not as strong as infantry, but are faster and withdraw from combat when hurt. They are invisible to all other units except for enemy sappers(national unit limit 3), enters rival lands. The purpose of this unit is to spy and have a pre-placed reaction force in enemy lands where you suspect trouble

The Agent is just a spy replacement with the additional ability to see Infiltrators.

I always saw these things as kind of "personal" choices, never thinking someoine would have similar tastes. If you are still interested in modding them into your game let me know.

 

[EDaddy]

I only ever used spies once and I don't play that often, so this may be a stupid question, but how can you tell what is being built in a given city? I went into cities to investigate units and I blew up improvements, but how do you tell what is being built in the city?

Once a spy is planted in a emeny city, the city display below the city will display what is producing and how far along it is to it being produced below the city as if it was one of your cities. You can also double-click that city to invesigate it. Cool huh?

 

[Bobbalouie]

My games rarely get into the spy part of the game... but when they do, I don't usually bother with them. Steal plans is fun... but usually most of the info I need I already have, or can get easily. Sabotage too expensive especially with a failure percentage. Seeing production in a city is nice... but it's never really caused my plans to change. Also, I feel a pang for SMAC whenever I use my spies. I want to be able to introduce bio-weapons, and steal technology.