Steam and 'Deluxe' Features

[PieceOfMind]

I think you make some good points there! I'm still sitting on the fence as to whether to buy on Steam or a hard-copy though. Not sure if the pro's of no CD required to play, and the 'added extras' for which £10 is a bit steep (but it's only a tenner!) outweigh the pro's of having a proper printed manual and box to put on the shelf but no extras! Hmmm... decisions decisions!

Im pretty sure you dont need a cd to play if you do buy the retail, Chalks?

That would be correct. It's half the point of using Steam in the first place.

The advantage of having the CD by buying it from retail is that you won't have to download the full game, but rather install it from a DVD. However, there may still be a day1 patch or update required.

 

[Chalks]

Yes, absolutely.

The physical version comes with extra stuff but after installation, the game you're playing should be exactly the same one as you'd get if you'd bought the standard edition through steam (minus the preoder bonus)

 

[Baracus]

Ah yes indeed I forgot that, thanks! I was playing Supreme Commander 2 with the disc still in the drive for ages before I realised it worked without

That has swung the deal for me then - retail copy it is!

I'm really looking forward to this

 

[Sareln]

Right now Portal is free on steam, and I downloaded it this morning. It was a bit over 5 GB and it was downloaded in under ten minutes. Steam uploads the games to well over 3MB/sec. I do not even have fancy internet, so it can be done faster still I highly doubt that for the typical user the download will last 3 hours or more.

Dang, I want your internet connection . Did you already have a source game? That would cut down on the necessary d/l size. 3MB/sec translates roughly to 28 minutes, so you were probably cruising along at something closer to 9MB/sec.

If you buy the digital preorder but want a physical manual, for toilet reading or something, it'll almost certainly come with a .pdf. Run that over to your local copy-shop, get it bound and voila.

 

[timmey_o_tool]

Here's my thoughts about Deluxe edition. For me, this is a version for big fans, i.e. it should include in some sense "useless" material/bonus. We do all know that as a fan one can be crazy about some very weird stuff. In a Deluxe edition, I would expect a nice physical box to put on the shelf, filled with some funny manual, techtree, posters. It can also include some in game features like a different skin for the menu, or new music, slightly new graphics... But nothing like a new civ ! That changes completely the game and it is not fair for the normal customer. Because now, the normal edition is actually the Deluxe, and the normal one is a cheaper incomplete version... I really can't understand... sad sad sad. As I am a big fan since the first civ, I would be happy to pay for a real deluxe version, but now, I'm just... well... disappointed. Until now, Civ was one of those unique games which lived from the fact that it is awesome and because there is a huge fanatic fan community... now it seam Firaxis is a bit cheating us...

 

[Shurdus]

Dang, I want your internet connection . Did you already have a source game? That would cut down on the necessary d/l size. 3MB/sec translates roughly to 28 minutes, so you were probably cruising along at something closer to 9MB/sec.

If you buy the digital preorder but want a physical manual, for toilet reading or something, it'll almost certainly come with a .pdf. Run that over to your local copy-shop, get it bound and voila.

At evenings when the neighbors in my appartment complex are home, the internet drags down to an barely unacceptable level, you definitely do nt want my connection.

Also the DL was 4MB/sec at the peak - yes I checked - so then it must have been closer to 30 minutes indeed. It seemed faster... Oh well, suffice to say that that is still very very fast for 5+GB.

 

[Ajidica]

I'll definatly be getting a retail copy both to physicaly have the discs and partialy to spite the 'steam deluxe/pre-order version'. While a few small pre-order goodies are fine, it shouldn't be a whole civ or map.

How does the Empire Total War style of DLC compare to other games style of DLC?
(The reason I keep refrencing Empire Total War is because that is the only steam game I have experiance with.)

 

[Commander Bello]

Right now Portal is free on steam, and I downloaded it this morning. It was a bit over 5 GB and it was downloaded in under ten minutes. Steam uploads the games to well over 3MB/sec. I do not even have fancy internet, so it can be done faster still I highly doubt that for the typical user the download will last 3 hours or more.

Can you tell me, which tricks you used?
If I have done the math correctly, the upload would have taken 28.xx minutes for Steam.

 

[eireksten]

See the post two above yours.

 

[Grey Fox]

I love digital copies of games. I am over physical copies and have been for ages.

Even if a download takes 3 hours that is faster than the minimum 1 day it takes for a game to ship to me. I don't live anywhere near a shop that sells games and even if I had a car going to another town to a physical store is much more of a hassle.

I am worried about this DLC business but on some levels I find it more attractive than the expansions.

Typically in the past we have gotten one semi-crappy expansion then another expansion that includes almost everything from the previous one. Now we can pick and choose what we want. This Babylon stuff is worrying though. What if I don't preorder, will I never be able to get Babylon? And the pricing for each DLC is also worrying. Knowing Steam we will hopefully see some on sale sometime though... (though I dunno if I will be able to wait ).

EDIT:
And Portal was only 2GB for me, might be because I already had Half-Life 2 installed?

 

[Ajidica]

Elective DLC clashes a bit with the modding friendly nature oc Civ5. If different people have different version of the game then there would likely have to be separate version of the mod. While I'm all for having semi-expansions through steam, having a 'buffet menu' approach wont work quite as well for a highly modable game.

 

[Vordrax]

Elective DLC clashes a bit with the modding friendly nature oc Civ5. If different people have different version of the game then there would likely have to be separate version of the mod. While I'm all for having semi-expansions through steam, having a 'buffet menu' approach wont work quite as well for a highly modable game.

It was fine for TESIV: Oblivion. I'm not a big fan of DLC in general, but it didn't really affect the modding community for that game.

 

[Commander Bello]

It was fine for TESIV: Oblivion. I'm not a big fan of DLC in general, but it didn't really affect the modding community for that game.

Was it DLC for which you had to pay for? And were modders nevertheless allowed to make use of such content? And were there any restrictions of using modified graphics/whatever for version without said DLC?

 

[Grey Fox]

I think we have grown too dependent on modifying existent art. Artists need to step up and take it to the next level

 

[Vordrax]

Was it DLC for which you had to pay for?

Yes.

And were modders nevertheless allowed to make use of such content? And were there any restrictions of using modified graphics/whatever for version without said DLC?

Clarify. They couldn't make mods dependent on your ownership of the DLC and distribute it to people without the DLC, if that's what you mean, since it is dependent on you having those files. However, they could mod the DLC for people that had it (i.e. unofficial patches/changes to DLC content), and they could make mods that did similar things to the DLC.

Are you saying "Can they make a mod that strips the paid DLC out and provide it to people for free?" Because, technically, that is piracy. I've never seen anyone do it, because modders tend to make new things, not release old things, so I don't know what the company would do.

I mean realistically, most mods and DLC have no interaction at all that really needs to be handled, for Oblivion at least. Having Horse Armor or access to the Orrerry or having a deity's weapon aren't really relevant to most mods, so there's no conflict.

In the same vein, if you made a mod for this game that added techs or units or a new civ, I can't think of a logical reason why a DLC civilization would affect your mod at all. Are you saying "Can a modder make a Babylonian civ when there's a DLC Babylonian civ?" I can't really see why not, as long as the content they generate isn't stolen from the DLC. It's no different than changing an existing civ.

But if you're asking something else, please clarify. I'm not trying to be obtuse, your question could mean many things.

 

[Commander Bello]

What I mean is that there are many graphics mods for Civ4, in which units have been re-skinned. (Taking the normal knight unit and making a knights templar from it, for instance)
Or take the leaderhead modifications.

I was assuming that similar things might have happened in Oblivion, too.

What I am not talking about is to get the DE, strip of the Babylonian Civilization and distributing unalterad content (for instance, the graphics) to somebody else.

 

[Vordrax]

What I mean is that there are many graphics mods for Civ4, in which units have been re-skinned. (Taking the normal knight unit and making a knights templar from it, for instance)
Or take the leaderhead modifications.

I was assuming that similar things might have happened in Oblivion, too.

I guess it's not completely analogous. People most assuredly reskinned even DLC content (in fact, one of my favorites, while not from Oblivion, reskinned some DLC armor in Dragon Age: Origins because the shipped texture was awful) I'm pretty sure, some of the patches were for that very reason IIRC.

I know you and I have had a couple of really silly/angry arguments in the past couple of days, but believe me, I'm not being argumentative here. The modding community is something that I take VERY seriously. A company that supports the modding community would be, very stupidly, shooting themselves in the foot if they opposed anything but the most blatant copyright infringements.

Actually, it isn't DLC related, but Bethesda has no problem with them remaking TESIII: Morrowind in Oblivion's engine (provided you own Morrowind/have access to the actual game, of course.) I know it's not the exact same thing you're talking about, but it is a good example of an intelligent company allowing modmakers to do what they do best without hassling them.

http://morroblivion.com/

 

[Shurdus]

I love digital copies of games. I am over physical copies and have been for ages.

Even if a download takes 3 hours that is faster than the minimum 1 day it takes for a game to ship to me. I don't live anywhere near a shop that sells games and even if I had a car going to another town to a physical store is much more of a hassle.

I am worried about this DLC business but on some levels I find it more attractive than the expansions.

Typically in the past we have gotten one semi-crappy expansion then another expansion that includes almost everything from the previous one. Now we can pick and choose what we want. This Babylon stuff is worrying though. What if I don't preorder, will I never be able to get Babylon? And the pricing for each DLC is also worrying. Knowing Steam we will hopefully see some on sale sometime though... (though I dunno if I will be able to wait ).

EDIT:
And Portal was only 2GB for me, might be because I already had Half-Life 2 installed?

You actually make some very good points. Even so it applies not to me because I live withing a 2 minute walk from a 3 game stores.

Funny how portal was 2GB for you. I guess that was indeed because you had half-life2 installed, I take it I had to download the engine again.