Suggestion: Unique Victory Conditions / Achivements
- Thread starter dh_epic
- Start date
Ravellion
Prince
I think it shouldn't be a victory condition to pursue historical behaviour. That would still make the game deterministic. However:
What if the National Wonder gained (I propose the title "Memorial Monument") helped in all the victory conditions?
It could give +10% culture, +10% space ship construction, +2 XP (like another pentagon), +2 diplomatic modifier with all civs ("We admire you for your achievement"), +10% score (or +400, if that can't be percentiled.)
All the secondary victory conditions are suddenly easier to reach.(edit, I missed a few pages in th thread... oops... still, mine what you want of my small and meaningless contribution
Rav
What if the National Wonder gained (I propose the title "Memorial Monument") helped in all the victory conditions?
It could give +10% culture, +10% space ship construction, +2 XP (like another pentagon), +2 diplomatic modifier with all civs ("We admire you for your achievement"), +10% score (or +400, if that can't be percentiled.)
All the secondary victory conditions are suddenly easier to reach.(edit, I missed a few pages in th thread... oops... still, mine what you want of my small and meaningless contribution
Rav
If we are proposing a hard to reach national wonder that once achieved the rest of the game should all be downhill, then I propose that thie national wonder should draw other civs into war with you. I don't propose an all out war of armageddon, but other civs (or the player's civ) have no way of blocking the powers of a "National Manifesto", except through it's destruction.
Are we (or, is Rhye) leaning toward requirements like 3 out of 4 tasks OR 12 out of 15 points? Tasks or Points? I've noticed some of these include year-deadlines (ex. no European colonies in South America before/at 1700). The threshold of achieving victory and/or "National Manifesto" should still be achievable, I believe, even if the tasks with year-deadlines are missed. If Babylon must build the Hanging Gardens before 1000BC, then it may not be fair if they never have a chance at this victory/national wonder should they miss the year-deadline.
Are we (or, is Rhye) leaning toward requirements like 3 out of 4 tasks OR 12 out of 15 points? Tasks or Points? I've noticed some of these include year-deadlines (ex. no European colonies in South America before/at 1700). The threshold of achieving victory and/or "National Manifesto" should still be achievable, I believe, even if the tasks with year-deadlines are missed. If Babylon must build the Hanging Gardens before 1000BC, then it may not be fair if they never have a chance at this victory/national wonder should they miss the year-deadline.
Blasphemous
Graulich
I think the National Manifesto bonus should be very nice but not one that makes the game a downhill battle. All we have to do to make the AI react correctly is assign very high priority to defending and attacking the NM city. Players and AI already attack civs that are doing well, and players will know what cities to target.
dh_epic
Cold War Veteran
I'm just as okay with making the National Manifesto (glad people like that name) into a big bonus as I am with making it a 'downhill battle' bonus let alone victory condition. The choice, ultimately, is Rhye's. I guess we'll wait to see how he picks up on the idea 
Rhye
's and Fall creator
I'm definitely heading towards 3 goals out of 3 to win.
The progress should be shown in the score panel (0/3, 1/3 or 2/3).
2 out of 3 could provide an intermediate bonus that could be a Golden Age, or a national wonder (actually I would like to remove the 100% ahistorical Eroic and National Epic, and reuse National Epic graphics to add the Arc de Triomph small wonder). But this will come later.
First, this is the list I've compiled so far. As you can see, there are many checkpoints, because some calculations can't be done every turn, they would slow down the game too much
I will soon begin to implement it.
Feel free to express judgments on too easy/difficult tasks
EGY
Have more than 5000 Culture in 500BC
Have more than 20000 Culture in 500AD
Build the Pyramid, the Great Library, and the Great Lighthouse by 500AD
IND
Found buddhism and Hinduism
Found any 3 other religions
Be 1st in population in 1000AD
CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD
GRE
Control Egypt and Persia by 0AD
Build 4 Classical wonders by 500AD
Be the first to circumnavigate
ROM
Never lost a single city to barbarians before 1000AD
Control all the area under Roman rule in their maximum extent, plus Germany and Persia, by 500AD
Each city controlled which size is >=5 is connected to Rome and has got Barracks, an Aqueduct and a Colosseum
PER
Control Anatolia, Phoenicia and Israel
Control (or make vassal states of) Greece and Egypt
Control 3 holy city shrines
JAP
Be 1st in score in 1500AD
Never lost a single city until 1800AD
No foreign culture in Japanese islands at the discovery of Astronomy
ARA
Spread Islam to at least 10 cities
Control 3 Holy city shrines
Control (or make vassal states of) Spain, France and Rome
SPA
Control Aztec and Incan territory by 1800AD
Be the first to found a city in America
No English or French cities in the Americas in 1700AD
FRA
Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana
Make Paris the #1 cultural city in 1700
Build Notre Dame, the Eiffel Tower, and the Statue of Liberty and control them by 1900AD
ENG
Be the first to circumnavigate
Colonize East American Coast, South Africa and Australia by 1600AD
Control (or make vassal states of) India, Egypt and China by 1800AD
GER
Control France, England and Scandinavia
Control Russia, Greece and Rome
Be the first to complete the tech tree
RUS
At least 10 enemy units died in their attempts of invasion of Russian motherland
Colonize Siberia by 1700AD
Build the Apollo Program by 1950AD
MAL
Be the 1st in gold in 1300AD
Have 5000 gold in 1500AD
Have 25000 gold in 1700AD
MON
Control China by 1300AD
Control (or make vassal states of) 2 civs between Persia, Japan, India and Russia in 1500AD
Raze at least 10 cities
INC
Have 5000 gold
No European colonies in South America in 1600AD
No European colonies in South America in 1800AD
AZT
Enslave 3 Spanish units
No European colonies in Central America in 1600AD
No European colonies in Central America in 1800AD
AME
Colonize West Coast and connect it to your capital by 1850
Control Alaska and Panama by 1850
No European colonies in the whole American continent in 1900
The progress should be shown in the score panel (0/3, 1/3 or 2/3).
2 out of 3 could provide an intermediate bonus that could be a Golden Age, or a national wonder (actually I would like to remove the 100% ahistorical Eroic and National Epic, and reuse National Epic graphics to add the Arc de Triomph small wonder). But this will come later.
First, this is the list I've compiled so far. As you can see, there are many checkpoints, because some calculations can't be done every turn, they would slow down the game too much
I will soon begin to implement it.
Feel free to express judgments on too easy/difficult tasks
EGY
Have more than 5000 Culture in 500BC
Have more than 20000 Culture in 500AD
Build the Pyramid, the Great Library, and the Great Lighthouse by 500AD
IND
Found buddhism and Hinduism
Found any 3 other religions
Be 1st in population in 1000AD
CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD
GRE
Control Egypt and Persia by 0AD
Build 4 Classical wonders by 500AD
Be the first to circumnavigate
ROM
Never lost a single city to barbarians before 1000AD
Control all the area under Roman rule in their maximum extent, plus Germany and Persia, by 500AD
Each city controlled which size is >=5 is connected to Rome and has got Barracks, an Aqueduct and a Colosseum
PER
Control Anatolia, Phoenicia and Israel
Control (or make vassal states of) Greece and Egypt
Control 3 holy city shrines
JAP
Be 1st in score in 1500AD
Never lost a single city until 1800AD
No foreign culture in Japanese islands at the discovery of Astronomy
ARA
Spread Islam to at least 10 cities
Control 3 Holy city shrines
Control (or make vassal states of) Spain, France and Rome
SPA
Control Aztec and Incan territory by 1800AD
Be the first to found a city in America
No English or French cities in the Americas in 1700AD
FRA
Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana
Make Paris the #1 cultural city in 1700
Build Notre Dame, the Eiffel Tower, and the Statue of Liberty and control them by 1900AD
ENG
Be the first to circumnavigate
Colonize East American Coast, South Africa and Australia by 1600AD
Control (or make vassal states of) India, Egypt and China by 1800AD
GER
Control France, England and Scandinavia
Control Russia, Greece and Rome
Be the first to complete the tech tree
RUS
At least 10 enemy units died in their attempts of invasion of Russian motherland
Colonize Siberia by 1700AD
Build the Apollo Program by 1950AD
MAL
Be the 1st in gold in 1300AD
Have 5000 gold in 1500AD
Have 25000 gold in 1700AD
MON
Control China by 1300AD
Control (or make vassal states of) 2 civs between Persia, Japan, India and Russia in 1500AD
Raze at least 10 cities
INC
Have 5000 gold
No European colonies in South America in 1600AD
No European colonies in South America in 1800AD
AZT
Enslave 3 Spanish units
No European colonies in Central America in 1600AD
No European colonies in Central America in 1800AD
AME
Colonize West Coast and connect it to your capital by 1850
Control Alaska and Panama by 1850
No European colonies in the whole American continent in 1900
UglyBoy
Pseudo Impossible
WOW!!! 
You've been secretly working very hard on this. I definately think the strength of most are worthy of victory. Looks impressive!
I have 1 thing to ask straight from the top of my head about the Incan and Aztec goals of no European colonies. If a European colony is founded before 1600 is that an automatic fail. I think if you were to capture the city 2 turns after it is founded it would be unfair that you have no chance of victory this way. Maybe if this were changed to no cities above size 2 for example.
The goals which do not have time limits, will these eventually have time limits or will they stay without time limits?
Just my 2 cents for the moment I may think of more as I reread this huge list.
You've been secretly working very hard on this. I definately think the strength of most are worthy of victory. Looks impressive!I have 1 thing to ask straight from the top of my head about the Incan and Aztec goals of no European colonies. If a European colony is founded before 1600 is that an automatic fail. I think if you were to capture the city 2 turns after it is founded it would be unfair that you have no chance of victory this way. Maybe if this were changed to no cities above size 2 for example.
The goals which do not have time limits, will these eventually have time limits or will they stay without time limits?
Just my 2 cents for the moment I may think of more as I reread this huge list.
For india you put;
Am I right in thinking that they need to found 5 religions, not just control the holy cities?
if you are france or greace and someone beats you to a wonder if you capture it does it count?
for greace which wonders count as classical wonders?
Thats all for now, but I would like to say how impressed I am with these victory conditions, but would they be optional like other victory conditions?
Am I right in thinking that they need to found 5 religions, not just control the holy cities?
if you are france or greace and someone beats you to a wonder if you capture it does it count?
for greace which wonders count as classical wonders?
Thats all for now
, but I would like to say how impressed I am with these victory conditions, but would they be optional like other victory conditions?
I think this is fabulous!
China's goals seem hard to get.
"CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD"
200 units + 20 cities (enough to build 5 academies and/or pagodas) would bring your economy to a hault I would think.
China's goals seem hard to get.
"CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD"
200 units + 20 cities (enough to build 5 academies and/or pagodas) would bring your economy to a hault I would think.
EGY: good conditions, maybe Egypt should control these wonders by 500AD, but building them and the time constraint both seem acceptable.
IND: again, good. Perhaps controling any 3 other holy cities, but founding them is still very acceptable (and easier to code for).
CHI: I never have 200 units! Even when I'm conquering the world I have 100 tops. maybe 100 units by 1600AD? maybe this depends on difficulty (I play the medium level). I also agree that 4 Academies and 4 Pagodas may be better, especially if there is the time cap of 1000AD.
GRE: good conditions. If the barbarians wipe out Egypt and/or Persia? control 1 Egyptian/Persian city or is there a geographical boundary?
ROM: I like these conditions although I see room for exploit/circumventing the >=5 pop condition on those cities. This is one of the conditions that can be met early on or with forced slavery at any time.
PER: most acceptable. I notice there are no time caps for the Persians, so I suggest adding 1 to 2 or making the victory conditions more ambitious.
JAP: I've never played with Japan, but how difficult is it to achieve first place in score? I commonly see AI Japan in the top 5. Perhaps this is done only by risking cities on the continent.
ARA: a nice mix of conquest and Islam. Again, no time limits. I personally prefer ambitious goals to time limits but it seems if you limit most civs you should limit them all (at least once). My suggestion: put a cap on the 3 Holy Cities, 1258AD, or something.
SPA: This seems "new-world" heavy, but I don't mind. I agree that some leeway needs to be understood about "no English or French cities in 1700AD." a smart English AI would found a city right before the deadline and ruin your chances of expelling them.
FRA: A nice mix of colonization and culture.
ENG: control China!?! maybe with Warlords' vassel states this is feasible but rarely is my army this strong. Control 1,2 Chinese founded cities? When you say colonize American East Coast, etc. do you mean "found New York" or found St. Augustine, New York, and St. John's?
GER: the civ for the war-monger. Schoen. I guess the first to complete the tech tree is the most accurate way of judging tech supremacy, this may be little more than a by-product of conquering so much land. Perhaps a number of Universities/Observatories by 1870?
RUS: again, good mix.
MAL: a high emphasis on Gold. I've never had that much gold so i don't know how feasible it is, but I assume if you turn off science... but, Timbuktu was a great center of learning.
MON: ambitious, I like it.
INC: good, I assume if cities are founded before 1600AD and destroyed soon after will not ruin your winning chances. Should there also be a longevity limit for a city? If the city was in existence in 1595 AND 1600 then you miss out.
AZT: same, maybe expand "Spanish" to European, in the case that Spain doesn't survive the Middle Ages. Does "Central America" include the Caribbean?
AME: good choice in tasks. Maybe couple Alaska and Panama with any Pacific Island and move the date to 1900AD-ish.
Overall, well thought out. These are all easy to check and I think the deadlines will save our computers many unnecesary computations. On that note I do believe each civ should have at least one task that has a deadline. I also realize that these are the first draft of dates but I do not know how wise it is to have some coinciding (Spain conquers the Aztecs and Incas but Japan has never lost a city, who wins?). I also enjoy the fact that there is not too much overlap in goals. While Spain founds the first new world city, England can still be first to circumnavigate the globe. Kudos. And Thanks for putting in the time to come up with a full list.
IND: again, good. Perhaps controling any 3 other holy cities, but founding them is still very acceptable (and easier to code for).
CHI: I never have 200 units! Even when I'm conquering the world I have 100 tops. maybe 100 units by 1600AD? maybe this depends on difficulty (I play the medium level). I also agree that 4 Academies and 4 Pagodas may be better, especially if there is the time cap of 1000AD.
GRE: good conditions. If the barbarians wipe out Egypt and/or Persia? control 1 Egyptian/Persian city or is there a geographical boundary?
ROM: I like these conditions although I see room for exploit/circumventing the >=5 pop condition on those cities. This is one of the conditions that can be met early on or with forced slavery at any time.
PER: most acceptable. I notice there are no time caps for the Persians, so I suggest adding 1 to 2 or making the victory conditions more ambitious.
JAP: I've never played with Japan, but how difficult is it to achieve first place in score? I commonly see AI Japan in the top 5. Perhaps this is done only by risking cities on the continent.
ARA: a nice mix of conquest and Islam. Again, no time limits. I personally prefer ambitious goals to time limits but it seems if you limit most civs you should limit them all (at least once). My suggestion: put a cap on the 3 Holy Cities, 1258AD, or something.
SPA: This seems "new-world" heavy, but I don't mind. I agree that some leeway needs to be understood about "no English or French cities in 1700AD." a smart English AI would found a city right before the deadline and ruin your chances of expelling them.
FRA: A nice mix of colonization and culture.
ENG: control China!?! maybe with Warlords' vassel states this is feasible but rarely is my army this strong. Control 1,2 Chinese founded cities? When you say colonize American East Coast, etc. do you mean "found New York" or found St. Augustine, New York, and St. John's?
GER: the civ for the war-monger. Schoen. I guess the first to complete the tech tree is the most accurate way of judging tech supremacy, this may be little more than a by-product of conquering so much land. Perhaps a number of Universities/Observatories by 1870?
RUS: again, good mix.
MAL: a high emphasis on Gold. I've never had that much gold so i don't know how feasible it is, but I assume if you turn off science... but, Timbuktu was a great center of learning.
MON: ambitious, I like it.
INC: good, I assume if cities are founded before 1600AD and destroyed soon after will not ruin your winning chances. Should there also be a longevity limit for a city? If the city was in existence in 1595 AND 1600 then you miss out.
AZT: same, maybe expand "Spanish" to European, in the case that Spain doesn't survive the Middle Ages. Does "Central America" include the Caribbean?
AME: good choice in tasks. Maybe couple Alaska and Panama with any Pacific Island and move the date to 1900AD-ish.
Overall, well thought out. These are all easy to check and I think the deadlines will save our computers many unnecesary computations. On that note I do believe each civ should have at least one task that has a deadline. I also realize that these are the first draft of dates but I do not know how wise it is to have some coinciding (Spain conquers the Aztecs and Incas but Japan has never lost a city, who wins?). I also enjoy the fact that there is not too much overlap in goals. While Spain founds the first new world city, England can still be first to circumnavigate the globe. Kudos. And Thanks for putting in the time to come up with a full list.
, but I agree that it would be extremly fustraiting...
dc82
Prince
Some great ideas Rhye. I'm definitely excited to see how it comes up. I agree too w/ changing up the Heroic and National Epics - I mean, essentially, that's what been made through these goals.
Some thoughts:
EGY
Have more than 5000 Culture in 500BC
Have more than 20000 Culture in 500AD
Build the Pyramid, the Great Library, and the Great Lighthouse by 500AD
Sounds good - def. a culture challenge for Egypt.
IND
Found buddhism and Hinduism
Found any 3 other religions
Be 1st in population in 1000AD
Wait, so... India has to come up with 3 (out of Taoism, Confucianism, Judaism, Islam, and Christianity) on top of Buddhism and Hinduism? I'm just curious to see the reasoning - also, aren't the religions skewed to be found with certain civs - although for some reason, as the Chinese I was never able to found Confucianism. Otherwise sounds good.
CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD
Yeah I agree, these sound a bit crazy. Maybe shift the population one to China. I'd actually give them circumnavigation or some kind of world exploration (since by the 1200s they had huge navies and sailed as far as Africa - with the ability to go even further).
GRE
Control Egypt and Persia by 0AD
Build 4 Classical wonders by 500AD
Be the first to circumnavigate
The first two sound good, not quite sure why the Greeks would be the first to circumnavigate the world.
ROM
Never lost a single city to barbarians before 1000AD
Control all the area under Roman rule in their maximum extent, plus Germany and Persia, by 500AD
Each city controlled which size is >=5 is connected to Rome and has got Barracks, an Aqueduct and a Colosseum
Sound good!
PER
Control Anatolia, Phoenicia and Israel
Control (or make vassal states of) Greece and Egypt
Control 3 holy city shrines
Sounds good as well.
JAP
Be 1st in score in 1500AD
Never lost a single city until 1800AD
No foreign culture in Japanese islands at the discovery of Astronomy
The last two sound good - the first one in score - Japan never overcame the Europeans - perhaps a spin on it, 2x the score of China or conquer a European owned city or something like that, to reflect Japan's ability to become the first Asian power (and also defeating Russia)
ARA
Spread Islam to at least 10 cities
Control 3 Holy city shrines
Control (or make vassal states of) Spain, France and Rome
10 cities may be a bit too easy - Islam does seem to spread rather well to begin with. Or maybe the 10 cities need to span from the Maghreb to SE Asia.
SPA
Control Aztec and Incan territory by 1800AD
Be the first to found a city in America
No English or French cities in the Americas in 1700AD
I'm surprised the Spanish didn't receive the circumnavigation goal, since Magellan sailed for them. Otherwise, the goals do sound good. Or perhaps controling certain amount of gold resources from North/South America.
FRA
Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana
Make Paris the #1 cultural city in 1700
Build Notre Dame, the Eiffel Tower, and the Statue of Liberty and control them by 1900AD
Haha, I would like the Statue of Liberty to go to the U.S. even though it was the French that made it and sent it as a gift. I was thinking maybe something with controlling fur in N. America - perhaps securing X fur resources and trading it.
ENG
Be the first to circumnavigate
Colonize East American Coast, South Africa and Australia by 1600AD
Control (or make vassal states of) India, Egypt and China by 1800AD
Again, I'd think Spain should be the one for circumnavigation. A good one may be to produce X naval units by 1600-1800, or 2x the naval units of the next largest power - to reflect Englands dominance of the seas (esp. after the defeat of the Spanish Armada).
Trying to control India, Egypt, and China sounds like a huge feat - Trying to conquer all that while colonizing America sounds like prob. one of the hardest tasks to do. Even going the vassal route - it's hard to get others to join once you have even just one.
GER
Control France, England and Scandinavia
Control Russia, Greece and Rome
Be the first to complete the tech tree
The first two sound good. Maybe another goal is just having highest GDP or a certain amount of industrial output.
RUS
At least 10 enemy units died in their attempts of invasion of Russian motherland
Colonize Siberia by 1700AD
Build the Apollo Program by 1950AD
The first goal sounds almost a bit funny - trying to lure enemy units into your land. Do barbarians count?
The Siberian goal sounds good. So does the last one. Perhaps another is to control the Baltic, Black Sea, and even parts of Eastern Europe - it was always vital for Russia to try to gain access to warm water ports, and later on, buffer states for its expansion.
MAL
Be the 1st in gold in 1300AD
Have 5000 gold in 1500AD
Have 25000 gold in 1700AD
Not as familiar with Mali but perhaps something more than just getting money - perhaps education (Sankore Wonder)?
MON
Control China by 1300AD
Control (or make vassal states of) 2 civs between Persia, Japan, India and Russia in 1500AD
Raze at least 10 cities
Four goals? Perhaps another is to expand towards Europe - as far as Rome?
INC
Have 5000 gold
No European colonies in South America in 1600AD
No European colonies in South America in 1800AD
The gold goal may be hard without many civs for the Incans to trade with.
AZT
Enslave 3 Spanish units
No European colonies in Central America in 1600AD
No European colonies in Central America in 1800AD
Maybe a bonus for researching Calendar first, or building Stonehenge - to reflect the extraordinary advancement of astronomy and construction in Mesoamerican cultures?
AME
Colonize West Coast and connect it to your capital by 1850
Control Alaska and Panama by 1850
No European colonies in the whole American continent in 1900
The first goal is def. good. I'm not sure if the second one warrants a goal in itself - maybe join it with the first one. As for no European colonies - Canada was still under British influence... sorta. Besides, it should prob. be competing w/ Russia for Apollo, or something to represent its dominance in the late 20th century - perhaps finish the tech race, build X amount of Modern Age units, etc. Also, perhaps a bonus for building the Statue of Liberty, the UN, and maybe most Modern Age wonders.
Some thoughts:
EGY
Have more than 5000 Culture in 500BC
Have more than 20000 Culture in 500AD
Build the Pyramid, the Great Library, and the Great Lighthouse by 500AD
Sounds good - def. a culture challenge for Egypt.
IND
Found buddhism and Hinduism
Found any 3 other religions
Be 1st in population in 1000AD
Wait, so... India has to come up with 3 (out of Taoism, Confucianism, Judaism, Islam, and Christianity) on top of Buddhism and Hinduism? I'm just curious to see the reasoning - also, aren't the religions skewed to be found with certain civs - although for some reason, as the Chinese I was never able to found Confucianism. Otherwise sounds good.
CHI
No city lost to barbarians or to Mongols before 1400AD
Control an army of 200 units in 1600AD
Build 5 Confucian Academies and 5 Taoist Pagodas by 1000AD
Yeah I agree, these sound a bit crazy. Maybe shift the population one to China. I'd actually give them circumnavigation or some kind of world exploration (since by the 1200s they had huge navies and sailed as far as Africa - with the ability to go even further).
GRE
Control Egypt and Persia by 0AD
Build 4 Classical wonders by 500AD
Be the first to circumnavigate
The first two sound good, not quite sure why the Greeks would be the first to circumnavigate the world.
ROM
Never lost a single city to barbarians before 1000AD
Control all the area under Roman rule in their maximum extent, plus Germany and Persia, by 500AD
Each city controlled which size is >=5 is connected to Rome and has got Barracks, an Aqueduct and a Colosseum
Sound good!
PER
Control Anatolia, Phoenicia and Israel
Control (or make vassal states of) Greece and Egypt
Control 3 holy city shrines
Sounds good as well.
JAP
Be 1st in score in 1500AD
Never lost a single city until 1800AD
No foreign culture in Japanese islands at the discovery of Astronomy
The last two sound good - the first one in score - Japan never overcame the Europeans - perhaps a spin on it, 2x the score of China or conquer a European owned city or something like that, to reflect Japan's ability to become the first Asian power (and also defeating Russia)
ARA
Spread Islam to at least 10 cities
Control 3 Holy city shrines
Control (or make vassal states of) Spain, France and Rome
10 cities may be a bit too easy - Islam does seem to spread rather well to begin with. Or maybe the 10 cities need to span from the Maghreb to SE Asia.
SPA
Control Aztec and Incan territory by 1800AD
Be the first to found a city in America
No English or French cities in the Americas in 1700AD
I'm surprised the Spanish didn't receive the circumnavigation goal, since Magellan sailed for them. Otherwise, the goals do sound good. Or perhaps controling certain amount of gold resources from North/South America.
FRA
Colonize Quebec, the Hudson Bay and Louisiana
Make Paris the #1 cultural city in 1700
Build Notre Dame, the Eiffel Tower, and the Statue of Liberty and control them by 1900AD
Haha, I would like the Statue of Liberty to go to the U.S. even though it was the French that made it and sent it as a gift. I was thinking maybe something with controlling fur in N. America - perhaps securing X fur resources and trading it.
ENG
Be the first to circumnavigate
Colonize East American Coast, South Africa and Australia by 1600AD
Control (or make vassal states of) India, Egypt and China by 1800AD
Again, I'd think Spain should be the one for circumnavigation. A good one may be to produce X naval units by 1600-1800, or 2x the naval units of the next largest power - to reflect Englands dominance of the seas (esp. after the defeat of the Spanish Armada).
Trying to control India, Egypt, and China sounds like a huge feat - Trying to conquer all that while colonizing America sounds like prob. one of the hardest tasks to do. Even going the vassal route - it's hard to get others to join once you have even just one.
GER
Control France, England and Scandinavia
Control Russia, Greece and Rome
Be the first to complete the tech tree
The first two sound good. Maybe another goal is just having highest GDP or a certain amount of industrial output.
RUS
At least 10 enemy units died in their attempts of invasion of Russian motherland
Colonize Siberia by 1700AD
Build the Apollo Program by 1950AD
The first goal sounds almost a bit funny - trying to lure enemy units into your land. Do barbarians count?
The Siberian goal sounds good. So does the last one. Perhaps another is to control the Baltic, Black Sea, and even parts of Eastern Europe - it was always vital for Russia to try to gain access to warm water ports, and later on, buffer states for its expansion.
MAL
Be the 1st in gold in 1300AD
Have 5000 gold in 1500AD
Have 25000 gold in 1700AD
Not as familiar with Mali but perhaps something more than just getting money - perhaps education (Sankore Wonder)?
MON
Control China by 1300AD
Control (or make vassal states of) 2 civs between Persia, Japan, India and Russia in 1500AD
Raze at least 10 cities
Four goals? Perhaps another is to expand towards Europe - as far as Rome?
INC
Have 5000 gold
No European colonies in South America in 1600AD
No European colonies in South America in 1800AD
The gold goal may be hard without many civs for the Incans to trade with.
AZT
Enslave 3 Spanish units
No European colonies in Central America in 1600AD
No European colonies in Central America in 1800AD
Maybe a bonus for researching Calendar first, or building Stonehenge - to reflect the extraordinary advancement of astronomy and construction in Mesoamerican cultures?
AME
Colonize West Coast and connect it to your capital by 1850
Control Alaska and Panama by 1850
No European colonies in the whole American continent in 1900
The first goal is def. good. I'm not sure if the second one warrants a goal in itself - maybe join it with the first one. As for no European colonies - Canada was still under British influence... sorta. Besides, it should prob. be competing w/ Russia for Apollo, or something to represent its dominance in the late 20th century - perhaps finish the tech race, build X amount of Modern Age units, etc. Also, perhaps a bonus for building the Statue of Liberty, the UN, and maybe most Modern Age wonders.
jbfballrb
Warlord
China was never under British control, and I don't think they had anything there until mid/late 19th century. Ditto for Egypt. The Brits didn't go for Egypt til Suez got built and the Ottomans really started tumbling. Maybe move the date back, or take out the China part.
Rhye
's and Fall creator
There's no room for a circumnavigation bonus for Spain, although it would be the civ that should have it more than others.
But England and Greece can have it too, being "seafaring" civs. Greece makes perfectly sense if you think of Alexander trying to reach the end of the world (Scythia) and "circumnavigate" the SE part of the world (India and Arabia) and come back to Greece through the Nile.
But England and Greece can have it too, being "seafaring" civs. Greece makes perfectly sense if you think of Alexander trying to reach the end of the world (Scythia) and "circumnavigate" the SE part of the world (India and Arabia) and come back to Greece through the Nile.
Prestidigitator
Prince
Very nice ideas proosed Rhye.
Not to compound on what others have said, but America's chance for Unique Victory (currently) ends in 1900. I agree that a 20th century goal should be included, especially because this would make a short game for anybody playing as the yanks.
I also have to agree that Russia's goal of starving/freezing 10 units is rather odd, I second the idea for strategic control: the Bosporus; the Russians also wanted to build and control the Suez canal (of course, the Russians wanted alot the Ottomans had).
Islam in 10 cities does seem meek. Perhaps a percentage goal of 25% (50%?); these percentages are pre-calculated by the current game mechanics.
You have mentioned vassal states. This may be included in the first Warlords iteration but you aren't going to sell the rest of us out, are you.
I also have to agree that Russia's goal of starving/freezing 10 units is rather odd, I second the idea for strategic control: the Bosporus; the Russians also wanted to build and control the Suez canal (of course, the Russians wanted alot the Ottomans had).
Islam in 10 cities does seem meek. Perhaps a percentage goal of 25% (50%?); these percentages are pre-calculated by the current game mechanics.
You have mentioned vassal states. This may be included in the first Warlords iteration but you aren't going to sell the rest of us out, are you.
dc82
Prince
If this is being based off of Warlords (I'm assuming vassal states are from Warlords) - should we also include other factors, including the goals of other civs, whether or not their present, as well as other improvements, wonders, etc. that come with the expansion?
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