Term 3 Defense: Securing The Core

[peter grimes]

I think we're too late:



We should nonetheless send a guy that way after RedDot is founded. If we get a tech from this, we won't be sorry we missed that one up there.

 

[Chamnix]

If KISS wants it, then they will definitely beat us to it. However, hopefully they are aware that if they pop a tech, then it will be Masonry, so their warrior may just be out exploring (if they request Masonry from us, then they are probably going to pop).

Ideally we would pop that hut with a settler anyway to improve our chances. I think if that KISS warrior ignores it, maybe we should save it until we can get a settler out that way.

 

[fe3333au]

We are going to hold with Mosonry for a bit ... so that the outrage factor for KISS will be more convincing ... still ... if we resource grab we should sent a city there too ... also it is strategically a good position for Nut attack and defence ...

 

[Chamnix]

I put together a guide to anticipated city sizes so you can determine where MP are most useful at what times:

In doing this, I have assumed EMP City will be going warrior then settlers on 68, 72, 76, 80, etc. instead of no warrior with settlers on 66, 71, 76, 80, etc. I have also assumed no settler from Heron (worst case for luxury spending).

Turn 55:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 1
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 2
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 0%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens

Recommend – 2 MP in Athens, 0%.

Turn 56:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 2
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 2
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens

Recommend – 2 MP in Athens, 10%.

Turn 57:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 2
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 2
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens

Recommend – 2 MP in Athens, 10%.

Turn 58:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 2
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 2
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 0%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in The Black Hole

Recommend?

Turn 59:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 2
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 3
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 0%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in Heron

Recommend?

Turn 60:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 2
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 3
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens

Recommend – 2 MP in Athens, 10%.

Turn 61:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 3
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 3
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in Heron, 1 in EMP City

Recommend – 20% (as I edit this, it is too late for anything else).

Turn 62:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 3
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 3
Meleagerville: 1

Minimum luxuries needed – 0%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in EMP City, 1 in Heron

Recommend – 1 MP in Athens, 1 in Heron, 1 in EMP City, 10%.

Turn 63:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 4
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 3
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 0%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 2 in EMP City, 1 in Heron

Recommend – 1 MP in Athens, 1 in EMP City, 1 in Heron, 10%.

Turn 64:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 4
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 4
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in EMP City, 1 in Heron

Recommend?

Turn 65:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 5
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 1
Heron: 4
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 2 in EMP City, 2 in Heron

Recommend – 1 MP in Athens, 1 in EMP City, 1 in Heron, 20%.

Turn 66:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 5
The Black Hole: 2
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 4
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 1 MP in Athens, 2 MP in EMP City, 1 in Heron

Recommend?

Turn 67:

Athens: 4
EMP City: 6
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 4
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 20%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in EMP City

Recommend – 2 MP in EMP City, 20%.

Turn 68:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 4
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 4
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 1 in EMP City, 1 in Heron

Recommend?

Turn 69:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 5
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 5
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 2 MP in EMP City, 2 in Heron

Recommend?

Turn 70:

Athens: 5
EMP City: 5
The Black Hole: 3
Virtuoso: 2
Heron: 5
Meleagerville: 2

Minimum luxuries needed – 10%.
To get minimum luxuries – 2 MP in Athens, 2 MP in EMP City, 2 in Heron

Recommend?

I stopped at turn 70 because by then hopefully we will be trading luxuries with KISS or be revolting to Republic (or both). Obviously we don’t need to have MPs all the time to always keep luxury spending at its minimum, but I wanted to give you an idea how many warriors would be useful and where and when so you could decide how many to keep around and how many to send out.

 

[peter grimes]

This is extremely helpful... I wonder if it should go into the thread with the Athens Settler Factory info?

I'll have a deeper look at this later on tonight, but I think we'll be able to accomplish things (at least through the end of Term3) and still have a couple escorts.

 

[fe3333au]

Chamnix yet again you are amazing

 

[classical_hero]

I believe now that since we have secured the core, we need to expand ASAP and soon we will be large enough to wage war on the other continent.

 

[General_W]

Yes - expansion is now our priority.

Specifically, I'd like to address our settler currently on his way to the Spices in the jungle.
I'd like to humbly suggest that AW – be assigned to Settler escort duty. His current orders are to head to Virtuoso – but he is in a good position to escort our settler, if we'd like to stay one move in front of the settler.
Just my 2cents!

 

[peter grimes]

@General: I assume you mean to say that AW Athens should be an escort. Please refer to the Instructions thread, I believe I have addressed this. Your suggestion in the Empire update did not go unnoticed, and it was also much appreciated. Keeping track of units can be pretty difficult when one is reliant on screenies, and I must admit I don't keep explicit notes. Hence my reliance on maps doctored in Ms.Paint....

As for the orders to head to Virtuoso.. He was being 'prepositioned' to be an escort. Thanks for the attention!

 

[Chamnix]

if we'd like to stay one move in front of the settler

Keep an eye on the Horseback Riding situation. Once barbs are riding horses, the one move in front approach won't work anymore (unless we have already safely made it to the marshlands so even horses only move one tile).

 

[peter grimes]

Once HBR is opened, should we try to have two escorts? One on the settler and one out front?

I don't see how we could do that and still keep the luxury rate low. But that would be the safest way.

 

[fe3333au]

Turn 56 we have met a barb that threatens the KISS ... I would say lets help them in return for KISS not popping the goody hut on western coast

What you think?

EDIT ... Whomp (see KISS Chat thread ) ... Was concerned that we not take unnecessary risks in an eagerness to please ... so is happy eitherway ... so maybe lets stick to mountains and let it attack us ??

 

[peter grimes]

Fe: I think we have a potential problem: I read through the KISS chat thread linking above. Whomp 'told' us where the barb is, but that's not what shows up in the save.

Either he was telling us info MIA can't get from the save (a breach of the No Espionage rules), or his info is outdated.

If he told us something we shouldn't know, we need to PM Ginger_Ale and RegentMan, and (and Whomp as well) and make sure this doens't happen in the future. Because KISS plays last, and is able to see the barbarian moves, we should make sure that no KISS members tell us anything so specific about barba locations in the future, just to be safe.

I'll be happy to send the PM's, but I won't until you post an explanation here.

I hope this isn't coming across as severe. I don't mean it that way at all. I just want to make sure that the Defense Minister and KISS Ambassador don't wind up in front of a Grand Jury at the International Criminal Court trying to account for the appearance of an ill-conceived conspiracy

 

[fe3333au]

I don't see a problem ... no screenies were sent ... all he said was that the barb I saw on the last save is in the mountains (which I saw on our save) and that another warrior of the celtic kind is attempting at luring another away ...

Unless I am misinterpreting what you are saying ... so please expand ...

I don't take it as severe at all ... and I'd hate to see YOU and KISS in front of the UN Court ... I will be unavailable if that were the case and my pencil sharpener would also be on sabatical

 

[peter grimes]

I thought that Whomp had told us the specific tile the barb was on when they opened their save (after our turn 55). But I just read things through again, and you are right. It was not tile specific, only terrain specific.

I guess I was a little jumpy

Okay,... moving on....

 

[fe3333au]

Message from the Darkside

A voice whispers from the shadows ...

Plan B anyone ???

What if Assyrain Bane moves SE towards a distant KISS settler ... he is opening the mysterious black to our view and perhaps leading to a special barbarian greeting for our friends

This is the open thoughts from Anon A Mouse

Note sure how to get image happening from this site ???

 

[General_W]

Plan B would be beautiful, and would solve a very serious problem... but It doesn't seem realistic. The KISS settler AND the Barb will both move before we get to go again. With any luck – the Barb is already heading for the settler, and there's not a KISS escort we can't see.

Oh – pray the RNG and the Great Meleet that their settler dies!!

But I don't think we can really plan on that bit of luck.

(@Fe - when you upload an image, on the first page that comes up, use the second link - "Thumbnail for Forums (1)" and just post that. It will show up like my images in my reports.)

 

[peter grimes]

I can only assume that we are all afraid the KISS settler is heading towards our spices. We should undertake every subterfuge in our arsenal to thwart this potentiality.

Unfortunately, I don't think there is any way we will make it to the spices with our settler before the other guy does. There are a few ways this could play out:

1. KISS settles on the spices. They will arrive ontop of the spices on turn 63. Turn 64 they could found the city. We lose the spices.

2. KISS settles a little distant from the spices. They could settle such that the spices are within their cultural borders. To accomplish this, they would found a city on turn 64 either NW or N of the spices. We lose the spices.

3. KISS settler gets harried on his way. If he gets harried, we can only still get the spices if he loses 2 turns. We could get Putrid Odour [or whatever Fe is naming his next city ] to a square adjacent to the spices on turn 65. How do we cost the settler two turns? We get the spices!

4. The barbarian angle. If we move SW, to 'uncover some more of teh black', we risk the barbarian attacking us with no defensive bonus.If we move due East, towards their settler, we bring our most valuably upgradeable unit out of immediate harm. This may also bring the barb closer to the settler. But, I believe the settler will actually be 1 tile SE of his visible location on our turn 59. We should move Assyrian Bane SE in that case. Either way, the barb cannot catch up to the settler. We lose the spices.

5. We send Fe's settler elsewhere.
5A: Since he is already so far along, head East and grab the Iron Hill near Heron. We could be on the forest west of the iron on turn 63.
5B: Since he is already so far along, head West and grab the incense tucked into the oases. We could be on the oasis SE of the incense on turn 63.
5C: Since he is already so close, settle WhiteDot and start that FP!
5D: Taking an ENORMOUS risk, forge straight ahead, due North into the unknown, hoping that there is a juicy resource smack in between the known ones: dyes and spices. It's really quite possible, considering what we already know of the symmetry of the map.
in any of these cases, we lose the spices.

These are really dire outcomes in terms of us securing the spices. However, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think we'll be tragically behind if (more like when) we don't secure the spices for ourselves.

Personally, and this is just my first reaction, I kind of like the idea of forging straight ahead into the unknown. The one thing that keeps nagging at the back of my mind: Where did KISS's Western Warrior go? Is he sitting on our spices? Has he discovered another juicy resource in the swampy jungle? Did he pop a hut so that we'll run into barbs? That's unlikely if that settler really is unescorted. I'll try and reconstruct some of his moves if I get a chance later on tonight.

 

[Chamnix]

AW Butes snap, crackle, and POP!

Do we really want to do this? I understand we want to pop it instead of KISS, but it would be better if we popped it with a settler. Unfortunately, I don't know how long it will be before we get a settler out there (Meleager want to weigh in?)

 

[peter grimes]

Majority shall rule on this: I say pop it. If chamnix is against (I can't really tell) then he cancels my vote. Any one else? It's ulitmately up to General_W, as the turnplayer. Also, any barbs that come will be a thorn in his behind if he's elected Defense Minister.