Term 5 Trade: Now the Bitterness is gone, lets get on with some trades.

[Donovan Zoi]

Well, I sure do hope everyone here is happy that they just scared away 2 new citizens to the demogame. Longasc and Moss.

Funny we should post at the same time on this matter, CT. Care to join us in the running of a mock government, or would you just like to make this a fun free-for-all? Since June, it has started to turn into one.

It is also not our fault that these two decided not to stay. This game is supposed to be about politics. Unfortunately they weren't warned of this before they were drafted at election time.

 

[Black_Hole]

Funny we should post at the same time on this matter, CT. Care to join us in the running of a mock government, or would you just like to make this a fun free-for-all? Since June, it has started to turn into one.

i have to agree with dz,
even though you say we scared 2 ppl away,
because of this fun free for all, many people have lost interest(including me) in the demogame, which isnt good for participation either

 

[Chieftess]

If I recall correctly, we were going into our 3rd month of arguing over the ruleset. Even Thunderfall told me he thought that was too long. Rik also thought it was too long, and we decided to start the game.

Now, let's get back to the game....

 

[Provolution]

Conflict is part of human nature, and it will always be friction. CIV3 is a strategy political and civilization building game, as well as a wargame, and nothing is more contentious issue like this. But I think politics is THE FUN, as optimizing buildqueues, tileusage etc etc alone is not as fun. Even Firaxis referred to corruption, worker usage, pollution removal and other things as "unfun" things they wanted to remove in Civ4, for more politics, civics and in-Civ multiplayer team cooperation like this. I am sick and tired of Civ-Assist and other CIV-stat cruncher programs. I am not a mathematician or an economist, I am a military
and business trained person that prefer the state-building part of the civgame, and here in the DG. However, I think that all the throwing of dirt on each other
during the election was unworthy, but I can see the frustration with the perceived bloc-voting of chatroom recruits, something I observed with the Samurai Citizen Group, dragging in new citizens to vote their bloc in chatrooms, as well as another citizen group I saw mobilized mass votes.

For me, it is not about being a DG veteran, but about being a Japanatica veteran. Whenever a new game starts, people should start with clean sheets, and forget all grudges, but within a DG, the lie of the land, resources, city placement, laws, wars and so on, leave political preferences, which makes the game deep. So I am against DG-veteran activity as such, but understands and supports some historicity in a particular DG as it adds what we really like here, personality, interesting and fun posts, entertaining exchanges and fascinating crisis handling situations as well as collision of plan and action. I made doctrines so we had a plan we could collide game reality with, and it has worked in my opinion, as warmongers can discuss strategy without actually going to war, whereas when war starts, we have a good grasp of our goals, and omptimize our units to get there.

Without military organizations and doctrines, we would have lost even more players of the warmongers that likes to plan strategies.

 

[Black_Hole]

ct i wasnt referring to the 3 monthes of time b4, but the direction this game is taking

 

[Cyc]

I'm glad you're staying too, CH. I would volunteer to be your Deputy, but Trade was never a strong point in my games, so you can easily find someone better than me to assist you.

I'm sure the people that left would have stayed had they had more goals in the game than walking away with an election.

 

[Donovan Zoi]

If I recall correctly, we were going into our 3rd month of arguing over the ruleset. Even Thunderfall told me he thought that was too long. Rik also thought it was too long, and we decided to start the game.

Now, let's get back to the game....

Though that was a big part of it, it is certainly not what I was referring to specifically. You just seem not to care about the law, that's all. And you are able to distance yourself from any accountability for your actions.

 

[blackheart]

Are we still arguing over there? It was blatantly obvious that there was some sort of block voting going on, otherwise how would any newcomers who hadn't participated in any discussions whatsoever even be able to get that many votes? It would be like someone dropping in one month before a presidential election and win 50% of the votes, that just doesn't happen unless some outside forces intervene. Longasc and Moss did not deserve to win either, Nobody and classical_hero have actually participated. It may sound unfair, but you must remember that Longasc (I think it was, or Moss) said he had been in the DG forums for a month, a month which no opinions, ideas, or questions were introduced by him.

 

[Crimso]

Well, I sure do hope everyone here is happy that they just scared away 2 new citizens to the demogame. Longasc and Moss.

You put Longasc in the position to be attacked. He helped by saying nothing. Moss insulted many citizens, calling people "whiners" and accusing them of having non-existent sex lives. It is unfortunate that he confused politics with flame wars.

Classical_Hero, I'm sorry that we've had to carry this argument in here, but as long as Cheiftess indirectly accuses me of 'scaring away' and 'discouraging' new players, I'll have to speak up. I am a new player.

 

[Provolution]

Well, I am a new player too, and I am probably one of the ones having to take a good share of flames. However, this is not a game for the faint-hearted, and I accept getting my verbal battering, as long as I am allowed to pay attention back. What I dislike is whimpering and hypocrysi, as in the last election, where I was factual and collected, the other party could go on undisturbed with his "material", but when I hit back after a long delay of patience with irony and humor, which actually had some teeth, his hidden and visible circle of compassionate associate friends surfaced and raised hell, asking for me to apologize after me responding to a long and continuous flaming campaign.


What I dislike is double standards. There is no carte blanche for citizens to insult and degrade other players, simply because they are in an office. And I expect no one to stand up for such a person calling for a unilateral apology from some misguided Amnesty International thinking, that is plain pathetic.
If you live by the sword, you die by the sword.

 

[Chieftess]

Moderator Action: Ok, let's stop arguing about who insulted whom and who started what. Perhaps I should make a new rule -- if anyone flames, trolls, berates, insults, etc, anyone who just joined the game and decided to run for an office or makes some suggestion, will be banned. Let's play nice. This warning is not directed at any particular person, but for everyone.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[blackheart]

Look at the name of this thread and look at what we're doing here, the irony!

 

[classical_hero]

Look at the name of this thread and look at what we're doing here, the irony!

What have I done to deserve this?

 

[classical_hero]

A new discussion is up. It is found here.

 

[classical_hero]

We have three trades this turn. Here they are.
Trade one.
Trade two.
Trade three.

 

[blackheart]

Minister CH,

Could you consider the possibility of giving TBD to another civilization to avoid a war? Likely candidates are Rome, Iroquois, Babylon, and Russia.

 

[Chieftess]

Russia is about to attack. Do you have any trade plans for the impending budget deficit?

 

[classical_hero]

Russia is about to attack. Do you have any trade plans for the impending budget deficit?

Russia are our best customers so i am not to pleased with them attacking us. Maybe we could offer them some coal to placate them.

 

[classical_hero]

Minister CH,

Could you consider the possibility of giving TBD to another civilization to avoid a war? Likely candidates are Rome, Iroquois, Babylon, and Russia.

That is not our jurisdiction. Please redirect your question to the FAmily.

 

[blackheart]

That is not our jurisdiction. Please redirect your question to the FAmily.

It's a gray area. Since technically it is sort of a trade... sort of...