TH2 high seas archipeliago tropics emperor

Arlborn · Mar 31, 2009

Report:

Turn 1: Revolt to Slavery.

Turn 2: Hindu spreads to Aksum. I didn't convert in my turnset because I saw no need for it. But next person probably should convert, as Aksum is near its happiness cap.

Spoiler :

I started the BUG auto logging now. Oops, forgot to do so in the first turn. No big deal I guess.

Turn 3: Bah, bad bad event:

Spoiler :

He drops from Pleased to Cautious.

Turn 4: Asoka adopts Org . Religion. I thought it worth of mention.
I whip the workboat in Gondar by the way.

Turn 5: Start lighthouse as a placeholder in Gondar for now. Just until it grows back again.

Turn 6: Wheel in, start Pottery.
GW BIAFAL.

...

Turn 9: Gundar is size 2 again, so starts a worker to come in 10 turns.

...

Turn 12: Pottery in, starts writing.

...
...
...

Turn 20: Nice:

Spoiler :

I start settler as a placeholder. Worker was finished in Gondar this same turn, lighthouse is set to continue from where I stopped, but, again, just a placeholder.

Stoneh. BIAFAL by the way.

Look what I explored in my turnset:

Spoiler :

Nice tropical paradise an? :goodjob:

Not much else to add. I think Aksum should build a settler and then a galley. Gandar should grow to size 3, so it can work the marble, which is being improved at the moment, and then build a settler as well to send off with the galley somewhere.

Log from BUG mod:

Spoiler :

Loki Strikes · Mar 31, 2009

Hmm good set, lighthouse next is a bit questionable in Gondar, I would build a granary for whipping fun, our general build order should be granary-lighthouse(no need for monument with creative, worker before was of course the right choice in this situation, but when it comes to granary v. lighthouse, granary wins every time, because it saves more food then a lighthouse will earn(barring ridiculous circumstance))

long winded, so if you didn't read my previous blurb, fine, my only real gripe is we are not hindu yet, we need to let that shared religion bonus boost and with the -1 event I am concerned... next player on turn 1 should go Hindu

Settler-Galley in Aksum sounds good, we need to seriously REX, I see no reason we shouldn't have 10 peaceful cities up in a reasonable time frame, with GLH and early foreign intercontinental trade routes :drool:

we should be able to REX to the ends of time.

My research suggestion holds with trading for both Alpha and Monarchy, and using priest as a pre req for COL, trade COL, Lit, Aesth if we need to for those techs

As soon as Asoka researches alpha, start researching it for trade, check every turn, grow the capital, use silver + nearby gold + monument with creative to grow while we wait for monarchy to hit home, this capital should decidedly not be cottaged, farm spam to grow it, run scientists at happy cap and switch to more productive tiles and spam some settlers, anyone know if we can chain farm to Gondar across the diagonal with the mountain there with CS?

nocho · Apr 1, 2009

Good job on the Great Lighthouse! :goodjob:

The game is in the bag now, let's move on to immortal

.

Loki Strikes said:
next player on turn 1 should go Hindu

Agree, but that's you according to roster! Don't knwo when you're available for play, maybe else Dave can pick it up.

Loki Strikes said:
anyone know if we can chain farm to Gondar across the diagonal with the mountain there with CS?

I would say so, but doesn't Gondar's irrigated corn itself provide with an irrigation source anyway? As Sengir knows, I'm an irrigation noob...
EDIT: I'll answer my own question: no. If you hover over the corn (well, either corn) it says "Farm (Not Irrigated)". Never noticed that before.

By the way, I'd like to scout Asoka's land when we can. Well, writing comes in 1 turn... To the extreme southeast there is maybe more to explore as well.

Sengir · Apr 1, 2009

I like Dave's dotmap, though I would add another city on the two tile island in the west.

Dotmap for the tropical island:

Spoiler :

About the irrigation:

Spoiler :

Green line is chain irrigation

Agree with Loki to trade with Asoka for Alpha and Monarchy. We can kill him afterwards if we deem it necessary. For now, convert ASAP, and try to get to pleased so we don't have to worry about him. Not sure about getting OB with him. I would wait a bit until we have rexed a bit more.

About Asoka's culture: we don't have to worry about it as it won't spread over two water tiles.

Dave Hartwick · Apr 1, 2009

Sengir, black dot needs to go 1E, right? Have you flagged the map? I'd rather not play tonight due to babysitting duty-- haven't even looked at the save today-- but I should have time in a couple hours to put up signs and upload the save again.

Rapid expansion is the name of the game for now, but if India takes some of weaker sites that's good, actually. They can pay the upkeep and we'll get another foreign trade route.

Sengir · Apr 1, 2009

No black tile stays where it is. I'd rather have landtiles then ocean tiles if I have a choice about it. Might change due to what's in the fog though, but wouldn't count on it.

nocho · Apr 1, 2009

A little slightly offbeat idea just occurred to me... By the looks of it Asoka can only reach either the newly discovered southern island, or all western islands using the shores of our main island.

We could consider settling cyan dot on our island more to the east, 1N or 2N of the rice. Losing the fish it will be a less attractive city, but it would have the huge advantage that after the 1st border pop Asoka cannot reach any of the islands without OB with us. We could then permanently deny him access to the islands, at least until we have settled them or he will reach astronomy...
We won't know what his island looks like either (at least until paper), unless we OB now and do a quick tour of his island, and close it when we settled the city and have the border pop. If we go with this idea I'd chop/whip the settler ASAP.

Well, just a thought I wanted to throw out.

EDIT: Well, looking better cyan dot with fish does the same thing. 1N of rice has the only advantage it doesn't need the border pop. Still would say to get the settler out quickly!

Dave Hartwick · Apr 1, 2009

OK, flagged the map, see what you think.

Spoiler :

Edit: I felt a need to explain the "Dave can't read a map" flag. The city shouldn't go there, I agree with Sengir, I just couldn't put a sign on an unexplored square. I usually hate explaining my little jokes, especially unprompted, but, y'know, clear communication.

Edit 2: I checked Loki's tech plane and looks OK, except I didn't see currency.

Aesthetics (702) for trade bait. Mysticism (117), Polytheism (234) req. for Lit (468). Could wait on Aesthetics and do the faster techs first as I don't see any signs of India developing quickly, eh. We're currently 23 beaker/turn IIRC, so I'm thinking library in capital but we're not going to farm much more there for a while, so the library would just be for the 25% bonus. I'd like the gold city to get settled expeditiously, right, we could use the research boost. The cap can build settlers and workers, it's not going to be much of a grower until CivServ comes in.

Unless I missed something, then we need Priesthood (139) for the Monarchy (702) trade. Then Currency (936) for CoL (819). Did I reckon right?

Loki Strikes · Apr 1, 2009

Trading COL for monarchy not priesthood, priesthood is pre req, we would self research currency after COL(COL is much better trade bait, AI's tend more to currency, then COL, and both would trade for monarchy, COL is cheaper, we want monarchy ASAP) and then go CS, I only set my plan out as far as COL as the next player was not going to get farther than COL, Aesthetics is first as we don't know how fast Asoka will get Alpha, mysticism and poly are erm not necessary other than as pre reqs, lit requires Aesthetics. In addition Aesthetics unlocks wonders, and we may be interested in parthenon ( I would advises against it, but hey)

Aesthetics first is safer because we have no need for monuments at this time, meditation and poly are useless other than as pre reqs for priest and lit, lit requires aesthetics and priest is a pre req for both monarchy and COL, but while allowing temples, would delay us on the way to lit.

IMO libraries can wait for awhile the 25% boost is negligible at this point, it is more valuable for allowing 2 scientists, and our cap doesn't have the food surplus as you pointed out, in another city a library to push out an early GS would be good, however I disagree with regards to the capital, the capital should be focused on pushing expansion, growing on granary/galley

It appears I am next, I can play tomorrow, I get back at 11 tonight, won't be able to play in all likelihood at that time due to jet lag/unpacking

nocho · Apr 1, 2009

The eastern flag map looks fine, I think next city should be "The other way" as it blocks as well after the pop. Even if Asoka slips a galley and settler past before we get the block, well, we'll have his main island blocked anyway from further galley intrusion which will be good anyway.

The western map doesn't look bad either, though I'm not totally convinced about the center island. I would maybe like to use the southern fish, but then it's difficult to get the bronze so I see the reasoning. Maybe even 3 cities might be settled there. Well, we can decide later...

Arlborn · Apr 1, 2009

I liked the eastern island dotmap, thoguh it is always risky to dotmap when you don't know all tiles yet. But it seems very solid.

Next city should still be in our own island, but and the next? The gold spot or eastern isle?

Dave Hartwick · Apr 1, 2009

Loki, if we can get a plan together maybe we can get in two sets tomorrow, I'm happy to swap for the earlier set as Thursdays are good for me. I could start playing in about 20 hrs from now. That'll be around 6:30 am EST. (I think you're a Yank but I got Arlborn wrong by a hemisphere.)

nocho, IMO the main thing is to cherry pick which spots to settle first. I guess we've got to go with the third on our main island next as we don't have a galley, but after that I'm voting for the gold island as it'll boost research.

Arlborn, IMO, after the gold island, one of the eastern sites, which one do you reckon?

Edit: Although it may have been rude, I should've taken the swap for granted in order to keep the game moving, but I had another game I wanted to finish. Then I played the Zulu start for a while. The land is bigger than it may have looked in the screenie, big enough to have Willem on the same island. He's down to his capital now, but I'm wishing I would've researched alphabet prior so I could extort some techs from him.

Loki Strikes · Apr 2, 2009

I am home now, will play the set shortly, I am up in 2 SGs, and have lots of homework.

Arlborn · Apr 2, 2009

Dave Hartwick said:
Loki, if we can get a plan together maybe we can get in two sets tomorrow, I'm happy to swap for the earlier set as Thursdays are good for me. I could start playing in about 20 hrs from now. That'll be around 6:30 am EST. (I think you're a Yank but I got Arlborn wrong by a hemisphere.)

nocho, IMO the main thing is to cherry pick which spots to settle first. I guess we've got to go with the third on our main island next as we don't have a galley, but after that I'm voting for the gold island as it'll boost research.

Arlborn, IMO, after the gold island, one of the eastern sites, which one do you reckon?

Edit: Although it may have been rude, I should've taken the swap for granted in order to keep the game moving, but I had another game I wanted to finish. Then I played the Zulu start for a while. The land is bigger than it may have looked in the screenie, big enough to have Willem on the same island. He's down to his capital now, but I'm wishing I would've researched alphabet prior so I could extort some techs from him.

Either black or yello dot! Black nets us the most new resources, while yellow is good for a compact empire, maybe?

Loki Strikes · Apr 2, 2009

Gripe: Gondar was still building a lighthouse instead of a granary first -.-, anyway I whipped it, put overflow into a granary, sent worker to mine Aksum's hill, other one built cottage for Gondar

Writing in, convert to Hinduism to please Asoka, decide against open border so we can get a few blockers up.

As a settler is being built for blocker city, I see a galley and curse our luck

Sure enough later in my set, however this isn't too bad, we have the West blocked off

Build a galley in Aksum after the settler, build another settler for gold city, after that queue another settler, after this settler next player should build library in prep for GL in Aksum

Aksum, build a library after this settler while getting as big a food surplus as possible to grow to size 6.

Gondar, I took the liberty of whipping in a library, when it grows next turn, put two scientists to work so we can push out an early GS for an academy

Built on blocker option as it takes more land tiles, and puts more of our starting island in BFC, the next city would claim the fish, whipped granary, whip lighthouse ASAP

Work boat is waiting here for the border pop to claim the clams, worker is mining gold, should road it after done.

Next city should go on blocker city east of Addis Ababa to cut off Asoka from the East continent, and cutting off Bombay from the rest of his empire :devil:

We can see Asoka's research, he seems heading towards writing now, he detoured and built the oracle in Delhi, I opened borders with him a short while after I saw his galley was past in order to get a workboat out of Gondar towards Addis Ababa, i took the liberty of closing borders again 10 turns later in order to make our block effective.

We should definitely research Lit next in order to get started on GL, after Lit, I vote priest-COL, Asoka still doesn't have alpha, remember to research a bit of Alpha and trade aesthetics for it, trade COL for monarchy when we can, research Currency - CS after COL

Bug Log below

Spoiler :

nocho · Apr 2, 2009

Bombay, isn't that the 2nd city on the Indian city list? Asoka's island must be tiny if his 2nd city is settled offshore.

I don't see directly what the use is of blocker city on the tiny island east of Addis Abeba, isn't Asoka already blocked as it is? Wouldn't we rather settle Bombay island before he does (although it should take Bombay a while to spit out settlers, I hope...)

Arlborn · Apr 2, 2009

nocho said:
Bombay, isn't that the 2nd city on the Indian city list? Asoka's island must be tiny if his 2nd city is settled offshore.

I don't see directly what the use is of blocker city on the tiny island east of Addis Abeba, isn't Asoka already blocked as it is? Wouldn't we rather settle Bombay island before he does (although it should take Bombay a while to spit out settlers, I hope...)

I am also still not sold on this nocho. If we build it there Asoka can't settle that island anymore with settlers from his capital. But that means also that Bombay will have more time to bump settlers of its own... I am leaning towards one city in eastern isle first and then a blocker city.

To explain lighthouse in Gandor; I started building it while waiting it to grow to size 2 so I could start a worker, like we've discussed prior to my turnset. Now, why didn't I start building a granary instead? Well, no pottery, doh. When I handed my save over, Gandor have just built its worker, so, as I said, lighthouse was only a placeholder. I hope I've made myself clear enough.

Dave Hartwick · Apr 2, 2009

Good REX, Loki. For my set, yes, very happy to research Lit and start the Great Library in the capital. Priesthood, CoL is good, and all that will take up my set and then some. I'm guessing we'll average something like 50 beakers/turn, so those 3 should take nearly 30 turns. I may stop after Priesthood. Actually, it may be more like 40 beakers when maintenance start climbing. We'll be needing currency.

I'd rather settle east island, red and black dot first. Has Asoka explored to the west? As I said earlier, I don't mind India getting some weak city sites, the AI can spend the hammers and upkeep on them until we're ready to take up residency or renovate.

The drawbacks of settling east first that I can see are that it's labor intensive land and requires iron working and calendar to exploit.

Er, got it. Can start play in 13 hours.

nocho · Apr 2, 2009

I would agree with settling east island first. Just wanted to say that there might be barbs, although Asoka should also take care of them. Maybe once the horses are up a chariot can be worthwhile just in case. The scout properly named Davy could be shipped there as well for fog busting activities and of course to see what's in the interior.
Wouldn't worry yet about needing IW, we must be able to trade for it at some point... Now it's just pure land grabbing first! Let's see if Asoka goes Alphabet soonish. Self researching Lit-Priest-CoL seems optimal. After that we'll see but I guess getting monarchy and CS will be priority.
Asoka won't reach the west if we don't open borders.

Dave Hartwick · Apr 3, 2009

Pregame: I take down a few signs and set research to 0%.

975 Lit in 468. The Temple of Artemis is available but even with marble the AIs love this wonder. I've never been able to build it. Still, it'd be nice. Anyway, Gondor warrior > warrior. Stagnate it until gold comes online.

925 Set research to 100%, Lit in 7. Aksum settler > library. Set it to work a coastal tile so library in 7 and it's growing a little.

900 mess up and move worker off gold before building road. Shrine in Delhi.

825 Gondor warrior > chariot. Gondor can grow again.

800 Good news, everyone! The forest we chopped near Aksum grows back.

775 For lack of other idleness, I trade fish for crab.

750 Aksum library > Great Library. Priesthood in 2.

725 Yeha founded on SE island. I didn't scout, just wanted to get it locked down. Hopefully not a mistake.

700 Decide to play through to Code of Laws. I'm still screwing around with this binary research baloney, so I'll sink the 0% research into Alphabet.

675 Lalibela lighthouse > chariot.

650 Library quest, Whip Lalibela.

Spoiler :

625 Lalibela chariot > settler. Somebody gets Confucianism.

600 Gondor chariot > settler. Whip Addis Ababa. Switch to Code of Laws.

575 AA granary > lighthouse.

525 Whip Gondor.

500 Gondor settler > worker. Barbarian archer sited on SE island. Chariot is in area. Thank you nocho.

450 archer dies attacking chariot, which is headed back to border to heal.

425 Research set for Iron Working, saved game, took some screenies.

Spoiler :

I would've liked to have gone on and at least saw what India will trade, but I wasn't confident in the Iron Working pick. If Loki was right, we'll get Alphabet and Monarchy and nothing else. There's a galley with settler & chariot headed west. If the barbs have a city on SE island it'll be a while before we can crack it. I didn't see any borders but it's pretty much all jungle.

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