The End of the War on Terror

Invading 2 countries with all that it takes from bоmbing/detaining/killing isn't terorism? Then what is? Resisting foreign occupation??

Thats BS. Bush didn't invade with the intent to kill as many people as possible. Resisting foreign occupation isn't terorism either, but attacking civilians is, which is what the "resistance" does all the time.

Have you seen videos or read articles about how 9/11 couldn't have been what it has been said to be?

You mean like loose change?

Like "dissecting" the body which struck the pentagon, or analzying the way the towers fell?

Are you talking about the "controlled demolition" theory?


Well, I can't prove the sky is blue either. But I can tell you one thing: If Bush (or Cheney, since Bush is just a puppet,

Yet, you have no real proof that he is. Just like you have no proof that Bush controls Al Qaida. Just your pathetic hatred causing you to come up with a bunch of BS.

and I sometimes sympathize with someone that stupid),

I symphasize with you for that same reason. :sad:

believed Iraq had WMDs,

Something just about all the democrats agreed with him on.

he would've never ever dared to approach them with military actoin; just like North Korea.

Yeah, we should have gone after DPRK instead.
 
I somewhat agree. After all we did say to saddam, surrender yourself or we will invade! But it still doesnt fit the definition of terrorism. If it does then blackmail would be considered terrorism.
Thank you for bringing that up. I might also add that he ALLOWED the searching of his palaces, yet you invaded anyway! Obviously it was a lame excuse, and that's exactly why Collin Powell didn't attend that security council meeting when they were supposed to vote on taking military action. America just went bullying (along with some poodle allies)

And if terrorism is "harming civilians for political goals", then that ends the question of whether your military/government are terrorists or not!


Please elaborate. What conspiracy theory are you buying about the 9/11 tragedy? I hope your not going to say it was a hoax... Oh brother.
Hoax? I am 100% certain it wasn't as simple as "19 suicide bombers hijacking a few planes". I'm saying there are conspicious "invisible hands" behind all that. Who benefitted from the post-9/11 attacks?


1. Never trust an idiot in control with one of the most powerful countries on the planet.

2. I can see you beileve everything you hear. Because I have seen no evidence Bush is a mindless puppet who does whatever cheney tells him. Way to buy into the popular misconception of who runs this country. :rolleyes:
1. He's not the one who's taking the decisions, he's just a "bright front", if you wanna call him bright :lol:
2. If I did believe everything I hear, I would've been convinced of the whole 9/11 story, that Iraq posessed WMDs, and that the Iraqi government is the "first democratic leadership in Iraq"!



Thats BS. Bush didn't invade with the intent to kill as many people as possible.
So, assuming Osama made 9/11 (I'm almost laughing at the thought, but nevermind), without the intent of killing as many americans as possible, but rather to deliver a message to america to stop starving Iraqis to death and support israel. Would that deny him being a "terrorist"?

You mean like loose change?
huh?

Are you talking about the "controlled demolition" theory?
Maybe, don't use complex English terms please!

Yet, you have no real proof that he is. Just like you have no proof that Bush controls Al Qaida. Just your pathetic hatred causing you to come up with a bunch of BS.
You're funny! You're speaking like you had proofs of the opposite.

I symphasize with you for that same reason
Thank you for "symphasizing" with me, I appreciate it :lol:

Something just about all the democrats agreed with him on.
"Big brother will accuse you of treason if you didn't acknowledge what he says"! Besides, even if that was true, doesn't make my argument invalid
 
And if terorism is "harming civilians for political goals", then that ends the question of whether your military/government are terorists or not!

150px-DoNotFeedTroll.svg.png


Dont feed him

Hoax? I am 100% certain it wasn't as simple as "19 suicidе bоmbers hijacking a few planes".

I'd say I'm about 50% certain your a troll right now.

I'm saying there are conspicious "invisible hands" behind all that. Who benefitted from the post-9/11 attacks?

No one.

1. He's not the one who's taking the decisions, he's just a "bright front", if you wanna call him bright :lol:

more conspiracies

2. If I did believe everything I hear, I would've been convinced of the whole 9/11 story, that Iraq posessed WMDs, and that the Iraqi government is the "first democratic leadership in Iraq"!

Perhaps he means you only believe what you want to hear, shutting off everything else and exchanging the truth for lies?

So, assuming Osama made 9/11 (I'm almost laughing at the thought, but nevermind), without the intent of kiling as many americans as possible, but rather to deliver a message to america to stop starving Iraqis to deаth and support israel. Would that deny him being a "terorist"?

He was attacking civilians, so yes, hes a terorist. The "starving of Iraqis" was not created by the US alone, but by the UN for Saddam's not obeying UN resolutions, but I'll agree with you here that it was wrong.


Loose Change is a "documentary on 9/11 akin to whatever crap propoganda your being fed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loose_Change_(video)

Maybe, don't use complex English terms please!

Basically I meant US made the building explode like how we destroy abandoned buildings.

You're funny! You're speaking like you had proofs of the opposite.

The burden of proof rests with the one who is making the outrageous claims.


Thank you for "symphasizing" with me, I appreciate it :lol:

Your welcome I guess.:crazyeye:

"Big brother will accuse you of treason if you didn't acknowledge what he says"!



Furthermore, I would like to ask whether it was the US or Mossad (Israel) and WHY the US or Israel would want to attack their own people?
 
Check out this cool wiki about it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9/11_conspiracy_theories

What a hypocrite, preventing people from following your lead! :p

I'd say I'm about 50% certain your a troll right now.
Is this more or less than previously assumed? :D

Let's see...
1) More powers for the government, less civil liberties
2) More weapon factories production
3) More halliburton bu$$ine$$, "mysteriously" linked to Chiney


lool!!! I liked it!

Perhaps he means you only believe what you want to hear, shutting off everything else and exchanging the truth for lies?
Ok that's fair :)

He was attacking civilians, so yes, hes a terorist.
Um.. doesn't this ring a bell at the back of your head? :mischief:

Loose Change is a "documentary on 9/11 akin to whatever crap propoganda your being fed
Yes I believe in "crap propagandas" :lol:

Basically I meant US made the building explode like how we destroy abandoned buildings.
Possibly. Or intentionally ignored the planes going off-route. Remember the "body" which hit the pentagon turned out to have no wings!

The burden of proof rests with the one who is making the outrageous claims.
I find it outragous to assume that a poor guy hiding in the caves of Afghanestan could do this.

Furthermore, I would like to ask whether it was the US or Mossad (Israel) and WHY the US or Israel would want to attack their own people?
Ahem ahem, it was Suddam Hosein of course with his WMD's, as your trusted Georgy thought :cool:

Now being serious again, I insist that your work out your brain's butt and tell me who benefitted from the attacks? This will answer alot of questions...

Ok, so there hasn't been "if you don't approve the new legislations/wars, you're not a patriot" syndrome?
 
Or when Christianity is finally crushed and Islam and civilization florishes in the West! :lol:
 
It is fun to watch trolls of both sides go at it, but miserable later when they assume that because their opponent was a troll once, legitimate disagreement canot exist.

I hereby declare a synthesis of the current thesis and antithesis: Both America and Islam are full of crap right now for various reasons, and could do with having their current leaders thrown out en masse.
 
Why do they have to be Islamic Fundamentalists? Should we not aim for all terrorists, no matter of race or religion?

No because we are not at war with all terrorists. Bush screwed up while defining the war. We are at war with a group of people that are islamic extremists. They fight using terrorism as a tactic.


Once can quite easily go from moderate muslim to radical islamist under idelogically-warping duress, while I'm hard-pressed to remember the point at which Russians were magically becoming teutonically blond.

I disagree. Islam is a religion. I find it hard pressed to find people that would change religions 'moderate islam' to 'extreme islam' at the drop of a hat. Developing some sort of nationalism as in the nature of most wars seems much more plausable.

But either way, it is completly irrelevant. In every single war when the defending nation fights back they are going to piss off some people and make them the enemy. Or at least got them to pick up arms. It has happened in every single war in mankind, and it will continue to happen in every single war.
 
No, Sweden has troops in Afghanestan (I was shocked when I knew). They just like to pretend they're "peaceful and innocent"

But I like China. They're just growing silently without hating anyone or making anyone hate them

Anyway, I'd like to point that American actions are fueling Islamic fundamentalists.. you can't support Moslem dictators, starve 1.5 million Moslems, and conquer 2 Moslem countries with all what that entails without expecting to be hated
 
Is this more or less than previously assumed? :D

a little more.

Let's see...
1) More powers for the government, less civil liberties

We haven't lost any civil liberties.

2) More weapon factories production
3) More halliburton bu$$ine$$, "mysteriously" linked to Chiney

What does this have to do with 9/11?

Um.. doesn't this ring a bell at the back of your head? :mischief:

The American soldiers aren't being sent to Iraq and Afghanistan with orders to murdur civilians.

Yes I believe in "crap propagandas" :lol:

Much of the things you have written doesn't seem to be based in reality. I assumed propoganda would be the reason.

I find it outragous to assume that a poor guy hiding in the caves of Afghanestan could do this.

I find it even more outragous that the US or Israel would want to kill their own people like that.

Al Qaeda is hardly a "poor guy hiding in the caves". The kiling & capture of al-Qaida fighters and leaders by Iraqi & Coalition forces is a near daily occurence in Iraq

Ahem ahem, it was Suddam Hosein of course with his WMD's, as your trusted Georgy thought :cool:

Saddam was not involved in 9/11. Everyone here in the US knows this.

Now being serious again, I insist that your work out your brain's butt and tell me who benefitted from the attacks? This will answer alot of questions...

I answered that above. I don't believe anyone really "benefited" from the attacks.

Ok, so there hasn't been "if you don't approve the new legislations/wars, you're not a patriot" syndrome?

No, but I was not trying to imply that in my posts.

No, Sweden has troops in Afghanestan (I was shocked when I knew). They just like to pretend they're "peaceful and inocent"

They are peaceful. The Swedish troops, like all the troops in Afghanistan are a peacekeeping force. What's really funny is that while many muslims like you, far removed from the actual battlegrounds call the foreign forces murdurers and rapists while 88% of the Afghans themselves think it was good that the foreign peacekeeping forces are there.

Anyway, I'd like to point that American actions are fueling Islamic fundamentalists.. you can't support Moslem dictators, starve 1.5 million Moslems,

Agreed. That was wrong.

and conquer 2 Moslem countries with all what that entails without expecting to be hаted

We didn't conquer Iraq or Afghanistan. Those nations have independent governments now and they can ask the Americans to leave at any time. If you want to say the Iraqi government is a puppet, I will preemptively say that if the Iraqis thought there votes didn't matter, 70% of them wouldn't have participated in the elections.
 
We haven't lost any civil liberties.
You don't know that the government can tape your phone, and detain you without having your lawyer? That is, if they don't think you're too dangerous and decide to send you to a secret prison in Eastern Europe (so much for human rights)

What does this have to do with 9/11.
Um, you're joking right?

The American soldiers aren't being sent to Iraq and Afghanistan with orders to murdur civilians.
But they do nevertheless. The point is, both parties "kill civilians if they conflict with their basic missions". Whether they're madly laughing while doing it or being torn by tears of remorse


Much of the things you have written doesn't seem to be based in reality. I assumed propoganda would be the reason.
I'm accusing you with the same

I find it even more outragous that the US or Israel would want to kill their own people like that.
I don't, considering how immoral they are. Bush and Sharon (the war criminal) aren't saints

Al Qaeda is hardly a "poor guy hiding in the caves". The kiling & capture of al-Qaida fighters and leaders by Iraqi & Coalition forces is a near daily occurence in Iraq
Ah, but if they're that tough, why haven't they did more attacks against the US? Isn't it a funny "coinsidence" that they just happen to do a single attack in every Western country? (US, UK, Spain). Oh and mentioning Spain, first they said the attacks were by ETA, then came back and said they were Islamic terrorists :lol:

Saddam was not involved in 9/11. Everyone here in the US knows this.
Except the president & the CIA, who -among other reasons to invade Iraq- said they were linked

I answered that above. I don't believe anyone really "benefited" from the attacks.
Are you so short-sighted that you can't see that, for example, Chiney didn't guess that Halliburton could benefit if 9/11 occured? Because that would be an excuse to go bullying in oil-rich places?

They are peaceful. The Swedish troops, like all the troops in Afghanistan are a peacekeeping force. What's really funny is that while many muslims like you, far removed from the actual battlegrounds call the foreign forces murdurers and rapists
It's easy to say that Taleban are keeping peace in Afghanestan, too. Can you please define a "peace keeping mission" and tell me how's that any different than "an occupant who's crushing the resistence"?

while 88% of the Afghans themselves think it was good that the foreign peacekeeping forces are there.
Source?



We didn't conquer Iraq or Afghanistan. Those nations have independent governments now and they can ask the Americans to leave at any time
Good one :lol:

If you want to say the Iraqi government is a puppet,
Which is needless to even say...

I will preemptively say that if the Iraqis thought there votes didn't matter, 70% of them wouldn't have participated in the elections.
Dude, I come from Egypt. In my country, you can easily have 90% of the population "participating" in an election when in reality no more than 10% came. Of course, actual numbers aren't that extreme. But because you're a Western you're not familiar with, nor expecting how common and easy forging and corruption are where I come from.

I'd also say that you (Westerns in general) are very simple-minded, no insult meant. If the government/media says something, then it's the fact, and everybody belying them is a skeptic conspiracy-theorist. I tend to -among many other Arabs/Moslems- laugh (literally) at the declarations our leaders say. Problem with Westerns is that they very easily fall for those lies.. like a young innocent child who has never been cheated nor exposed to lies, so he assumes the world is free of cheats and lies, and looks up with innocent eyes inquiring (in a funny accent) "Don't the Iraqis have a free government now, like uncle Bush said"?
 
Great, and I was thinking of immigrating to Norway or Iceland when I'm rich :(

It's Iceland then ;)
 
You don't know that the government can tape your phone,

IIRC, they only tape foreign phone calls.

Um, you're joking right?

I fail to see how weapons manufacturing and Halliburton would benefit from a US conspiracy to murdur their own people.

But they do nevertheless. The point is, both parties "kill civilians if they conflict with their basic missions".

Depends. American soldiers who attack and kill Iraqi people and families for no justifiable reason are punished. If some "civilians" attack the Americans with guns, they are justified for fighting back.

Ah, but if they're that tough, why haven't they did more attacks against the US? Isn't it a funny "coinsidence" that they just happen to do a single attack in every Western country? (US, UK, Spain).

So? Their not that powerful that they can attack "all the time".

Except the president & the CIA, who -among other reasons to invade Iraq- said they were linked

They said Iraq and Al-Qa'eda were linked, not that Saddam did 9/11. Like this comment by former CIA Director George Tenet in a letter to the Senate Intelligence Committee on October 7, 2002:

"Credible reporting states that al Qaeda leaders sought contacts in Iraq who could help them acquire WMD capabilities. The reporting also stated that Iraq has provided training to al Qaeda members in the areas of poisons and gases and making conventional bоmbs."

9/11 Commission Vice-Chairman (and former Democratic Congressman) Lee Hamiliton echoed exactly that point in these comments:

"The vice president is saying, I think, that there were connections between Al Qaeda and the Saddam Hussein government. We don't disagree with that. What we have said is what the governor (Commission Chairman Thomas Kean) just said, we don't have any evidence of a cooperative, or a corroborative, relationship between Saddam Hussein's government and these Al Qaeda operatives with regard to the attacks on the United States."

Are you so short-sighted that you can't see that, for example, Chiney didn't guess that Halliburton could benefit if 9/11 occured? Because that would be an excuse to go bullying in oil-rich places?

You'd think that if we went in for the oil we might have..... you know, stolen some of it according to the plan?

It's easy to say that Taleban are keeping peace in Afghanestan, too. Can you please define a "peace keeping mission" and tell me how's that different than "an occupant who's crushing the resistence"?

The "resistance" has the hatred of the Afghans. Only 3% support them. (see below for source)


Recent poll

A few things from that:

88% support the current government versus 3% supporting the Taliban.

88% versus 11% think it was good that the US arrived.

And only 5% support Osama Bin Laden.


Which is needless to even say...

The Iraqi government has disagreed with the US several times before. The war between Israel and Hizballah and the issue over Iran's nukes came to mind. Furthermore, is all 300 or so political parties in Iraq just American pupets?

Dude, I come from Egypt. In my country, you can easily have 90% of the population "participating" in an election when in reality no more than 10% came. Of course, actual numbers aren't that extreme. But because you're a Western you're not familiar, not expecting, how common and easy forging and corruption are where I come from.

So, the BBC is "forging" this?

I'd also say that you (Westerns in general) are very simple-minded, no insult meant.

No insult taken. I will counter by saying that the mid-easterners think the whole world is "us vs. them" with "them" being the cause of all the problems in the world while the mideasterners are peaceful victims of the west constantly accused of crimes that were forged by the west. Thus, they are less likely to think logically and this leads to a higher chance in the belief in conspiracy theories.

If the government/media says something, then it's the fact, and everybody else is a skeptic conspiracy-theorist.

Lots of people here are skeptical of our government.

I tend to -among many other Arabs/Moslems- laugh (literally) at the declarations our leaders say.

fair enough.:)
 
Great, and I was thinking of immigrating to Norway or Iceland when I'm rich :(

It's Iceland then ;)

Definitely Iceland, Norway has troops in Afghanistan! :eek:

(IIRC, "troops" here is something like six or eight civilian engineers whose job is to disarm mines, and four jets without personnel on loan to the coalition force there.)
 
IIRC, they only tape foreign phone calls.
Even if that was true, isn't that "taping American phones"? They weren't allowed to do that prior to 9/11, among other things...
There's also monitering emails and internet, but that's prior to 9/11 I think

I fail to see how weapons manufacturing and Halliburton would benefit from a US conspiracy to murdur their own people.
Hmm and I thought you were smart! (j/k, I didn't ;)) Ok Fox I'll try to clarify: by murdering their own people they can make an excuse to wage war. During this war, weapon manufacturers would make alot of money by selling arms to the US army (to wage that war, remember?). Also, Halliburton would make aloooot of money by exploiting the oil resources in the land where that war was waged (which was caused by murdering the people).. got it?

Depends. American soldiers who attack and kill Iraqi people and families for no justifiable reason are punished. If some "civilians" attack the Americans with guns, they are justified for fighting back.
What happens often (every other week or so?) is that Americans bomb houses, weddings, or mosques! Needless to say, tens of civlians in Iraq and Afghanestan are killed and deformed by these raids. Usually of whom most are women & children (it's not that women & children don't suck, but still...)

So? Their not that powerful that they can attack "all the time".
I don't find this to make sense, and it perfectly matches my conspiracy theory. You find it making sense, fine.

They said Iraq and Al-Qa'eda were linked, not that Saddam did 9/11. Like this comment by former CIA Director George Tenet in a letter to the Senate Intelligence Committee on October 7, 2002:
Anyway I was being sarcastic.. of course I don't think Suddam nor Al-Qu'da did nor could do them

You'd think that if we went in for the oil we might have..... you know, stolen some of it according to the plan?
And you did! 75% of the Iraqi exported oil is given to American and British companies*, which is about 80 billion dollars since April 2003. With no contracts given to Russian, German, or French companies (rings a bell?) to "rebuild" Iraq.

88% support the current government versus 3% supporting the Taliban.

88% versus 11% think it was good that the US arrived.

And only 5% support Osama Bin Laden.
I don't see why a poll conducted by BBC/ABC news would be unbiased when you're comparing America with Osama! Did you expect BBC to say that 90% of Afghans want Taleban back, and condemn the American invasion of their country?? Let Aljazeera conduct such a poll and you'll get the same numbers, switched (which, btw, the Iraqi democratic government kicked out of the country & closed their office)

The Iraqi government has disagreed with the US several times before. The war between Israel and Hizballah and the issue over Iran's nukes came to mind.
Don't be funny, Egypt "disagees" with the US all the time! Does this mean we're not slaves to the Americans? Does it mean that our "president" (for 1/4 of a century now :king:) is not an American puppet? Where's the American Freedom to Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Qutur, are all these US-allies democratic? Or did you only remember to rescue the Iraqis?? Give me a break!

Furthermore, is all 300 or so political parties in Iraq just American pupets?
I don't know if they're 300, but I know for sure that not all 300 are in power ;). The ones ruling are the ones with the American blessing

So, the BBC is "forging" this?
Why don't we examine the sources of BBC first??
A spokesman for the International Mission for Iraqi Elections conceded that ..
US President George W Bush described the vote as...
... said Paul Dacey, spokesman for the international observers.

When will you stop dealing with what BBC and CNN say as undeniable facts, surely clean of any political intentions?


I will counter by saying that the mid-easterners think the whole world is "us vs. them" with "them" being the cause of all the problems in the world while the mideasterners are peaceful victims of the west constantly accused of crimes that were forged by the west. Thus, they are less likely to think logically and this leads to a higher chance in the belief in conspiracy theories.
Just a small correction, it's the "Jews" more than the "West". But I agree; our main problem is our own weakness. The West is plotting against China and N. Korea, but they stood strong. It's because we suck, not that the Americans exist (though not denying old and new colonization is part of our problems, of course --> you've been causing us headaches since like 1071!)

Lots of people here are skeptical of our government.
Maybe, but certainly not enough to stop a right-wing "christian crusader" maniac from getting elected twice!

(IIRC, "troops" here is something like six or eight civilian engineers whose job is to disarm mines, and four jets without personnel on loan to the coalition force there.)
Disarming mines of the resistence and lending jets to occupation forces is moral? Even if it was totally ineffective, it's a matter of principle! By deploying any type of force you're supporting the idea of occupation, which I thought Norway was more civilized than, till today! So it's not only Sweden!! Shame on you, I'll be migrating to israel then :p

*check clarification next page
 
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