The Grand Inquisitor's Office

[blackheart]

With SD3 holding an emergency TC to investigate probable cause of threat for the Aztec and Babylonians, I think it wise of us to discuss how to go about finding this threat. I propose we investigate the Aztec city of Tenochtitlan and see what its current culture and culturaly growth is. We should also investigate Akkad of Babylon and any other border cities (of any nation) that represents a cultural center.

 

[Sir Donald III]

Thank you for the quick Response, Governor. I was about ot open such a thread myself, since we now have 72 Hours to conduct business.

 

[Nobody]

if we were playing conquest this would be much easyier.

 

[Provolution]

MSAV has the following to say:

1. We want to cancel our Privateer build and would follow Furieys proposal for a cathedral or university in Manchai, and rush that with financial aid.

2. We support FA and Culture to investigate Tenochtitalen, but from a MSAV standpoint, we want a report of the garrison there, as well as buildings present.

 

[Sir Donald III]

Other explorable options include investigating not only Akkad, but also Ur and Elippi.

 

[Ashburnham]

Let us not forget that our closest cultural rival is not Azteca or Babylon, but France. If were are going to go on a rash of investigations, we should focus some of our energy towards the French as well.

 

[GenMarshall]

Ok, if we are going to investigate these hostile nations cities, perferably there border cities. Which means I would need funding to cover the cost of city investigations.

 

[blackheart]

Let us not forget that our closest cultural rival is not Azteca or Babylon, but France. If were are going to go on a rash of investigations, we should focus some of our energy towards the French as well.

That is why I propose the investigation of border cities that are possible cultural centers. These cities would be ones that are medium or large in size, has terrain improvements, and isn't on bad terrain (like tundra or desert). I don't think we need to investigate the Zulu, as their cities have already fallen to our culture.

 

[MOTH]

The Culture Minster has performed some analysis based on the archives of our great nation. Minister MOTH feels that there is no immediate need to investigate either Akkad or Tenochtitlan. Minister MOTH does wish to recommend that we rush build a Colosseum in Epolenep as soon as we can (turn 1) as this should give the edge in culture back to Epolenep.

I would also like to point out that in this policy poll the people voted for a 'moderate' level for fighting culture wars. Specifically, the use of 'investigate city' was not selected. This would mean that any such use would need to override the policy by attaining 55% of the vote with a 13 person quorum.

Research and Analysis:
There are 2 primary cities in question:
1. Akkad - This city just (8 turns ago) passed Epo in total culture. It has not yet reached 1000 culture. Within 6 turns Epo will pass 1000 culture. By watching when Akkad's border expands (out to see) we can guage how much of a lead Akkad now has. What does Akkad have? My guess is an Ancient Library - 6, Catherdral - 3, University - 4, Colosseum - 2 = 15 cpt. I'm guessing there is no temple based on old saves (90 BC (t123) - no culture; 110 (t133) AD 10-99 culture; 460 (t-161) AD 100+ culture) - this was 3 cpt to expand to 100 culture in this time period - thus a Library.

In any case, there is only one short-term peaceful solution: Rush a colosseum as soon as possible. On turn 1 this will cost 444G and will boost culture per turn to 16. This will start gaining back the deficit. I don't think an 'investigate city' is worthwhile as it couldn't tell us much.

2. Tenochtitlan - This city was estimated to have over 3000 Culture. I would estimate as much as 33 cpt - Palace 2, Temple 4, Library 6, Cathedreal 3, University 4, Colosseum 2, Oracle 12, Sun Tzu's 2. We are on turn 249 so there are 301 turns to go. Intentionally overestimating and given eventual doubles for 11 more cpt + 2 for Research Lab this is 46 cpt. 301 * 46 = 13846 + 3000 they have now = 17000 at game end. This city will not win 20K unless they manage to build more great wonders. I do not see a need to investigate this city unless it crosses the 10000 culture point much earlier that expected (before turn 350).

 

[Provolution]

Minister MOTH, good work, now we know that if they get one more cultural wonder withuin turn 350, we should put Tenochtitlan on a watchlist, until then, we leave them alone. At least I pointed this out, since it came out as a city leader, and we figured it out. I think Term IV is going to be very quiet and harmonious.

 

[Ashburnham]

Excellent analysis, MOTH. However, not to second guess you, but just to be safe, I still think we should investigate Tenochtitlan. That city is the major threat against us currently, and an accurate evaluation of its culture would help our nation greatly. It's also very easy to get as well, less than 200 gold.

 

[Furiey]

I agree with minister MOTH in his stance with city investigations at this time. We can see without an investigation that Tenochtitlan only has two Wonders and when they were built, insufficient for a 20k victory - watch it - definitely. I'm not sure how Akkad can have a Cathedral without a Temple however. We know the most that can be there, and when it overtook Epolenep, I would prefer to spend the money rushing rather than investigating (OK it's only 24 gold).

The horses tiles is shared between Epolenep, Manchai and Akkad. Akkad has just claimed it, and yes we can rush a Coliseum in Epo. We can also use Manchai, which is currently building a Privateer and only has a Temple and Library even though it is right on the border with Babylon. We could switch the Privateer to a Cathedral (completed in 10 turns) and rush it for 184 gold, or a Uni (completed in 34 turns) and rush it for 664 gold. I believe this would be better use of Manchai's production capability than a soon to be outdated Privateer.

 

[Stuck_as_a_Mac]

Trade states the following:
We have no trades going on with either of these countries. They are backwards compared to us, so we need not worry about loss of GPT. Also, due to this backwardness our Cavs and even our Samis should have no problem rolling over them.

SaaM

 

[Provolution]

Well, MSAV raised hell by presenting a military remedy on the table, and people got their eyes up for the only potential computer win at this stage. Tenochtitlan need one more wonder to deny us the histograph win.

 

[blackheart]

Well, MSAV raised hell by presenting a military remedy on the table, and people got their eyes up for the only potential computer win at this stage. Tenochtitlan need one more wonder to deny us the histograph win.

And we need only 7 samurai to cripple them. We've got 3k gold, why not spend a few hundred to see the rate of which Tenochtitlan's culture is growing?

 

[MOTH]

@furiey,
You are right abut a temple before a cathedral. I was concentrated in my analysis of the early years and which was built first. This does make the situation more grave as there is another building that could be doubled or close to doubling. Epo's Library won't double until 1460AD and the other buildings will never double. I also agree that we should investigate Akkad. I start a poll on this and on Tenochtitlan for the next turn chat.

 

[Sir Donald III]

Remember, there is an Emergency tC Tuesday Evening. Make your polls sometime today, please.

 

[Provolution]

SD3, just poll Republic, since Zarn since to forget about it.

 

[Ashburnham]

The horses tiles is shared between Epolenep, Manchai and Akkad. Akkad has just claimed it, and yes we can rush a Coliseum in Epo. We can also use Manchai, which is currently building a Privateer and only has a Temple and Library even though it is right on the border with Babylon. We could switch the Privateer to a Cathedral (completed in 10 turns) and rush it for 184 gold, or a Uni (completed in 34 turns) and rush it for 664 gold. I believe this would be better use of Manchai's production capability than a soon to be outdated Privateer.

I agree with the idea of changing Manchai's production to something cultural. If people are really worried about that Babylonian border, we should be doing something about it instead of building military units we'll never use. The university is a bit expensive, but the cathedral doesn't look like a stretch at all.

 

[Ginger_Ale]

I agree with the idea of changing Manchai's production to something cultural. If people are really worried about that Babylonian border, we should be doing something about it instead of building military units we'll never use. The university is a bit expensive, but the cathedral doesn't look like a stretch at all.

I will try to include these in build queues.

The problem with manchai is that it doesn't get much production. It can either work coast tiles to grow evenly with 2 food, but no shields, or work hills, but not get a lot of food.