The Greek Thread

[Boris Gudenuf]

I hear you. It's just a bit boring to me that this geography is always only represented in the people who conquered it (city names from Asia Minor only show up for Macedon and Persia). I think it is ripe for focus.

However, if we can only have one, that would be an interesting curveball actually, having a Greece design/leader focused on Asia Minor rather than Greece.

Or Magna Graeca, the area of Greek colonies in southern Italy (Napoli started out at Neapolis - "New City" in Greek) and Sicily.
A "Greek Sicily" with Dionysus as Leader would be something different: a distinctly non-Democratic polity, Syracuse as the largest city in the Greek-speaking world (much larger than Athens even at its Classical peak) with interesting potential as cultural/philosophical, military, and diplomatic Uniques.

Geographically, of course, any such 'Greek' Western center conflicts with Rome and, as it did historically, with Carthage, both of which are as close to certain Civ inclusions as we've got.

If they wanted to go that route of a Greek leader who fought for Persia against other Greeks, look no further than Artemesia. She's more well known and a female.

Or Alcibiades: fought for Athens against Sparta, for Sparta against Athens, for Athens against Persia, for Persia against Athens, was actually, according to accounts, a pretty good land or naval military leader, if you could pin him to one side long enough . . .

 

[pokiehl]

Or Alcibiades: fought for Athens against Sparta, for Sparta against Athens, for Athens against Persia, for Persia against Athens, was actually, according to accounts, a pretty good land or naval military leader, if you could pin him to one side long enough . . .

Alcibiades is one of the most interesting historical figures of all time. His representation in Civ is well deserved!

 

[Patine]

I NEVER Agree with Cleo VII of Ptolemy Dynasty as being GREAT LEADER of EGYPT. Of course Beauty World, Hollywood and even LGBT world would fancy her as something to worship but as a good leader I DON'T Think she IS.
What she did... flirting with Iulius Caesar for a bid to control BOTH Roma and Alexandria without understanding how Republic of Rome works is a dangerous gambit that eventually liquidate her and the whole Ptolemic Egypt. It turned out that a roman leader she rejected (Octavius, one of several Caesar's successors, and rival to Marcus Antonius whom she chose after Caesar is minced.) emerged victorious and that rejection is ironically made him evenmore legitimate leader of not being under Barbarian Control.
Actually if Cleo is gonna return. Octavius should lead Rome as The First Citizen (he NEVER use the title 'Emperor' but he set the 'Imperial' System in place of shaky Republic that crumbled on its own weight). the two leaders are expected to be bitter Rivals, not Lovers.
If Cleo is not. Either Hetshepsut (not so easy to spell her name), or Ramses (Two or Three, the latter who invented Archer Galleys) should do.

well, he could have a ton of cloaks on him.

Controversial opinion - Leave them out of the base game

When picking civs for the base game, I assume 20 civs and I want them to equally represent different points (Ancient, Medieval, Industrial, Modern) in the game. I also go for balance across different regions.
Greece (obviously in my opinion) would be an ancient, European faction. They fall into the same categories as Rome. Both are obviously important factions, I slightly prefer Rome, in this context.
(For reference my other ancient picks are India, Babylon, Persia, Egypt and other Europeans are France, England, Germany, Russia)

Give Greece a couple of city-states initially and add them as DLC later. I feel like Greece is quite versatile in terms of how you choose to portray them, as a result I'd pick a leader/abilities based on which game mechanic you feel is under-represented in terms of special abilities (if that makes sense). I prefer Greece without Macedon but it's also not outrageous to have both.

Yeah, I was referring to Cleopatra of Epirus

Some show up on Greece's city-list like Pergamon and Phocaea. But sure, adding more cities away from Greece proper would help solve that. Persia could easily get more cities that are located in modern-day country of Iran. I realize why they added cities like Halicarnassus, but it also is kind of weird now when Nader Shah founds it.
And well Alexander/Macedon could go back to Greece.

Or Magna Graeca, the area of Greek colonies in southern Italy (Napoli started out at Neapolis - "New City" in Greek) and Sicily.
A "Greek Sicily" with Dionysus as Leader would be something different: a distinctly non-Democratic polity, Syracuse as the largest city in the Greek-speaking world (much larger than Athens even at its Classical peak) with interesting potential as cultural/philosophical, military, and diplomatic Uniques.

Geographically, of course, any such 'Greek' Western center conflicts with Rome and, as it did historically, with Carthage, both of which are as close to certain Civ inclusions as we've got.


Or Alcibiades: fought for Athens against Sparta, for Sparta against Athens, for Athens against Persia, for Persia against Athens, was actually, according to accounts, a pretty good land or naval military leader, if you could pin him to one side long enough . . .

Alcibiades is one of the most interesting historical figures of all time. His representation in Civ is well deserved!

Or something completely different, but probably very contentious, or needing to be an alternative, and not my PERSONAL or OFFICIAL suggestion, at this point https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ioannis_Kapodistrias

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Alcibiades is one of the most interesting historical figures of all time. His representation in Civ is well deserved!

Equally true is that he is one of the most Fantastic of all historical characters, and for that reason alone deserves a place in a Historical Fantasy game like Civ!