1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

The logic behind resources bonuses

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by kalandra, Dec 15, 2012.

  1. robyextreme

    robyextreme Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2003
    Messages:
    231
    Location:
    Canada
    Lol funny one is taj mahal becoming available before astronomy. Pretty sure global currency is the reason that thing was able to be built.
     
  2. SquirrelCensus

    SquirrelCensus Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2012
    Messages:
    25
    That might be a conscious decision on the part of the developers, they force you to choose weather the resource or the gold is more important. In real life, a town might be more profitable than a banana plantation, BUT if you don't build that plantation you can't grow and distribute bananas. You, Dear Leader, have to make that call: Do I build a cottage and increase the commerce of my empire, or do I build a plantation and increase the health/happiness/bargaining power of my empire?
     
  3. Alchemind

    Alchemind Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2012
    Messages:
    132
    Rice is a pathetic crop and should be shamed.
     
  4. noto2

    noto2 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,709
    @squirrel: I doubt the devs were doing it intentionally...I mean...have you seen the rest of the game? Firaxis doesn't appear to understand the concept of balance
     
  5. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    Hard to tell if this is sarcasm or not.
     
  6. noto2

    noto2 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,709
    @nfw: why? Although civ games might have runaway civs, it's not nearly as imbalanced as real life. If you were to try to base a saved game on history you would have to have the British with factories, coal plants, and something in between a red coat and modern infantry, as well as destroyers, when India and China are still using medieval units like chokonus and galleons, and the native Americans would be using bronze age units. It would be realistic, but it wouldn't be very fun
     
  7. Apricottage

    Apricottage Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2012
    Messages:
    111
    Agreed. Games would be pointless, because the winner would always be the one who historically won (with a few EXTREMELY notable exceptions, like the American Revolution: it's shocking how incredibly CLOSE that victory was).

    Regarding resources... I guess I'd mostly just like to see later resources get more of a bonus. Right now, there's no difference between Copper and Coal (although Aluminum is marginally better), and Gold blows all the Calendar resources out of the water. Oil was brought up; it's ridiculous how bad it is given how late in the game it appears (and what tiles it appears on). It's the Islam problem all over again. Actually, this problem kind of resounds through the entire game: the devs completely failed to make the late-game scale up in power appropriately so that it's balanced with the early-game. Oh well.
     
  8. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    Isn't that the point? Or do you try and become the weakest civ in your game?
     
  9. damerell

    damerell Slow Worker

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    804
    Location:
    UK
    Ah, I see the problem. Let me explain. Of course we as players try to become as strong as possible; we want to win. But the game should provide us with a fair chance to do so - it doesn't make us play 1,000 turns of not developing Agriculture because it makes no sense in the terrain we started in and then getting curb stomped by Europeans - and with a challenging game when we do try it, so equally we never turn up after discovering Astronomy to find aborigines who can simply be murdered for their land (given that a Civ player empire is typically completely amoral).
     
  10. Apricottage

    Apricottage Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2012
    Messages:
    111
    Let's put it this way.

    Do you want to play as the Australian Aborigines, who haven't discovered anything but Mysticism and Hunting by the time the British show up with Riflemen? Similarly, do you want to play as the British in that war?
     
  11. kalandra

    kalandra Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2012
    Messages:
    18
    I think most native americans civilizations at that time - the "Red Indians" civilization, the Aztecs and the Inca still haven't developed metal working. That why thier unique units doesn't require metal.
     
  12. noto2

    noto2 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,709
    It depends. From north to south America you realize we're talking about...what...over a hundred different languages, so over 100 different "civilizations"..and I'm just talking about the major ones (that numbered into the hundred thousands at least). It's true that in S. America obsidian was widely used, and was the choice material for tools and weapons, but I'm sure somewhere in the new world someone had worked copper. There was widespread gold smithing going on, so I'm sure there were other types of metals being worked.
     
  13. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    So if I find a barbarian village on some island, (though the aborigines would be more akin to tribal villages) I should not take it so not to hurt the feeling of imaginary people?
     
  14. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    I try to development my empire to be the British to AI's AAs, that is basically the point of this game.
     
  15. Rusty Edge

    Rusty Edge Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2007
    Messages:
    2,895
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cheeseland
    I was doing some research and calculations. From a production standpoint, corn yields are about a third higher than rice yields in the US. So maybe the game isn't so arbitrary.

    I'm guessing that sugar cane has the highest energy yield/acre in the places which can grow it. At least as I recall, fuel alcohol comes from cane in Brazil.
     
  16. Quasar1011

    Quasar1011 King of Sylvania

    Joined:
    May 17, 2003
    Messages:
    2,968
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    California
    When I make my own Civ IV maps, I usually place those resources in hills. Making maps gives you control over some of these things.
     
  17. damerell

    damerell Slow Worker

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    Messages:
    804
    Location:
    UK
    No; a Civ player empire is typically completely amoral. Didn't I say that?

    I really don't understand your objection here.
     
  18. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    Then what is your objection in post #16?
     
  19. calibur

    calibur Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    353
    As I see it, he wants, as most do, that the game be relatively balanced, and that game-play decides who wins more so than starting position, though that's obviously a major factor.
    It seems to us that you want it to be unbalanced and, if given an opportunity, to be able to wipe out all your foes with little competition. If so, why not just WB in some modern armor and gunships and go ravage the world?
     
  20. nfw

    nfw Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2010
    Messages:
    733
    An early rush can let you snowball your rivals, should I refrain from doing so?

    Ahh yeah, no **** sherlock. That's the point, you try and create a power imbalance and then fully exploit it. Or what? If I get a good start I should handicap myself? Or if I find some primitive screwheads I shouldn't curbstomp them (further) back into the stone age?

    Because there's a difference between creating the imbalance from a random start, and having it be imbalanced to begin with? Evidently, playing well is cheating, or amoral, or something.
     

Share This Page