[GS] The mythical +45 Hansa

[Sostratus]

If the stave church bonus for woods stacks with the normal wood adjacency then I believe the max is +16:

Hubsunur Hollow counts as toundra

Natural Wonders are funny that way - I think its the impassable ones that only count as a NW and nothing else. I forgot about passables like that new sahara wonder and unbunsur. (Since Norway would get 2.5 faith per forested tundra tile, exceeding a regular NW's +2.)

The more you know!

 

[UWHabs]

I think you could get to a +48 commerce hub with any civ, if you have a commerce hub surrounded by 5 harbours, on a river, with the 6th adjacent tile being either a government plaza or Pamukkale. If you had 6 harbors around it, I don't it would be possible to be riverside. That's the closest that you can get to max output for any district with a "normal" civ without any inherrent bonuses.

For the Harbor one, I think you could get more as well. Since you are technically allowed to settle cities as close as 2 apart if they on different landmasses, you could have 3 city centres (+6, +1 for districts), 3 resources, plus +2 for the RNDY on a foreign continent. Then with Reyna and the policy card would get to +36.

 

[Sostratus]

If you had 6 harbors around it, I don't it would be possible to be riverside.

You can't get a river edge through normal map gen to touch a tile with 5 water tiles around it. You could probably place an edge down but it wouldn't generate a 1 tile river between two seas normally.

Japan's city centers give a full +3 to harbors, so if that landmass scenario still works you could do it with them as well as England.

 

[Tannhauser]

Holy Site: +32 Faith (and +32 Science) (Norway only)
You need the natural wonder "Hubsunur Hollow" (+4 Faith), four adjacent woods (+2 Faith), the pantheon "Danse of the Aurora" (+6 Faith, Hubsunur Hollow counts as toundra), and four adjacent woods with Stave Church (+4 Faith), making it 16 Faith, 32 with the Revelation policy card (+100%). The great Scientist "Hildegard of Bingen" allows to have science from a specific Holy Site adjacency.

Natural Wonders are funny that way - I think its the impassable ones that only count as a NW and nothing else. I forgot about passables like that new sahara wonder and unbunsur. (Since Norway would get 2.5 faith per forested tundra tile, exceeding a regular NW's +2.)

The more you know!

Well done Aurelsk
Actually NW counting as teundra works with the Eyafj....kull NW as well, and it is impassable. See attached screenshot with the best possible holy site for russians (+26 faith&science) If I were japan or polland that would be a +30... And I'm not in a dark age anymore but with the monasticism policy the science output was insane

 

[Disgustipated]

I failed in my attempt at the mythical Hansa today. My fault for adding extra civs to the game. The crowded map made them more hostile and DOW from 2 civs at the same time early in the game and I lost my 2nd city. After planning and pinning all my tiles. I don't see a way to make this game work, I'm too crowded in. I have a dream to make it work. And I'll try again.
edit: forgot to mention I lost my starting warrior to a tornado as well. not good luck.

 

[Disgustipated]

Finally got this thing, with a city on the coast even. I wasn't sure this coastal start would be able to do it, but it worked out well. Though I would have preferred the +30 Hansa to be in Aachen, but that's okay. I don't have factories or coal plants yet, just getting started.

Had to conquer Russia and Scythia to get them out of the way and burn their incorrectly placed cities. This is the first time I've built 6 cities in a ring. I usually go with 4 with Germany, once I went with 5.

I've been focused so much on this one task, time to build more units and try to get a better handle on this barbarian problem.

Whoops, I just noticed I have 2 cities named Berlin, have to fix that. It's because I renamed my 2nd city, I wanted my industrial power house city to be a more major Germany city rather than the one that randomly came up when I settled.

Spoiler :

 

[Sostratus]

Finally got this thing,

They say imitation is the highest form of flattery...

Just imagine how it will feel unlocking industrialization and getting another +30 from the coal plant. The Hansa in gathering storm is just such a rocket now with Hansa->Craftsmen->Industrialization giving you 1/2/4x return on your base adjacency.

Hard to tell with the tooltip, But I think you might have been able to save yourself from placing Bremen's Hansa is a less than ideal spot by:
Shifting dortmund's Hansa to the river tile next to the elephant
Colonge Hansa to dortmund's current one
Aachen hansa to colonge's current one
Lesser Berlin's to where I presume aachen's current one is
Bremen to Lesser Berlin's current one.
Basically just some rotation tomfoolery.
But I think you'll be okay...

 

[Disgustipated]

My only thing is my empire is so productive and doing so well there was no chance of ever getting a dark age. And ideally I would have liked to build Ruhr in that city, but that's impossible when it's surrounded by commercial hubs. I built it in another city (not in the ring of 6) which was Scythia's former capital.

I actually find myself not really needing royal society since I'm waiting on science anyways. Though I did get Korolev so that really sped things along. Already launched exoplanet, just waiting on tech to speed it up.

 

[Sostratus]

My only thing is my empire is so productive and doing so well there was no chance of ever getting a dark age. And ideally I would have liked to build Ruhr in that city, but that's impossible when it's surrounded by commercial hubs. I built it in another city (not in the ring of 6) which was Scythia's former capital.

You can still build Ruhr in the +30 city; if you look closely at my screenshot in the OP you can see I put Ruhr in aachen.
The placement rules for wonders like Ruhr are like this:
-Must be next to a river
-Must be next to an IZ with a factory
-City must have a factory
These are 3 different things. Since all of these Hansas have factories, you can put ruhr next to any of them as long as it's a river tile. The building city need not own the district it is next to. You just have to swap the tile to the right city.
They changed this a while back. At launch you could build the IZ/factory in City X and City Y could build ruhr next to that without having its own IZ.

 

[Sostratus]

My only thing is my empire is so productive

and doing so well there was no chance of ever getting a dark age

I always find that I have to really try to get a late dark age. Usually by founding enough cities (like, 16-20) to just get the requirement high enough I can narrowly slide under. It's hard with all the points you get late game especially just for doing normal stuff.
Not that a +30 Hansa with a +30 coal plant is exactly production starved. You really gotta work hard to line everything up like I did. Mali makes it way easier because you just need reyna with 1 promo to hit +34. (Guilds later for +51.)

 

[Tannhauser]

For the Harbor one, I think you could get more as well. Since you are technically allowed to settle cities as close as 2 apart if they on different landmasses, you could have 3 city centres (+6, +1 for districts), 3 resources, plus +2 for the RNDY on a foreign continent. Then with Reyna and the policy card would get to +36.

How do you place cities 2 tiles apart on different landmasses? I just tried and it does not seem to be allowed...

Spoiler :

 

[Victoria]

Mountains are coded to all just be mountains-

Desert mountains are indeed coded as desert mountain, as are grassland mountains
You cannot have just plain mountains but you can have plains mountains.

How do you place cities 2 tiles apart on different landmasses? I just tried and it does not seem to be allowed...

That picture dear sir is one tile apart.

 

[Sostratus]

Desert mountains are indeed coded as desert mountain, as are grassland mountains
You cannot have just plain mountains but you can have plains mountains.

Then you get things like mountain NWs not applying as mountains for terrace farms (like Eyja.) I could have sworn desert mountains didn't count for desert folklore. (I had thought it was a purely graphical distinction)

 

[UWHabs]

How do you place cities 2 tiles apart on different landmasses? I just tried and it does not seem to be allowed...

Spoiler :

View attachment 520455

Ah, I was mistaken. I know if they're on different landmasses I've seen cities closer than 3 tiles, but they must only relax it by 1 tile if across the water.

 

[Sostratus]

Ah, I was mistaken. I know if they're on different landmasses I've seen cities closer than 3 tiles, but they must only relax it by 1 tile if across the water.

In civ5 you could do separate landmasses if they were 1 tile apart. Did this make for "killzone archipelago?" Yes. Probably best we don't go back to that.
Although a diamond of 2 city centers and 2 harbors...

 

[Troy Bruckner]

Finally got this thing, with a city on the coast even. I wasn't sure this coastal start would be able to do it, but it worked out well. Though I would have preferred the +30 Hansa to be in Aachen, but that's okay. I don't have factories or coal plants yet, just getting started.

Had to conquer Russia and Scythia to get them out of the way and burn their incorrectly placed cities. This is the first time I've built 6 cities in a ring. I usually go with 4 with Germany, once I went with 5.

I've been focused so much on this one task, time to build more units and try to get a better handle on this barbarian problem.

Whoops, I just noticed I have 2 cities named Berlin, have to fix that. It's because I renamed my 2nd city, I wanted my industrial power house city to be a more major Germany city rather than the one that randomly came up when I settled.

Spoiler :

You really need to name One West Berlin and the other East Berlin......


Also It's been a while, but Australia building a Holy Site next to Mount Everest can be +25 or 30 if I remember correctly.

 

[Victoria]

) I could have sworn desert mountains didn't count for desert folklore.

I first spotted the distinction when looking at visibility, they are separated in the xml.

 

[Disgustipated]

You really need to name One West Berlin and the other East Berlin......

I totally missed that opportunity. And I'm old enough to know what that was. Back in my day we had 2 Berlins.

 

[kb27787]

I completely forgot about Norway, sorry. Thank you Tannhauser. Yes, +32 with Norway seems to be the maximum with the natural wonder.


So if I remake the list of maximum adjacency (hoping that I'm good now, correct me if I'm wrong!):

Campus: +28 Science and +28 Production (Netherlands only) (nearly impossible: involve a lot of luck)
You need a river (+2 Science, Grote Rivieren ability), six adjacents Geothermal Fissure (+12 Science) or four adjacent Geothermal Fissure (+8 Science) with the natural wonder "Pamukkale" (+4 Science), making it +14 Science, +28 with Rationalism policy (+100%). The dedication "Heartbeat of Steam" allows to have Production from Campus adjacencies.
Without Geothermal Fissure, it is +20 Science, possible by Brazil (Pamukkale and 4 rainforests), or Netherlands (Pamukkale, river, 3-4 moutains, 0-1 Government Plaza).

Commercial Hub: +51 Gold (and +51 Science) (Mali only, Suguba)
You need a river (+2 Gold), six adjacent Holy Site (+15 Gold), making it +17 Gold, +51 with "Harbormaster" Reyna's title (+100%) and the Towns Charters policy card (+100%). The dedication "Free Inquiry" allow to have Science from Commercial Hub adjacencies.

Harbor: +30 Gold (and +30 Science and +30 Production) (England only, Royal Navy Dockyard)
You need a City-Center (+2 Gold), a Governement Plaza (+1 Gold), so 2 districts (+1 Gold), four adjacent marine ressource (+4 Gold) and be on a foreign continent (+2 Gold), making it +10 Gold, +30 with "Harbormaster" Reyna's title (+100%) and Free Market policy card (+100%). The dedication "Free Inquiry" allows to have Science from Harbor adjacencies, and the Shipyard building allows to have Production from Harbor adjacencies too.

Holy Site: +32 Faith (and +32 Science) (Norway only)
You need the natural wonder "Hubsunur Hollow" (+4 Faith), four adjacent woods (+2 Faith), the pantheon "Danse of the Aurora" (+6 Faith, Hubsunur Hollow counts as toundra), and four adjacent woods with Stave Church (+4 Faith), making it 16 Faith, 32 with the Revelation policy card (+100%). The great Scientist "Hildegard of Bingen" allows to have science from a specific Holy Site adjacency.

Industrial Zone: +63 Production (or +126 Production) (Germany only, Hansa) (nearly impossible: involve a lot of luck)
You need six adjacent Commercial Hub (+15 Production), and having under each Commercial Hub a Strategic Ressource (+6 Production), making it +21 Production, +63 with the Craftsmen policy card (+100%), and the Collectivism dark age policy card (+100%). The Coal Power Plant building allows to have Production from Industrial Zone adjacencies.
Without luck, it is +45 Production, +90 with the Coal Power Plant.

Theatre Square: +52 Culture (Netherlands only)
You need a river (+2 Culture, Grote Rivieren ability), six adjacents wonders (+12 Culture), one of the wonder must be the Machu Picchu (+1 Culture from mountain), making it +15 Culture, +52 with the Grand Opera policy card (+100%) and Vilnius suzerain's bonus with a level 3 alliance (+150%) (technically: +52.5).

Greece has got Netherlands beat for the theatre in GS... The Acropolis has been slightly buffed and now gives additional +1 from wonders (dunno why they buff what is already a very strong civ)

Meaning 6 wonders with Greece is +18 base (+19 if Machu)