The Offical IOT Mod Brainstorming and Organisation Thread

[Ailedhoo]

No offense mate, but acting like you have this grand absolute authority just because you started the thread won't make people enthusiastic about the mod at all and may just kill it. I do object to the "Steal Plans", more on a pratical level than game balance because it would require Python to code and simpler is better when you are making stuff. I know this from my very limited understanding off mods, decent understanding of game design and early University level understanding of Software Engineering. Maybe when we get to a later stage where when we are confident we can actually work that stuff it would be a better idea. Anyway, Alied, all "vetoing" it and any discussion of it is just going to piss people off and make them less enthused about the game. Enthusiasm is all that's keeping this idea alfoat anyway.

We need a leadership to ensure this mod does not break up in the few days or worst linger. My veto etch was a stance on consideration that is necessary.

Good to be enthusiastic but there has to be some early notion, for a bad start is not going to mean a brilliant ending sometimes.

As for the Software Engineering: I think we should get organised our modders before we start seeing the boundaries. However this will require a leadership to help maintain...

We're not even IN quality control mode yet anyway. Ideas, even if they don't end up in the mod, are good, the more he better. Sorting those ideas come later. The only people who should have "veto" power should be the people actually coding the mod for stuff that is too difficult to make. And maybe, once we've play tested something enough we can determine it is unbalanced.

The modders will need power yes but so too the best of our writers (Thor, Tails, RC etch) for quality control and anyone else trusted with power.

Anyway; we have yet to get the word from the coders themselves.

As for the techtrees: let us have our modders speak.

And this mod should be made by all of us, all our ideas combined. Otherwise the mod wouldn't be made by us. The signups will be really helpful when we get to a later stage in the game, as it will save time on the planning aspect of the game.

So the modders should not have their veto then?

The IOT is meant to be about IOT yes? It was not talked about "being by all IOTers" per say darning our initial discussion. We area still in the beginning stage, so we need some ground rules set; are we setting from industrial or modern era onwards? We need to answer the questions.

But yeah the main objection I have Alied is your frankly rude talk to Omega, it was pretty harsh and does nothing but hurt the development of this mod. You should apologise IMO.

I am not apologising for calling out a bad idea like a balance breaking spy. This is not a hug box. Anyway criticism has to be applied if we to ensure this mod will not have IOT laughed at.

tl;dr Ailedhoo, waving around your "authority" like you were just then does nothing but harm.

If this mod dose not have a control mechanisms (like a senior council) we will not get anywhere and damage the mod greatly.

My stance is more of practical consideration. We need to first set who is in charge of editing and modding, along with the key writers.

 

[WhiteRobber]

I really dunno what kind of civ you could make from me.

 

[NinjaCow64]

We need a leadership to ensure this mod does not break up in the few days or worst linger. My veto etch was a stance on consideration that is necessary.

Good to be enthusiastic but there has to be some early notion, for a bad start is not going to mean a brilliant ending sometimes.

As for the Software Engineering: I think we should get organised our modders before we start seeing the boundaries. However this will require a leadership to help maintain...

Your current behavior has more chance of breaking up the mod than lack of leadership in my opinion.

The modders will need power yes but so too the best of our writers (Thor, Tails, RC etch) for quality control and anyone else trusted with power.

Anyway; we have yet to get the word from the coders themselves.

As for the techtrees: let us have our modders speak.

The modders should the only people with veto power. And practically they will be, as no one else is actually going to mod. And as for tech trees ect, I volunteer to be a modder and I say we should get some civs working before we do anything else.

So the modders should not have their veto then?

The IOT is meant to be about IOT yes? It was not talked about "being by all IOTers" per say darning our initial discussion. We area still in the beginning stage, so we need some ground rules set; are we setting from industrial or modern era onwards? We need to answer the questions.

I'm just not sure people will be willing to play an IOT mod where the creators rudely dismiss ideas.

I am not apologising for calling out a bad idea like a balance breaking spy. This is not a hug box. Anyway criticism has to be applied if we to ensure this mod will not have IOT laughed at.

Regardless of wether it breaks the game (which it doesn't, I remember spies actually have that ability) but the way you "called it out" was really rude. There's a world of difference between politeness and being "a hugbox".

If this mod dose not have a control mechanisms (like a senior council) we will not get anywhere and damage the mod greatly.

My stance is more of practical consideration. We need to first set who is in charge of editing and modding, along with the key writers.

We really don't need that. All we need is a guy who is willing to do some modding (we've already got that) and ideas. I'm just worried that the way you are acting will put people off making ideas. I'm sorry to make this into internet drama time, but I really wanted to address this now before it causes bigger problems.

 

[Ailedhoo]

I guess my brutal honesty has its... critique I admit for not telling how to improve. Improvement is a important consideration and I am not giving idea in how to improve, although I still think balance is the key to my... opposition to the Steal Plan thing.

Anyway NC: I have still to hear full details; whom are the modders? We need organisers (hence the "modders" are not the only ones that must have veto power) while we still need some frameworks. For instance: setting. I believe it would be suitable to have a "post-modern reconstruction" effort as is common among IOTs, allowing a tech tree that could allow different kinds of units. Basically the reason I am focusing on the tree first for the sake of the setting.

Perhaps we can make a deal; this mod is not going to be quick to made and I think the UUs and UBs are best after we set the normal units and normal buildings along with technologies so we have the infrastructure to lay out our vision. In the mean time we can use the civ ideas stage to give ideas for the kinds of normal units, buildings and even technologies that we are going to require. This is why I, for instance, suggested multiple UBs and UUs. We are going to need a tech tree anyway for the 'religions' (I like Thor's NGO notion to this) and to have a idea of what kind of units people are going to replace with a unique kind.

As for organisation: I think we can agree to disagree, yes?

 

[Robert Can't]

Perhaps we can make a deal; this mod is not going to be quick to made and I think the UUs and UBs are best after we set the normal units and normal buildings along with technologies so we have the infrastructure to lay out our vision. In the mean time we can use the civ ideas stage to give ideas for the kinds of normal units, buildings and even technologies that we are going to require. This is why I, for instance, suggested multiple UBs and UUs. We are going to need a tech tree anyway for the 'religions' (I like Thor's NGO notion to this) and to have a idea of what kind of units people are going to replace with a unique kind.

I'm sorry but this is exactly where we shouldn't be going at this stage.
Right now our aim should be to add a few civilizations each with one UU and UB.
We should be putting his out quickly, maybe if each person created the XML file or their nation and posted it in the then that'd be a better start. But right now you are killing any hope of their ever being a mod by just being too ambitious.

 

[Ailedhoo]

I'm sorry but this is exactly where we shouldn't be going at this stage.
Right now our aim should be to add a few civilizations each with one UU and UB.
We should be putting his out quickly, maybe if each person created the XML file or their nation and posted it in the then that'd be a better start. But right now you are killing any hope of their ever being a mod by just being too ambitious.

Ambition kills the mod?!

Would Fall From Heaven be a great mod if it just used the same old tech tree instead of trying to make a universe with a different tech tree as result?

We need ambition, else we are going to fail and quite frankly a lack of ambition is not a good path.

Indeed ambition is key. We need to set the setting, else we are going to be like dogs chasing their own tails; we need a stone foundation and setting the setting is a foundation. So happens a tech tree will have to be set.

Do a boring set from normal units and buildings first, then do unique stuff to avoid a mess!

 

[NinjaCow64]

I guess my brutal honesty has its... critique I admit for not telling how to improve. Improvement is a important consideration and I am not giving idea in how to improve, although I still think balance is the key to my... opposition to the Steal Plan thing.

On the subject of improvement, no offense but I think you need to work on your use of brutal honesty. I mean it's used pretty much all the time in some places (SCP, SA, BTL from what it sounds like), but CFC's culture isn't like that. It's got a different atmosphere and, as they say, when in Rome do as the Romans do.

Anyway NC: I have still to hear full details; whom are the modders? We need organisers (hence the "modders" are not the only ones that must have veto power) while we still need some frameworks. For instance: setting. I believe it would be suitable to have a "post-modern reconstruction" effort as is common among IOTs, allowing a tech tree that could allow different kinds of units. Basically the reason I am focusing on the tree first for the sake of the setting.

Perhaps we can make a deal; this mod is not going to be quick to made and I think the UUs and UBs are best after we set the normal units and normal buildings along with technologies so we have the infrastructure to lay out our vision. In the mean time we can use the civ ideas stage to give ideas for the kinds of normal units, buildings and even technologies that we are going to require. This is why I, for instance, suggested multiple UBs and UUs. We are going to need a tech tree anyway for the 'religions' (I like Thor's NGO notion to this) and to have a idea of what kind of units people are going to replace with a unique kind.

I think what I envisioned from this mod and, judging from people's applications what most people are thinking, it would be a mod that is the same as vanilla BTS except with us as the leaders/civs. Well at the start anyway.

And from a design angle, I'm of the philosophy that you should start with the easiest stuff first when making a game and having a playable product early on. Making Civ leaders that are us would satisfy both condition, it will be playable from the word go and will be much, much, much, much easier than a complete overhaul. So I think we should start with that and see what happens from there.

As for organisation: I think we can agree to disagree, yes?

Yeah, that's probably for the best.

 

[NinjaCow64]

Ambition kills the mod?!

Would Fall From Heaven be a great mod if it just used the same old tech tree instead of trying to make a universe with a different tech tree as result?

We need ambition, else we are going to fail and quite frankly a lack of ambition is not a good path.

Indeed ambition is key. We need to set the setting, else we are going to be like dogs chasing their own tails; we need a stone foundation and setting the setting is a foundation. So happens a tech tree will have to be set.

Do a boring set from normal units and buildings first, then do unique stuff to avoid a mess!

Yes, but the FfH team were a bunch of really experienced modders. Compared to them we're a bunch of preschoolers in a sandpit. Robert is right, we should start simple, a leader, a civ, UU and UB for each person. Or at least that is the mod I'm going to make.

 

[Robert Can't]

Ambition kills the mod?!

Would Fall From Heaven be a great mod if it just used the same old tech tree instead of trying to make a universe with a different tech tree as result?

We need ambition, else we are going to fail and quite frankly a lack of ambition is not a good path.

Indeed ambition is key. We need to set the setting, else we are going to be like dogs chasing their own tails; we need a stone foundation and setting the setting is a foundation. So happens a tech tree will have to be set.

Do a boring set from normal units and buildings first, then do unique stuff to avoid a mess!

Because we all have the modding ability and the dedication of the FfH team...

This mod is not going to be FfH. It spawned from a "What would x's leader music be if they were in civ". If you want to make a new FfH but with your own creative ideas (Which is what you seem to be proposing) then it is no longer the IOT mod. Nobody but you agreed to all the stuff in the OP. I don't even understand why you want to add half the stuff you do want to add (No navy for Tyo, Triforce). Please lets just start this as a community leader mod.

Edit: NC got to it before me, but basically we're saying the same thing he's just more succinct.

 

[Robert Can't]

Also, I don't quite get you rambling on about setting. IOT isn't set anywhere so I really think it fits better with just the standard Civ Tech tree.

 

[Ailedhoo]

The experience issue a point, although I fear the whole "vanile" edit thing would lead to "may well just rename the civs on the start up screen" etch. But my scepticism aside we would best consider the IOT mod as a long project: we do experiments first.

If all else fails we can ask the experience modders for some tips; that will help not only in advise but also in moral by unofficially getting the project blessed!

Just be warned that when we start experimenting with the tech tree and setting that we will be seeing some drastic changes, especially with the units and buildings as we try to imagine the world after "a crash" and try to build up from there.

On the subject of improvement, no offense but I think you need to work on your use of brutal honesty. I mean it's used pretty much all the time in some places (SCP, SA, BTL from what it sounds like), but CFC's culture isn't like that. It's got a different atmosphere and, as they say, when in Rome do as the Romans do.

Not wearing trousers till encountering those 'scary' northerners?

As for Something Awful: its culture is more... basically the rulers there are very, very strict which is why I am still lurking to get hang on what it is. It can a year to lurk SA before having the confidence to post... and it is not too hard to get marked down by the mods, even for simple stuff.

As for BTL; we are founded by ex-Tropers (influenced by the figure CrazyGoggs and SA) who were displeased with the... unpleasentries of the certain place and with my current membership numbers (we need more recruits... ) we are basically just chilling together at the moment. Still... we can talk about internet cultures when the time comes...

 

[NinjaCow64]

The experience issue a point, although I fear the whole "vanile" edit thing would lead to "may well just rename the civs on the start up screen" etch. But my scepticism aside we would best consider the IOT mod as a long project: we do experiments first.

And the first experiment shall be: Can we get a mod with leaders/civs made by IOTers up and running?

 

[Ailedhoo]

And the first experiment shall be: Can we get a mod with leaders/civs made by IOTers up and running?

Reminds me of a quote from Alpha Centauri by Chairman Yang...

Technological advance is an inherently iterative process. One does not simply take sand from the beach and produce a Dataprobe. We use crude tools to fashion better tools, and then our better tools to fashion more precise tools, and so on. Each minor refinement is a step in the process, and all of the steps must be taken.

 

[JohannaK]

We'll need wizards at some point. I know, Tyo's UU will be wizards which deal 1H1K strikes, but can only survive a turn outside his borders.

 

[NinjaCow64]

Leader Name: NinjaCow64
Portrait: Will be my avatar which I never change, of course.

Traits: Creative, Imperialistic (because SETTLER SPAM and Catherine is my waifu )

AI: Similar to Jao II’s, will use that as a base and build from there

Civ Name: Formatic-Spammer
Short Name: Forum-Spam
Adjective: Forum-Spammer

UU: Spam Crusader (Replaces Maceman because they are ugly. Will use same pic as Samurai, for now at least.)

-8 Strength, 1 Movement, 45 Hammers
-Same as Maceman minus the bonus against melee and half the price

UB: Formatic Forum (Replaces Library)
-Same as Library, except 4 Culture instead of 2

Peace Music:


Link to video.

War Music:


Link to video.

I think that Nedim should have original Defend Kebab, I listen to Ultramix more so there's that.

 

[NedimNapoleon]

I love you NC for posting that video. The Medieval dubstep thingy, its epic. Sure you can have the kebab song, I was thinking this for my music:

Peace Music:

Link to video.


War Music:

Link to video.

 

[Thorvald of Lym]

No offense mate, but acting like you have this grand absolute authority just because you started the thread won't make people enthusiastic about the mod at all and may just kill it.

'Sides, Megs said I was supposed to start this.

Ambition kills the mod?!

Speaking as a modder,

YUP.


Welp, I'll just get this out of the way...

Spoiler :

Downfall Gang

Short form: Downfall
Adjective: Unterganger

Leaders:
Adolf Hitler (Agg/Org)

Spoiler :

Hermann Fegelein (Cre/Phi)

Spoiler :

UU: Tiger I (replaces Tank, more expensive, stronger attack & defence) or Leopard 2A6 (replaces Modern Armour, stronger attack & defence)
UB: Propaganda Office (replaces Broadcast Tower, boosts Espionage)

Peace theme

[youtube=300]BOBTIoseYuQ[/youtube]
or

[youtube=300]Hn_dAOYlLc4[/youtube]

War theme

[youtube=300]8bS81G3Owng[/youtube]

 

[Ailedhoo]

I may as well have fun...

I will choose between options: the Socialist Union of Democratic Staets and the Imperium of Man. Which one should I choose? I will be brainstorming ideas for the leader too. Hence I will need to eliminate some of the leader suggestions eventually...

First the good...

Spoiler SUDS :

The Socialist Union of Democratic States

Leader

Abel Roux
Expansionist/Industrious, Industrious/Philosopher or Expansionist/Philosopher?

Susan Rojo
Aggressive/Industrious or Protective/Industrious?

Vladimir Orzov
Philosopher/Industrious

George Chaput
Charismatic/Aggressive

Lisa Tolbert
Charismatic/Protective

Victor Miles
Philopsher/Creative


Unique Unit: still to decide since the "ion tank" I had would possible be too futuristic...
Unique Building: Debate Ring; replaces Areana. Adds culture along with the happiness. In honour to Victor Miles.

...and the... not so good...

Spoiler IoM :

The Imperium of Man

Leaders

Gilmore Flanagon
Imperial/Aggressive or Imperial/Financial

Magnus Flanagon
Imperial/Spiritual or Imperial/Financial

Illiam II
Imperial/Protective


Unique Unit: Imperial Crusader (replaced mace men, infantry or marine; has bonus to city attack) or Leviant (replaces nuclear submarine; double health and carry extra missiles but more expensive)
Unique Building: Prison Camp(replaces prison; adds production along with the anti-wariness stuff...)

Will add more information later...

 

[Robert Can't]

I thought the idea was to have the IOTers as leaders of the nation rather than a mod which adds nations that have been in IOTs.

 

[Omega124]

I thought the idea was to have the IOTers as leaders of the nation rather than a mod which adds nations that have been in IOTs.

I believe literally everyone but alied agrees with you in this regard.