The source of evil.

[Aphex_Twin]

If we fail to take responsibility for our actions and simply blame it on fate/God/The-giant-radioactive-monkey-in-the-sky we stife ourselves. The paradox is that people really don't seek freedom and therefore responsibility. It's so much easier to live in a cozy corner, eyes shut, gently suckling on mother's tit.

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by Aphex_Twin
If we fail to take responsibility for our actions and simply blame it on fate/God/The-giant-radioactive-monkey-in-the-sky we stife ourselves. The paradox is that people really don't seek freedom and therefore responsibility. It's so much easier to live in a cozy corner, eyes shut, gently suckling on mother's tit.

Exactly!

If we fail to take responsibility for our actions and simply blame it on fate/God/The-giant-radioactive-monkey-in-the-sky we stife ourselves. The paradox is that people really don't seek the truth but rather they seek an answer, however wrong it may be. It's so much easier to live in a cozy corner, eyes shut, gently suckling on mother's tit, worship, and believe that everything will be "all right" rather than actually trying to figure out the meaning of life.

 

[Aphex_Twin]

Gee nihilistic... That's very original. Congratulations on learning the use of the CTRL+C and CTRL+V !

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by Aphex_Twin
Gee nihilistic... That's very original. Congratulations on learning the use of the CTRL+C and CTRL+V !

I purposely made it as close to your argument as possible to show that approximately the same argument can be used against what you supposedly believe in. It's a completely valid strategy. If your counterarguments are so limited that you have to resort to attacking Copy/Paste, I would like to comment on how original your believes are given that they are copied out of thousand year old texts that have been proven to be mere fantasy again and again.

 

[gael]

Originally posted by nihilistic


Exactly!

If we fail to take responsibility for our actions and simply blame it on fate/God/The-giant-radioactive-monkey-in-the-sky we stife ourselves. The paradox is that people really don't seek the truth but rather they seek an answer, however wrong it may be. It's so much easier to live in a cozy corner, eyes shut, gently suckling on mother's tit, worship, and believe that everything will be "all right" rather than actually trying to figure out the meaning of life.

The only real meaning for life without religion is to reproduce like every other animal. There is no other greater plan that spans humankind beyond this. Its about survival of the species.

Religion gives people a more spirital meaning to life. Whether its true or not, i can't say, but it dos'nt mean they are blinding themselves with it.
Religion still exists because no one has come up with a better alternative, other than there is no real meaning to life.

 

[CurtSibling]

I think we on Off Topic can agree that Simon Darkshade is the source of all evil.

 

[PantheraTigris2]

According to scripture, our first ancestors ate the forbidden fruit, the fruit that gives wisdom ("ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil") - which took away our naivety.

Therefore, as their decendants, it's hard for me to take anyone seriously when the try to sweep it under the carpet and say things like, "oh, evil is just made by the imagination - it's all totally fictional". C'mon now, who do you think you're kidding? Aren't we all here, decendants of those whom ate from the tree of wisdom? No matter what you claim, I honestly believe everyone here knows the exact same thing. Afterall, that's the way it works, since we're all created equal. I refuse to believe that any man or woman on this earth has no concept of good and evil - it's just not possible, according to scriptures (which, I happen to believe).

But, as I said before, the one true power we have always had is free will - the power to make choices. Some choose to be athiest, or agnostic, or presume to have doubts about the very existence of the entire concept of ANYthing spiritual. And, that's your choice. But I also believe, that it's also forged deep within all our spirits, and we realize we WILL be held accountable for our choices, in the end.

I know evil all too well. That's why this is really no issue for me. I know what it is, how it works, it's objective, and most certainly "where it comes from". And, I look forward to the day when it is finally destroyed once and for all. And that day shall come.

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by gael
The only real meaning for life without religion is to reproduce like every other animal.

It may sound unacceptable, but maybe it is.

Originally posted by gael
There is no other greater plan that spans humankind beyond this.

It was a theory of the existence of a plan. If you wish to say that it is the best plan you can think of, say:

There is no better idea of a plan that spans humankind beyond this.

Originally posted by gael
Religion gives people a more spirital meaning to life. Whether its true or not, i can't say,

This I can agree to.

Originally posted by gael
but it dos'nt mean they are blinding themselves with it.

Of course, it doesn't "have to" bind people to it. However, in practice, most who choose to consider/follow it pretty much have their reasoning completely bounded by it.

Originally posted by gael
Religion still exists because no one has come up with a better alternative, other than there is no real meaning to life.

Just because the alternative answer does not conduce to one's sense of pride does not mean that it must be wrong or that one must construct an illusion around it. There is no guarantee that you will be happier with another alternative. In fact, your idea of your existence would probably be much more melancholic if you open yourselves to other possibilities. Like the quote Lisa have said in the Simpson's epsode where Homer pulled the crayon out of his nose, the more you know, the less happier you are.

 

[gael]

PantheraTigris2, would you be religious at all?

 

[CurtSibling]

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
According to scripture, our first ancestors ate the forbidden fruit, the fruit that gives wisdom ("ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil") - which took away our naivety.

Our ancestors, You mean the proto-hominids we evolved from?

I wouldn't worry.
Naivety is alive and well, I see it every day.

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
I know evil all too well. That's why this is really no issue for me. I know what it is, how it works, it's objective, and most certainly "where it comes from". And, I look forward to the day when it is finally destroyed once and for all. And that day shall come.

You know Bill Gates?
If you do, you will know he cannot be destroyed by any man born of woman.

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
According to scripture, our first ancestors ate the forbidden fruit, the fruit that gives wisdom ("ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil") - which took away our naivety.

So is god too stupid to "know" what our "ancestors" would do? Or did god intend to make us to disobey him so as to have a reason to punish us?

 

[CurtSibling]

If the christian god can give his followers the capacity for evil, and they are made in his image...

Does that make god evil too?

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
According to scripture, our first ancestors ate the forbidden fruit, the fruit that gives wisdom ("ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil") - which took away our naivety.

As I reread this, I am wondering whether you are implying that knowledge is forbidden and knowledge is evil? If you are, then you are at least in concert with the church philosophy. In fact, let's replace every reference of evil, implicit or explicit, in the following passage you posted, to the string "knowledge":

I know knowledge all too well. That's why this knowledge really no issue for me. I know what knowledge is, how knowledge works, knowledge's objective, and most certainly "where knowledge comes from". And, I look forward to the day when knowledge is finally destroyed once and for all. And that day shall come.

 

[PantheraTigris2]

So is god too stupid to "know" what our "ancestors" would do? Or did god intend to make us to disobey him so as to have a reason to punish us?

This is key. Yes, indeed God set us up to be tested/tempted. But honestly, I believe His intention was for them to PASS the test, and thus glorify Him (as for example, Jesus did in the desert, during his time of being tempted by the devil). Had Eve told the serepent, "you foolish, wretched, slimey beast - how dare you presume that I should be so fooled by your trickery! Now, begone from me, vile creature - for MY master, is the Lord God Allmighty!"

- and that happened, ohh, things would have been much different. This "utopia" we speak of in the other thread, could still be around today (i.e. paradaise, garden of Eden).

But no, much to God's, disappointment, His people chose to sin against Him. And God is just, so therefore, we have been made to suffer for our sins. But alas! There is a way to return to divinity, and eternal life! For a savior has been sent, and all whom shall have faith in him, shall not perish in the hereafter.

PantheraTigris2, would you be religious at all?

Well, according to Civ3, I should be industrious, and expansionist. Hmmm....

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
This is key. Yes, indeed God set us up to be tested/tempted. But honestly, I believe His intention was for them to PASS the test,

so you are saying that god is naive?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
and thus glorify Him

and senile?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
Now, begone from me, vile creature - for MY master, is the Lord God Allmighty!"

and you are a pet?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
But no, much to God's, disappointment,

Wow, god has been proven wrong?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
His people chose to sin against Him.

even outright rejected?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
And God is just, so therefore, we have been made to suffer for our sins.

So god is wrathful at this own creations, his own failures? Can we call god pathetic now?

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
There is a way to return to divinity, and eternal life! For a savior has been sent, and all whom shall have faith in him, shall not perish in the hereafter.

Why now, is god repentent of his own errors now?

 

[CurtSibling]

PantheraTigris2, I can appreciate your integrity and faith.

But such religious ideas are the inventions of mankind in my view, as is the concept of evil.

 

[gael]

Originally posted by nihilistic

Just because the alternative answer does not conduce to one's sense of pride does not mean that it must be wrong or that one must construct an illusion around it. There is no guarantee that you will be happier with another alternative. In fact, your idea of your existence would probably be much more melancholic if you open yourselves to other possibilities. Like the quote Lisa have said in the Simpson's epsode where Homer pulled the crayon out of his nose, the more you know, the less happier you are.

That last post of mine is not my view on life, i was speaking on broad terms.
I'm not religious, but I can understand how people can be. I agree that people who are totally devoted to religion can have there judgement clouded by it, but you could also argue that being too scientific in your logic can cload your mind to spirituality.
I think you can be both.

I could argue with you about how religion is a load of crap, but thats too easy.
I think arrogance clouds the judgement more than anything.

 

[PantheraTigris2]

nihilistic, you have quite simply disgusted me with your comments. That was offensive. I'm not sure how I can respond to someone, when they speak in such a way about God, His people, and His relationship with them as their Lord. I've had enough. I'm not going to stand around to listen to someone insult the Lord. I'm just not going to do it.

An old saying: There's two things you should never debate, religion and politics. -Now and again I'm reminded why. I hope you guys find what you're looking for.

 

[nihilistic]

Originally posted by gael
I agree that people who are totally devoted to religion can have there judgement clouded by it, but you could also argue that being too scientific in your logic can cload your mind to spirituality.
I think you can be both.

I actually do believe that most of the things that I think I know about the world are probably wrong. However, it seems to me the my current state of knowledge can explain the world I live in, given a few alterations every day or so (because of new findings). I therefore believe that it is that my concept of the world is at least "sufficient" given the world I live in.

What I will not accept, however, is things that have been proven false. I can respect a theory that what I think is false is actually true under different circumstances, but only when it is presented as a theory. In other words, if one is to convince me of a theory/belief/religion, one should either back it up or risk being considered irrelevant. I'm willing to accept Christianity as a possible theory, but as soon as people like PantheraTigris2 starts to present it as fact (and judge my actions/thoughts accordingly) without any respectable evidence, my respect for it also breaks down.

Originally posted by gael
I could argue with you about how religion is a load of crap, but thats too easy.
I think arrogance clouds the judgement more than anything.

Yes, I can be arrogant sometimes. But can you tell me that these are not also examples of arrogance:

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
But no, much to God's, disappointment, His people chose to sin against Him. And God is just, so therefore, we have been made to suffer for our sins. But alas! There is a way to return to divinity, and eternal life! For a savior has been sent, and all whom shall have faith in him, shall not perish in the hereafter.

Originally posted by PantheraTigris2
I hope you guys find what you're looking for.

 

[PantheraTigris2]

You would call my expression of the Good News "arrogance".

nihilistic, there is indeed a God, the Father, and He is good, regardless of how angry you are at Him. And yes, it is obvious that you are.