They hit me so I hit back :)

[Segwin1]

I'm minding my own business just building up my little empire when out of the blue Cleopatra and Gilgamesh both declare war. They both sent something like two warriors which were quickly dispatch. A few turns later they both want peace. I agree. On a side note they declare war, then they want peace, you agree and then they are unhappy with you ????

So I'm steaming at the surprise attack and I buildup to hit Cleo (she is the closest and took a city close to me from a war with England). I'm not sure if I denounced or not but I went to war with her. Gilgamesh then declares war with me (again). I took the city close to me and kept it and she wanted peace and I said no. It's been a long time since I played Civ but in Civ 5 but there was a civ that declared war with me, I started to win, they wanted peace and I agreed. Fast forward they declared war on me again once they built up so I figured I wasn't going to back down with Cleo. I took everything and defeated her. Now I'm a warmonger (and it doesn't go away).

Long story short - why is OK for them to declare war but when I retaliate I'm punished? Note sure I get the logic.

Thanks.

 

[Sagax]

Long answer short: Because there is a difference between annoying harassment and straight out killing the annoying person in response.

 

[bladex]

cleo Moderator Action: <snip> needs to be wiped out every single game

Moderator Action: Please comply with this site's rules regarding use of inappropriate language
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[JosephC]

Not sure why people have such a hard time with this concept. Regardless of who started the fight: Defending what's yours is fine, taking what others have by force is not.

 

[liv]

Warmongering penalty is nothing. Why worry.

 

[bladex]

Warmongering penalty is nothing

it is for me i have set all eras penalties to 0. anyone <snip> me off that's it your dead in any era

Moderator Action: Please do not try to defeat the auto censor. Word snipped
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Dedrytus]

Do not worry about warmongering penalties. Diplomacy works very strange in this civ edition. For example in my current game, there were some early wars (I was attacked). Everybody dislike me or hate except Trajan, he loves me. After some turns (after eliminating Japan and Egypt) with no effort from my side, Teddy that attacked me a few times turned green and asked for friendship. I have no idea why and I do not care - he will be next, maybe after France because they do not want give me open borders. I will open borders by myself ;-)

 

[bladex]

I will open borders by myself ;-)

the only way to play this game

 

[orasis]

Long story short - why is OK for them to declare war but when I retaliate I'm punished? Note sure I get the logic.

Defending yourself by killing units and pillaging tiles to weaken the ability of your enemy to do war is not war-mongering, but, as soon as you start taking cities (and killing lots of innocent people) you are no longer on the defense but have become an aggressive warmonger yourself.

 

[bladex]

screw them anyway the AI is not worth dealing with the way they are now. they are untrustworthy, backstabbing bastards

 

[Zuizgond]

As said in this thread, it's pointless to care about diplomacy in Civ6. There is no real benefits from it anyway and they can dow you even if they like you. So do not worry about warmonger penalty and do what you want.

 

[jeb1000]

"why is OK for them to declare war but when I retaliate I'm punished? Note sure I get the logic."

I am new to Civ - just in my 3rd game. But this "warmonger" thing does not make sense. I have been attacked by others - no war declared. If I hit back, war is declared. Just dumb.

And this "religious" aspect of the game does not make sense either. You have missionaries running all over you and you can't do anything about it with your troops. Just dumb as well.

Anything that is a threat to you should have a way to defend against it. Sure, you can build missionaries - if you start right at the beginning to do so but if you do other things first they have completely overrun your people before you can get a single missionary.

And once they take all your cities, not having a way to win your people back is really dumb.

 

[GIO888]

Dedrytus is right (as far as this player has experienced).

If the AI gangs up and you destroy their improvements and eliminate their military, they then play nice and make peace - with little (apparent) penalty to you.

If you (quite rightly) wipe them from the face of the earth, then you're the warmonger to any other AI you've met.

This is whyI like Large worlds cos you'll be on a continent with 3 other Civs, 2 of them will gang up on you and you can then take out all three, with no penalties from those you haven't met yet!

 

[Jaybe]

And once they take all your cities, not having a way to win your people back is really dumb.

Naw, it isn't "dumb", it's just a consequence. Which COULD cost you the game IF they win a religious victory.

If you founded a religion then go find some foreign city of that religion; take it, get the holy site up and running and carry on.
OR: save your faith for great people, win the game via some non-religious means.

 

[ZubieMaster]

Not sure I get the logic.

It's not about logic or right or wrong, it's simply about the rules of the game. In the real world there is a vast spectrum of opinion on what is morally acceptable in response to being the recipient of a declaration of war. This game cannot represent every opinion, situation and circumstance of real life, so has simply chosen its set of rules. If it's getting in the way of your enjoyment of the game, I would suggest checking out mods that change the warmonger penalty system.

 

[blasto]

So if this is the way it stays I think they should add some dictators to the game. It might be fun to play as Hitler, Mao or Stalin and plenty of others.

 

[liv]

So if this is the way it stays I think they should add some dictators to the game. It might be fun to play as Hitler, Mao or Stalin and plenty of others.

Well during Victoria Britain captured and conquered a significant part of the world. There was virtually never peace when Peter the Great was in power. Trajan is famous for enlarging the Roman empire etc. etc.

 

[c4c6]

Long story short - why is OK for them to declare war but when I retaliate I'm punished? Note sure I get the logic.

Who else should be punished?

"They" do not play the same game as you. In single player "they" try to entertain the human, based on similar rules and artificial agenda.

 

[need my speed]

In single player "they" try to entertain the human

A lesson the AI hasn't learned ever since Civilization V, where, for some nefarious reason, it thought 'realism' - that means 'irrationality' and 'obscurity' - was a good idea.