Tile yields and their implications

[stiiknafuulia]

A shameless copy of a thread from Reddit, as I thought it well worth it -- here are the tile yields of the various terrain types, as gleaned from the recently released videos:

Base Terrain\Feature Flat Forest +1P Hill +1P Rainforest +1F F. Hill +2P R. Hill +1F1P
Plains 1F1P 1F2P (1F2P) 2F1P 1F3P 2F2P
Grassland 2F 2F1P 2F1P ??? 2F2P ???
Tundra 1F 1F1P 1F1P N/A 1F2P N/A
Desert 0 N/A 1P N/A N/A N/A
Snow 0 N/A 1P N/A N/A N/A

Coast 1F1G
Ocean 1F

The implications of the new yield system, if kept until release, are pretty huge imo. Tundra and desert areas are pretty much worthless without wonders and/or religion, including hilly areas, which in Civ V were as useful as any other hill. Add to this the effect of lowered appeal (desert tiles have been stated to have low appeal values), and a tundra or desert start could be an instant re-roll.

Otoh, forested grassland hills and rainforest plains hills will likely become very desirable terrain to start near, yielding 2 food and 2 production without any improvements. Add resources to this and some tiles could have very high total yields without any Builder actions. I think it's a good thing, as it gives you more options in the very early game, making 'Builder first' not always the optimum strategy.

It seems that Rainforest, unlike Jungle from the previous games, is actually desirable as it adds +1 food to Plains tiles. Whether it also appears on Grassland tiles is anyone's guess, but I think not as it could be quite op. Otoh, it's been stated that Flood plains and Swamp (or Marsh) tiles do have 3 food by default (they weren't included in the Reddit table for some reason, so I've omitted them here as well). (I'm not sure what to make of swamps having extra food, of all tiles... As a Finn I'd rather not be stranded without food on a Finnish swamp. You could pick some berries, sure, but not any more than in a forest, and even then, you couldn't really sustain a city-sized population on mere berries.)

Btw, do we know if rivers add gold to the tiles that are next to them (can't remember if they did in Civ V)? And have we seen the gold yields of any resources? I think we might be strapped for gold in the early game... I haven't seen any trading posts in any of the videos, either. Perhaps we'll have to rely on (foreign) trade routes for gold from the start... Interesting to see how things turn out.

 

[Lucius_]

No, river tiles do not appear to add gold to the adjacent tiles. As for early game gold, I've watched 3 videos and it seems money will be no obstacle in the early game unless there is some economy balance passes between now and release, which is probably very likely.

 

[Haggbart]

From the videos we've seen so far, lack of gold doesn't seem to be a problem even if tile yields, early buildings and TRs have relatively low yields. There are not a whole lot of things that you pay maintenence for, that might explain it.

 

[King Jason]

Btw, do we know if rivers add gold to the tiles that are next to them (can't remember if they did in Civ V)? And have we seen the gold yields of any resources? I think we might be strapped for gold in the early game... I haven't seen any trading posts in any of the videos, either. Perhaps we'll have to rely on (foreign) trade routes for gold from the start... Interesting to see how things turn out.

Rivers do not add a gold yield. Coastal tiles have 1 food and 1 gold. Early trade routes provide some gold but currency and Commerce districts are only 3 techs deep into the tree. The Commerce Center gets a Major (+2) bonus for each bordering river of a tile (as well as an adjacent harbor). On the maps I've seen so far this should translate to easy gold grabs around rivers because I very often see tiles that have access to 3+ river segments. Meaning an easy 6 gold.

I've also seen the gold yields of crab, chocolate, and gems as +3 gold. Considering those three diverse resources are all +3 it leads me to believe that all gold-producing luxury/bonus resources grant +3.

Also both Commercial hubs and harbor districts provide +1 trade route. Harbors also add more gold by having a standard (+1) adjacency bonus for sea resources.

From the videos we've seen so far, lack of gold doesn't seem to be a problem even if tile yields, early buildings and TRs have relatively low yields. There are not a whole lot of things that you pay maintenence for, that might explain it.

I don't think maintanence was in the build we've seen. I know building maintenance wasn't in, and I believe that will be in the game. As far as unit maintenance is concerned - while The support structure of previous games may have returned - I didn't make note of any players army reducing their income. Though I can't be sure.

 

[ProMeTheus112]

I like this table, specifically I find very interesting how some hill/forest tiles have really nice yields so that you can do something nice without builders too, to some extent in tundra too. It looks like it's going to be interesting whether you chop forests/rainforests or not.

 

[Silverdawn]

The following series had tile yields turned on (with the caveat that there is apparently a display bug with some yields that get changed):

FilthyRobot - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eGmEd0teIc0
Lionheart - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f92o34LEGw
BAStartGaming (not always on) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ls26x2bt9mI
Writing Bull (German) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxVvoZUegwM

 

[x2Madda]

I like this table too, I do wonder if old stables like chopping trees to speed up production, or similar terraforming options.

 

[mrwho]

So desert hills given only 1 production now instead of 2. Interesting direction to go in. Not sure if I agree with it, because it just makes Petra even more integral to a desert start. Petra now provides +2 food, +2 production, +1 gold to all non-floodplain desert tiles, so in terms of yield it's already much better than in Civ V where it was already very strong. Now it sounds like if you don't get Petra, a desert city is utterly terrible, whereas in the past it was still workable with flood plains and a good amount of hills.

(edit) Whoops, actually it's +2 food, +2 gold, +1 production.

 

[Kouvb593kdnuewnd]

Food is way more easier to produce in Civ VI because after feudalism civic your farms get an adjacency bonus from each other. Each adjacent farm increase food production by 1 so up to +6 food per farm is possible after feudalism.

Thundra and Desert are not that bad, they are pretty much the best terrain types for religious game if you can grab their pathernon. +1 faith for holy district for each adjacent thundra/desert is huge.

Costal is great for tourism as well as for trade because the port district add one trade route and the best trade routes are likely to be naval as in civilization V. Trade is the number one way to get gold.

 

[ProMeTheus112]

would it be better & make sense if desert and snow tiles were worth 1P? (2P with hills?)
is petra a wonder? it gives this much yield to all non floodplain desert tiles??

 

[mrwho]

would it be better & make sense if desert and snow tiles were worth 1P? (2P with hills?)
is petra a wonder? it gives this much yield to all non floodplain desert tiles??

Yep, it's a wonder. But I got mixed up. according to Well of Souls it gives +2 food, +1 production, and +2 gold to all non-floodplain desert tiles. I got the gold and production the wrong way round.

 

[LDiCesare]

No data about coastal and ocean?
The information basically means hills are extremely desirable. I guess they can't be farmed or something in order to compensate, but since you're going to build districts on tiles, might as well put them there if they keep their yields.

 

[ProMeTheus112]

ok I checked the Petra it is for the desert tiles of the city that built the Petra only not civilization wide :O^^

 

[King Jason]

No data about coastal and ocean?

Coast is 1 food 1 gold, Ocean is 1 food.

 

[mrwho]

ok I checked the Petra it is for the desert tiles of the city that built the Petra only not civilization wide :O^^

Whoops! I knew that, for some reason I just forgot to mention it. My bad.

 

[stiiknafuulia]

Coast is 1 food 1 gold, Ocean is 1 food.

Thanks, I will add them to the table. (I'm pretty sure they'll be altered by the Lighthouse and whatnot, as such low yields would be worthless on their own, but hey, a yield is a yield.)

 

[Dark_Jedi06]

I don't think maintanence was in the build we've seen. I know building maintenance wasn't in, and I believe that will be in the game. As far as unit maintenance is concerned - while The support structure of previous games may have returned - I didn't make note of any players army reducing their income. Though I can't be sure.

If I remember correctly, I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that there won't be building maintenance.

 

[Haggbart]

So desert hills given only 1 production now instead of 2. Interesting direction to go in. Not sure if I agree with it, because it just makes Petra even more integral to a desert start. Petra now provides +2 food, +2 production, +1 gold to all non-floodplain desert tiles, so in terms of yield it's already much better than in Civ V where it was already very strong. Now it sounds like if you don't get Petra, a desert city is utterly terrible, whereas in the past it was still workable with flood plains and a good amount of hills.

(edit) Whoops, actually it's +2 food, +2 gold, +1 production.

Yeah, however the extra trade route slot and the free caravan it gave in CiV was probably worth it alone. Still seems like one of the best wonders in cVI so far if you start near desert.

 

[Acken]

I don't like the yield system they've shown. Especially that hills are a bonus yield.
Those hill forest look a little ridiculous giving you as much as an improved wheat on flat. It makes no sense.

Hope it's an early build thing and this gets changed. Or maybe there are different ways for flat land to become good.

I like the fact that they made forest and jungle bonuses though.

 

[malekithau]

Desert and tundra may be useful for districts. They are also traditionally the terrain most likely to yield iron. Farms are going to be less important as technology advances so perhaps these yields may not matter as much in VI.