TR04 - Losers vs 5CC deity
- Thread starter Tubby Rower
- Start date
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
That's why I didn't land. I could have played a couple more turns last night but didn't want to make a mistake that would cost us 22 artillery. I'd wait for a few more. The Spaniards have TOW so be careful.
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
I think that weakening Pamplona so that the Arabs can take that city will greatly divert the Spanish troops so that we could go after Madrid.... Comments?
eldar
ChiefTank
Hmm, that might work. Hitting non-metros will be easier as well. I'd still like more troops, even if they're only geurillas.
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
Well there are 2 transports near Caesarea. The rail network will allow you to pretty much get any unit anywhere into those transports. I did spread some around when the Spainish ships cam close. I blocked the coast as much as possible.
Preturn (1740AD)
Load up 6 cavs, send 'em up toward Pamplona. It'll take them 3 turns to arrive. I land the troops on the mountain near there.
(I) zzz
T1 (1745AD)
Bomb the heck outta Pamplona, redline all units, destroy rax.
Eight units in there.
(I) Get some pollution
T2 (1750AD)
Land the cavs by Pamplona on the hill, move the arty over.
(I) zzz
T3 (1752AD)
Burn Pamplona, lost 2 infantry.
(I) zzz
T4 (1754AD)
Settler and infantry move on to old Pamplona, boats bomb it down, 2 cavs die to it, the third takes it. Move all units into the boats.
(I) zzz
T5 (1756AD)
(I) Iroquois demand WM and 100g, ok fine.
Hoover!
T6 (1758AD)
(I) zzz
T7 (1760AD)
Steal Mass prod from the Iroquois!
No trades, though. 
(I) Ok, here we go, Spanish and Iroquois start UN.
T8 (1762AD)
Spanish are building it in Barcelona, Iroquois in Salamanca.
(I) zzz
T9 (1764AD)
(I) zzz
T10 (1766AD)
WW hits us, I up lux to 10%.
So how we gonna win this? I really don't have any bright ideas. I have a force of five cruisers bombing the Spanish coasts. Behind that, our transports are heading toward Barcelona -- the main force is 2 turns away, and there's a few reinforcements that just started off, they should get there a turn behind. Alternatively, that force could land in the east as a diversion. But I don't know how burning Barcelona is gonna help us...
We're stealing every 10 turns, but there's no one to trade with. Spain will talk now.
save
Load up 6 cavs, send 'em up toward Pamplona. It'll take them 3 turns to arrive. I land the troops on the mountain near there.
(I) zzz
T1 (1745AD)
Bomb the heck outta Pamplona, redline all units, destroy rax.
Eight units in there.(I) Get some pollution
T2 (1750AD)
Land the cavs by Pamplona on the hill, move the arty over.
(I) zzz
T3 (1752AD)
Burn Pamplona, lost 2 infantry.
(I) zzz
T4 (1754AD)
Settler and infantry move on to old Pamplona, boats bomb it down, 2 cavs die to it, the third takes it. Move all units into the boats.
(I) zzz
T5 (1756AD)
(I) Iroquois demand WM and 100g, ok fine.
Hoover!
T6 (1758AD)
(I) zzz
T7 (1760AD)
Steal Mass prod from the Iroquois!
No trades, though. (I) Ok, here we go, Spanish and Iroquois start UN.
T8 (1762AD)
Spanish are building it in Barcelona, Iroquois in Salamanca.
(I) zzz
T9 (1764AD)
(I) zzz
T10 (1766AD)
WW hits us, I up lux to 10%.
So how we gonna win this? I really don't have any bright ideas. I have a force of five cruisers bombing the Spanish coasts. Behind that, our transports are heading toward Barcelona -- the main force is 2 turns away, and there's a few reinforcements that just started off, they should get there a turn behind. Alternatively, that force could land in the east as a diversion. But I don't know how burning Barcelona is gonna help us...
We're stealing every 10 turns, but there's no one to trade with. Spain will talk now.
save
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
How about sabotaging the UN builds? How much does that cost?
Was the steal a safe or careful one? I was able to pull off a careful one but I guess in the long term we should stay with safe unless we switch to Commie...
Was the steal a safe or careful one? I was able to pull off a careful one but I guess in the long term we should stay with safe unless we switch to Commie...
eldar
ChiefTank
I don't think we need to worry about the UN. I doubt the Spanish would dare call a vote.
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
But do we need to make sure that the Spanish get it by sabotaging the Iroquois?
eldar
ChiefTank
I doubt any of the AIs would call a vote. How long can we keep up the sabotage, though? We still have a good few techs to steal before we can build it ourselves.
Safe steals hiave a better chance of escaping on failure, but cost more, IIRC. According to Oynstein's article the best value is the "careful". If we are using spies the best bet is a careful steal as Gweeto is pretty good at getting away.
Sabotage costs way more than creating a dogpile on the UN builder. We may also want to consider removing some of the weaker players from the map unless it will trigger a domination victory for someone. With only a handful still standing the risks of a vote are lower.
As DocT would tell us, this stage of the game is all about manipulating the AI. So we need to think about how to stall the vote, if it becomes an issue.
Sabotage costs way more than creating a dogpile on the UN builder. We may also want to consider removing some of the weaker players from the map unless it will trigger a domination victory for someone. With only a handful still standing the risks of a vote are lower.
As DocT would tell us, this stage of the game is all about manipulating the AI. So we need to think about how to stall the vote, if it becomes an issue.
Minute Man
Prince
That's OK. Just about everybody else has held up this game at some point, so I guess it's your turn. 
Speaking of which, I'm going to be out of town (and away from my computer) from tomorrow (Thursday) through Sunday. And, of course, I'm up in another game, so even if dman finishes today I probably won't be able to play tonight. I had a skip the last time around, so I'd rather not be completely skipped this time, but if the next player or two (Bede?) can swap with me, that'd probably work best.
Speaking of which, I'm going to be out of town (and away from my computer) from tomorrow (Thursday) through Sunday. And, of course, I'm up in another game, so even if dman finishes today I probably won't be able to play tonight. I had a skip the last time around, so I'd rather not be completely skipped this time, but if the next player or two (Bede?) can swap with me, that'd probably work best.
Minute Man said:That's OK. Just about everybody else has held up this game at some point, so I guess it's your turn.
Speaking of which, I'm going to be out of town (and away from my computer) from tomorrow (Thursday) through Sunday. And, of course, I'm up in another game, so even if dman finishes today I probably won't be able to play tonight. I had a skip the last time around, so I'd rather not be completely skipped this time, but if the next player or two (Bede?) can swap with me, that'd probably work best.
Looks like i can drag this game until Sunday.
Pre-turn: Investigated Barselona - 25 turns until UN is built.
Investigated Salamanca - 13 turns until UN is built.. so what is the big idea of attacking Spain???
I am making peace and they pay us 223 gold + 14gpt...
they are at war with everyone else that will tie them and i need to get rid of WW.
Sold Atomic Theory to Inca for 19gpt + 165gold
Give Spain furs and horses for wines and rubber.
Disbanded useless ironclads... paying too much for unit support. swithed couple of cities to wealth and couple of others from guerilla to infantry to finish next turn. Lux down to 0% with the help of couple of clowns.
Making 510gpt.
IBT. Iros and Hittites signed peace. Inca and Spain signed peace.
T1. 1768. time to collect some money and keep stealing from spain. if they declare oh well... i have troops ready nearby to burn Barselona to the ground.
T2. 1770AD. Do immediate steal from Spain and we have Mot.Transport. Any tanks anyone???
First 5 tanks will get of factory belts next turn with the help of few cavs and guriellas disbands.
T3. 1772AD. Turning that transport of 6 units back... will disband those and replace with tanks.
T4. 1774AD.... I am thinking whether i should collect money to steal techs or collect money to destroy UN build in Salamanca
T5. 1776AD..... Going for careful steal from spain and get us flight. We are in modern age and have ecology as free tech. the problem is we can't get any other MA tech for trade... so i sell it to arabs and spain for 98 and 23gpt and Iros already have it. I guess now the plan should be to steal UN, sabotage UN builds in Salamanca and Barselona if needed and get UN ourselves. Oops... it will cost 3600gold for immediate sabotage and 6500+ for safe... Salamanca will built UN in 6 turns... too late for us. I started palace prebuild for UN in Caesarea but then changed my mind...
T6. 1778AD
T7 1780AD
T8. 1782AD.... will try to steal next turn
T9. 1784AD... Checking tech parity status.. Spain has monopoly on computers. I am trying careful steal and Spain has no monopoly on computers. Try to trade computers with iro but all they want to give is 2000 something in gold..
Ok i take gold.
Iro's don't have aluminum... so no MIs if we want to take on them.
T10. 1786AD. Thanks to Iro's we have money for the safe steal. Try Spain again and got us Rocketry.
Checking status. We have Aluminum connected and have another source we can connect for trading.
We can trade techs to Arabs for some gpt, i would sell them rocketry and if they don't have aluminum they will be
good trading parnters for years to come... Do not trade aluminum to Iro's we might want to raze Salamanca after UN is built.
We still have our fleet and army near Spain shore... Not sure what to do militarywise... all i was doing is kept stealing from spain and had army ready in case if they declare.
Investigated Salamanca - 13 turns until UN is built.. so what is the big idea of attacking Spain???
I am making peace and they pay us 223 gold + 14gpt...
they are at war with everyone else that will tie them and i need to get rid of WW.
Sold Atomic Theory to Inca for 19gpt + 165gold
Give Spain furs and horses for wines and rubber.
Disbanded useless ironclads... paying too much for unit support. swithed couple of cities to wealth and couple of others from guerilla to infantry to finish next turn. Lux down to 0% with the help of couple of clowns.
Making 510gpt.
IBT. Iros and Hittites signed peace. Inca and Spain signed peace.
T1. 1768. time to collect some money and keep stealing from spain. if they declare oh well... i have troops ready nearby to burn Barselona to the ground.
T2. 1770AD. Do immediate steal from Spain and we have Mot.Transport. Any tanks anyone???
First 5 tanks will get of factory belts next turn with the help of few cavs and guriellas disbands.
T3. 1772AD. Turning that transport of 6 units back... will disband those and replace with tanks.
T4. 1774AD.... I am thinking whether i should collect money to steal techs or collect money to destroy UN build in Salamanca
T5. 1776AD..... Going for careful steal from spain and get us flight. We are in modern age and have ecology as free tech. the problem is we can't get any other MA tech for trade... so i sell it to arabs and spain for 98 and 23gpt and Iros already have it. I guess now the plan should be to steal UN, sabotage UN builds in Salamanca and Barselona if needed and get UN ourselves. Oops... it will cost 3600gold for immediate sabotage and 6500+ for safe... Salamanca will built UN in 6 turns... too late for us. I started palace prebuild for UN in Caesarea but then changed my mind...
T6. 1778AD
T7 1780AD
T8. 1782AD.... will try to steal next turn
T9. 1784AD... Checking tech parity status.. Spain has monopoly on computers. I am trying careful steal and Spain has no monopoly on computers. Try to trade computers with iro but all they want to give is 2000 something in gold..
Ok i take gold.
Iro's don't have aluminum... so no MIs if we want to take on them.
T10. 1786AD. Thanks to Iro's we have money for the safe steal. Try Spain again and got us Rocketry.
Checking status. We have Aluminum connected and have another source we can connect for trading.
We can trade techs to Arabs for some gpt, i would sell them rocketry and if they don't have aluminum they will be
good trading parnters for years to come... Do not trade aluminum to Iro's we might want to raze Salamanca after UN is built.
We still have our fleet and army near Spain shore... Not sure what to do militarywise... all i was doing is kept stealing from spain and had army ready in case if they declare.
Need some help here, gents.
And I can play it tomorrow in place of the Minute Man if that works with everybody.
Do we have any notion of Hiawatha's standing in the world? I know that he and Izzie have been rivals since the beginning and they are the only candidates as no one holds 25%. The Iro are at 34% and Izzie at 16% and Paco at 15%.
Hiawatha is very cozy with the Arab (MPP partners) and appears to have comfortable relationships with the Inca, though there is a trade embargo running with the Inca against the Hittites.
Hittites are at war with Spain, so that looks like an abstention, Inca are in bed with Hiawatha, so that's a vote for Iro, Arabs are at war with Spain and are MPP partners with Iro so that's another vote for Hiawatha, so the headcount looks like 3 for Hiawatha (himself, Arabs and Inca) 1 for Spain (herself) and 2 abstaining (us and Mursilis), so there is at best a simple 50% for Hiawatha, not enough for him to call the vote anytime soon.
Somebody want to check my math?
Given all that we have a pretty good chance of avoiding the attack on Salamanca, at least for a while yet.
And I can play it tomorrow in place of the Minute Man if that works with everybody.
Do we have any notion of Hiawatha's standing in the world? I know that he and Izzie have been rivals since the beginning and they are the only candidates as no one holds 25%. The Iro are at 34% and Izzie at 16% and Paco at 15%.
Hiawatha is very cozy with the Arab (MPP partners) and appears to have comfortable relationships with the Inca, though there is a trade embargo running with the Inca against the Hittites.
Hittites are at war with Spain, so that looks like an abstention, Inca are in bed with Hiawatha, so that's a vote for Iro, Arabs are at war with Spain and are MPP partners with Iro so that's another vote for Hiawatha, so the headcount looks like 3 for Hiawatha (himself, Arabs and Inca) 1 for Spain (herself) and 2 abstaining (us and Mursilis), so there is at best a simple 50% for Hiawatha, not enough for him to call the vote anytime soon.
Somebody want to check my math?
Given all that we have a pretty good chance of avoiding the attack on Salamanca, at least for a while yet.
Tubby Rower
Chronic Slacker
Why not declare on Iroquois and buy some MA?
The Hittites & Iroquois were fighting earlier in the late MA and early IA. I've never had to worry about this so I'm useless otherwise.
The Hittites & Iroquois were fighting earlier in the late MA and early IA. I've never had to worry about this so I'm useless otherwise.
eldar
ChiefTank
Well, all we were getting from the Iros was coal. Don't need that now - in fact we need to be at peace with Izzy for her rubber! Only problem is, Hiawatha can easily bomb us.
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