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Trade

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by matlajs, Jan 12, 2016.

  1. matlajs

    matlajs King

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    Guys i have to ask how works trade modifier by AI. I have problem(or not have if i manage get enough money by myself) that AI dont want trade with me and i have to ask why. There are some severals routes to my harbor but when i see they all together trading i wanna know whats bad. Relations,Resources,pop or whatever else makes a diference?
     
  2. Jaybe

    Jaybe civus fanaticus Supporter

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    Are you referring to trading of resources or Trade Routes?

    With either (but especially of resources), AI attitude has an affect, though an AI will do a trade route with you IF it would be to their advantage for either tourism or science purposes. They may base their trade routes destinations on their total gold profit, the NET profit (theirs minus yours), or the afore-mentioned tourism or science.

    Re trade routes, you don't generally WANT them to: the trade route OWNER will usually get much more gold from their trade route than you will. When you hover over a trade route in the trade route window, it will show you the yields and how they are derived (different resources, city income, trade-enhancing buildings (e.g., caravansary, market, bank, harbor), adjacent river, tech & tourism advantage, ....
     
  3. meatpardle

    meatpardle Warlord

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    Yeah it's it's important to be able to define the two types of trading in Civ 5

    Trade Routes - these are performed by caravans (land) or cargo ships (sea) and are the routes that you can see on the map. Unless you are at war the AI will always allow you to set up trade routes to them as long as their cities are in range. If you're trying to set up a caravan or cargo ship route and a civ doesn't appear on the list then it's either because they are out of range (or you already have routes going to their cities that are in range).

    Trading Resources - this is where you trade with another civ's leader in the diplomacy screen, and does not depend on trade routes or caravans/cargo ships available on the map.

    This is where you will find that times that a civ doesn't want to trade with you. If you are trying to trade a resource for either money or another resource and the AI won't trade with you it's likely because they have a different value of your resource, and I find that is mainly driven by relationship.

    For example, I find that if you have a good relationship with a civ they will be happy to trade one of your resources for one of theirs, or pay you 7 GPT for a luxury resource.

    However if you have a bad relationship they may only be willing to pay 5 or 6 GPT for your luxury resource, but because they still value their luxury resource at 7 GPT they will not swap resources.

    I have had offers from civs who really do not like me of 2 or 3 GPT for a luxury resource.

    Also worth remembering that the AI generally values strategic resources (horses, iron, oil) at 1 GPT and also diplomatic agreements (embassy, open borders) at 1 GPT, so if they value your luxury resource at 6 GPT thy could offer you a combination of the above (2 GPT + 2 horses + 1 oil + open borders).

    Hope this helps, if not feel free to ask more.
     
  4. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    But it is better that you get that small benefit rather than another competitor! External trade routes to my cities is often the only think keeping me in the black!

    Your cities with multiple resources and luxes (within 3 hexes) are most profitable for the AI civs. Coastal cities are more accessible and cargo ships generate more gold than caravans. Building the East India Trading Company in a city makes it a more attractive target for external routes. I am not clear if building a harbor or caravansary helps a city attract external trade routes.

    Really, the only downside to trade is keeping your religion, as a bunch of routes to the same city will counteract your local religious pressure. I like to build EITC and Grand Temple in the same city when I can. Often, this is the cap, but it does not have to be.
     
  5. meatpardle

    meatpardle Warlord

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    Ah, if the OP means why isn't the AI sending trade routes to their cities, then ignore my post completely :D
     
  6. Jaybe

    Jaybe civus fanaticus Supporter

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    No, they would not. These only affect outgoing trade.
     
  7. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    It is not clear to me exactly what OP is asking, so I answered the question that I could!

    Thanks for that detail! Can you explain more why you don’t like attracting foreign trade routes? I have seen threads where people suggest offering resolutions in WC to boycott themselves as a means of avoiding them. I do not follow the logic!
     
  8. shaglio

    shaglio The Prince of Dorkness

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    I can't imagine why you wouldn't want AI trade routes sent to you. You get a small amount of gold, and the larger amount of gold the AI gets gives you more opportunity to trade your excess luxuries to them or sign RAs with them.
     
  9. Jaybe

    Jaybe civus fanaticus Supporter

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    beetle, if I am somewhat comfortable with my finances then why would I like to get 2-3 gold when the AI is getting 5-8 times as much?

    Not totally logical, I admit; and remember I am playing Prince/King with Acken's mod (on a huge continents map).
     
  10. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    1. That is 2-3 gold for free. Why not?
    2. They will giving someone that 2-3 gold, as they will be trading all they can. Better you than one of your competitors! They will be earning almost as much from competitor, and they have plenty of gold, so it is not like you would be penalizing them significantly by not being available for trade.
     
  11. matlajs

    matlajs King

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    sorry guys i mot so active i ment ofc trade routes. I play on Emperor as tall Spain coz of no place where expand(shatered- random map) So i did the best what i thougt it will be.I wanted to do my main trade/money making city of my second(Barcelona) Pfff sources duno now certainly but surely sheeps,cows,horses,chocolate,fished,whales, unfortunetely no strategic res. and no river. It was rly bad start position but i want play every random game to be little fair to AI.


    edit: yes i ment why AI dont make trade routes with my city.And if its true what is writen above, i mean about gold profit so than whats a point of india trade company world when AI rather make another route elsewhere for lesser profit of city owner? Its always easy determine which cities has india company since their profit is often about 12-14 GP.
     
  12. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Your coastal city with EITC, with whales, and cocoa should be attracting trade deals. You have to wait a while (for current TR to expire) after EITC is done to notice the uptick in traffic
     
  13. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    That assumes your coastal EITC city is in convenient range of AI cargo ships. I've had games where my capital was nestled down near the South Pole, well out of range of most AI capitals (most of which were not on coasts anyway). Sometimes, a very attractive trading city is located in a relatively inaccessible location; result is fewer AI trade routes, at least until much later in the game when the AI has researched techs (like Refrigeration) that extend cargo ship range.
     
  14. matlajs

    matlajs King

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    hmm EITC has been built many many turns ago.My trade routes from barca are in range to all of Russia coastal cities,carthaginians,Bismarcs,Hunics,Sweden Danish and also Indonesians. But how i see every possible trade route heading just in Jakart :c5capital: of Indonesia, also i see in my trade list that city as most profitable :( Anyway im not in range of USA and Venice but i dont think is changing factor of this prob.Every civ has ca 6 trade routes and none heading to my city( Madrir, Barca) so its weird. I saw that occured in some previous games before, and in some it was fine so i wanted know whats bad. Must be said that my isle is almost a hearth of map and i intently chosed Barcelona as trading capital coz of better position and sources.


    edit: one more question-which resources has efect on profit in trade routes and is that efect multipled with more tiles of one resource? Im asking bcoz have a lot of few luxuries losing value after ideologies where one denouncing each other and is than untradable

    second question :D i dont want make new thread for that. Its about ideologies. How works free points in ideologies? Who gain them? First two fastest factions? And next one is how works influence on happynes- its about turism?or cultural progress(income pt/summary)?
     

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