Unit strengths/cost: realistic

[Chamboozer]

United Kingdom Cont'd

Light Tanks

Spoiler :

Mark VI Light Tank; 10 , 3 , 440 , +150% vs. Gunpowder Units
Tetrarch Tank, 22 , 3 , 500 , Can Paradrop Range 10
Mk VIII Light Tank; 25 , 5 , 470 , +10% vs. Gunpowder Units

Aircraft

Spoiler :

Hawker Hurricane; 20 , Range 10, 525 , 70% Interception Chance
Supermarine Spitfire; 25 , Range 15, 475 , 85% Interception Chance
Gloster Meteor Jet Fighter; 30, Range 17, 550 , 85% Interception Chance, Causes Collateral Damage

Vickers Wellington Bomber; 10 , Range 29, 650 , Causes Collateral Damage
Lancaster Bomber; 15 , Range 35, 650 , Causes Collateral Damage
Mosquito Bomber; 25 , Range 30, 600 , Causes Collateral Damage

 

[Chamboozer]

Union of Soviet Socialist Republics

Infantry

Spoiler :

Russian Early Infantry; 15 , 2 , 400 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units,
Russian Improved Infantry; 15 , 2 , 200 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units,
Russian Advanced Infantry; 20 , 3 , 250 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units,

NOTE - I know the Russian infanry should be equal to germany's at the Advanced level, but after my experiences fighting them when their infantry produced at normal levels, I cannot subject my self or anyone else to the sight of another 300 unit Infantry stack the russians like to build and still keep a clear conscience. Nuking that was fun, though.

Tanks

Spoiler :

T-35; 22 , 3 , 550 , +10% vs. Armor
(upon research of Sloped Armor)T-34; 30 , 3 , 550 +10% vs. Armor,
KV-1; 30 , 3 , 650 , +20% vs. Armor

 

[Chamboozer]

Union of Soviet Socialist Republics Cont'd

Light Tanks

Spoiler :

T-26; 15 , 4 , 300 , +10% vs. Gunpowder Units
BT Tank; 20 , 6 , 500 , 1-2 First Strikes
T-70; 25 , 4 , 550 , +10% vs. Gunpowder Units

Aircraft

Spoiler :

I-153 Chaika Fighter; 10 , Range 8, 400 , 60% Interception Chance
Il-2 Fighter; 17 , Range 8, 450 , 75% Interception Chance, +10% vs. Armor Units
Mig 15 Fighter; 35 , Range 19, 550 , 90% Interception Chance

Tupolev TB-4; 10 , Range 20, 500 , Causes Collateral Damage
Ilyushin Il 4; 15 , Range 38, 600 , Causes Collateral Damage, +10% Collateral Damage
Tupolev TU-4; 20 , Range 62, 800 , Causes Collateral Damage, +30% Chance Of Being intercepted

 

[Chamboozer]

United States of America

Infantry

Spoiler :

Early American Infantry; 7 , 2 , 350 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units
Improved American Infantry; 15 , 2 , 350 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units
Advanced American Infantry; 24 , 3 , 350 , +10% City Defense, +25% vs. Siege Units

Tanks

Spoiler :

M4 Sherman Tank; 25 , 3 , 500 ,
M26 Pershing Tank; 30 , 2 , 600 ,

 

[Chamboozer]

United States of America Cont'd

Light Tanks

Spoiler :

M2 Light Tank; 15 , 5 :move, 500 , +10% vs. Gunpowder Units
Sherman DD, Starts with "Amphibious"; 25 , 3 , 600 , Starts with Amphibious
M24 Chaffee; 22 , 4 , 425 , +10%vs. Gunpowder Units

Aircraft

Spoiler :

P-40 Warhawk; 15 , Range 11, 400 , 70% Interception Chance
P-51 Mustang; 25 , 18 Range, 400 , 80% Interception Chance
FR Fireball; 30 , 21 Range, 450 , 85% Interception Chance

NOTE - Dale, the P-59 Airacomet can't be used by America because realistically, it has the range of 3 tiles - EXTREMELY bad.
NOTE 2 - Tomahawk is actually called the Warhawk by the Americans. Tomahawk is only the british/soviet nickname for it

B-18 Bolo; 10 , 18 Range, 575 , Causes Collateral Damage
B17 Flying Fortress; 20, Range 32, 700 , Causes Collateral Damage, + 20% Chance Of Being Intercepted
B29 Superfortress; 30 , Range 52, 950 , Causes Collateral Damage, +30% Collateral Damage, + 30% Chance Of Being Intercepted

NOTE - Note the extreme build time on the B29. Slightly more than realistic to balance it.

Finally done organizing! Time to put in the unit names, now.

 

[vidimce]

I agree with allmost all of chamboozer's suggestions. I'd like to see the Panther tank for Germany though. There was I think about 5 - 10 000 of them produced during the war. And it was proven to be the best tank overall and made life hell for the allies.

About Panzer 4; The earlier versions of the Panzer 4 medium tank were very effective against infantry because it featured short high velocity turrets so that ability can be boosted a bit more. It was ineffective against armor tho. Later in the war, the Panzer 4 was upgraded with a longer turret with armor penetrating capability and additional armor plates were being added to help with protection and to keep pace with the better T-34.

And since you havent filled in Russian infantry, I think it should cost 250 - 275, to represent the sheer numbers that the Soviets had. The T-34 should be relatively cheap to, it was massively produced, 50 000 tanks during the war. So I would say 450 - 475.

Cheers.

 

[Tboy]

Excellent work, boozer! I'd go with most of those suggestions.

I like the increased uniqueness of each civ's units - adds in more flavour and strategy.

I agree with allmost all of chamboozer's suggestions. I'd like to see the Panther tank for Germany though. There was I think about 5 - 10 000 of them produced during the war. And it was proven to be the best tank overall and made life hell for the allies.

About Panzer 4; The earlier versions of the Panzer 4 medium tank were very effective against infantry because it featured short high velocity turrets so that ability can be boosted a bit more. It was ineffective against armor tho. Later in the war, the Panzer 4 was upgraded with a longer turret with armor penetrating capability and additional armor plates were being added to help with protection and to keep pace with the better T-34.

And since you havent filled in Russian infantry, I think it should cost 250 - 275, to represent the sheer numbers that the Soviets had. The T-34 should be relatively cheap to, it was massively produced, 50 000 tanks during the war. So I would say 450 - 475.

Cheers.

But surely the Russian's mass numbers are more represented through them being the largest country, and thus having one of the largest productions?

 

[Zulu Impi]

Double post.

 

[Zulu Impi]

Great suggestions cham one thing though for japanese infantry give them 3 movement. As they were usually light and fast on the attack either that or +50 percent in jungles. Anyways here are my paratroopers and marine suggestions
Paratrooper str 15, movement 3 cost 800(they would already need to be trained infantry) 25% att v siege and gunpowder (so they can beat basic and maybe improved infantry but other then that only really effective attacking)
Marine str 20, movement 2, cost 850, starts with amphibious. You could possibly move back the tech required to include polymerization if they would be too good early.

 

[Omathaar]

Yeah, I like the idea of more unique units too. Flavor's a big part of this mod. Yer the man for doing all this, Dale!

 

[Zulu Impi]

Yeah well on the subject have you considered adding unique units for more factions dale? For instance Finland could have different looking infantry with a large winter advantage. Also australia and greece could use unique infantry as they were definitely better then average. It would also draw players to usually unused factions.

 

[Tboy]

Yeah well on the subject have you considered adding unique units for more factions dale? For instance Finland could have different looking infantry with a large winter advantage. Also australia and greece could use unique infantry as they were definitely better then average. It would also draw players to usually unused factions.

Good points, especially on Finland - it's far too easy to conquer them utterly in the Winter War as the USSR (I manage it most times). Their infantry should certainly be much better in the Bitter Winter.

 

[The_Coyote]

perhaps considering the flavour units, also working with promotions could work, eg. the the T34 would be the best middle weight tank (yes the panther also counted as middle weight tank, but had the weight of a heavy), but lacked of trained crews and tactics (the last also counted for france), so an option could be give the germans tanks anti-tank and combat I+II promotions and the russian T-34 none, so a trained T34 would be better than the german counterpart but out from the factory the germans had a bonus

 

[Joe Harker]

Query for boozer, under modern anti tank do you mean +100% (Thus against armor it would have 40 strength) as you have put +200% which is 60 against tanks which is very overpowered?

 

[Chamboozer]

Query for boozer, under modern anti tank do you mean +100% (Thus against armor it would have 40 strength) as you have put +200% which is 60 against tanks which is very overpowered?

My bad its fixed now, along with basic tank destroyers having +200%, its +100% now.

I'll look into everything you've said. And also, If someone can find a way to include the Panther without adding a completely new unit, or making another permanent unit obsolete, then let me know.

Panzer IV needs to be balanced out completely because Germany is going to be using it for the whole game up to the point they research Modern Armor. That's why I made it more like a beefed-up medium tank, because there's no way to simulate its midwar upgrades without replacing it as a unit, and medium tanks don't get replaced.

Or,

Perhaps It can be replaced with Panzer IV Ausf. D when the player researches "Improved C31 & Logistics", (can't remember what that tech name is exactly.)
If that's the case, then
Panzer IV; 25 , 3 , 550 , +10% vs. Gunpowder Units, +15% vs. Siege Units
Panzer IV Ausf. D; 27 , 3 , 575 , +10% vs. Armor, +10% vs. Siege Units

Hmm?

We can do something similar for the Russians so when they research "Sloped Armor", they replace a weaker Medium Tank with the T-34. This would be good because I want to make the T-34 a VERY good tank, and having it as the first technology to research would be mindbogglingly unbalanced.
What do you think?

 

[Dale]

I don't mind another tank class if you want to go that way.

 

[Chamboozer]

I don't mind another tank class if you want to go that way.

Any reason not to include technological mostrosities like germany's railroad cannons?

Railroad Cannon; 20 , 1 , 2250 , Can only move on railroads, Can bombard terrain (3 Range), Causes Collateral Damage, +50% Collateral Damage, -50% vs. Gunpowder Units.

Its a stretch, I know, but my friend made me suggest it!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwerer_Gustav

 

[sangeli]

Wow chamboozer. I think you need to change the fact that there are three light tank classes. The tank classes should be: early tank, light tank, medium tank, and heavy tank. Considering that you can't even come up with two light tanks it means you have too many tanks. Each tank unit should also be its own class so that, for example, medium tanks are +20% against light tanks and +40% against early tanks.

And chamboozer, how could you forget about the Panther tank?

 

[The_Coyote]

And chamboozer, how could you forget about the Panther tank?

but than germany had two heavy tanks

(Panther: 43 - 45,5 t, Tiger: 56,9 t, IS-2 (or JS-2 - russian heavy tank): 47 t, T-34: 26,5 - 33t)

@ chamboozer
perhaps changing the KV-1 (untill 43) to IS-2 (end 43/44) in the russian list,
german light tanks: Panzer II - Panzer III - Panzer III J

 

[Chamboozer]

Wow chamboozer. I think you need to change the fact that there are three light tank classes. The tank classes should be: early tank, light tank, medium tank, and heavy tank. Considering that you can't even come up with two light tanks it means you have too many tanks. Each tank unit should also be its own class so that, for example, medium tanks are +20% against light tanks and +40% against early tanks.

And chamboozer, how could you forget about the Panther tank?

Didn't you read the whole thing? I'm not finished yet! I'm having no problem finding enough tanks.

I'm looking for a way to include Panthers.

The evolution of tanks you suggested seems too linear to be realistic. I don't know if anyone else agrees with me here, but your method seems strange because as tanks upgrade, their earlier counterparts become obsolete, leaving the player to build only Heavy Tanks. No variety.