Units not using?

[Grand Seeker]

I must admit that I haven't played through the game yet (at modern age now) but I still have a few comments:
Automation/Cyborgs
In the guide it is stated that these units are not STRONGER than the previus units, but is alot cheaper. The problem with that strategy is that even on epic time scale my modern tank or APC take 2-3 turns to crank out anyway. And when I get Autmation/Cyborgs my APC would probably take 1 turn to build. Whats the point about cheap units when your expensive units takes 1 turn to build anyway? These might be better in general in marathon or snail speed. But on speeds anything lower than epic, I cannot see what use these have.

Siege Quinceremes: I love the graphics and the ide. In my opinion all early ships are way to slow to make them usefull. With roads, any land-based unit outrun them anyway. And then, whats the big point? Is it possible to increase the speed to atleast 2 (base speed of 4)? Also is it possible to increase the speed of ships in known terretory? I can imagine boats
go alot faster if you know the land. So That speed is maybe 4 within your own cultural boarders but drops to 2 outside?

Sea-planes: Could have been fun since they can be put on a cruiser, but in my game they
were obseloout before I could try.

Bazooka & Flamerthrower: these could be upgraded to Powerarmor units?

Special Forces: I actually like these a lot due to the comando promotion.

The UN vehicles. Even though I might not use them, I realy enjoy the ide of being able to send in UN forces to defend a city versus an attacker.

 

[zappara]

I must admit that I haven't played through the game yet (at modern age now) but I still have a few comments:
Automation/Cyborgs
In the guide it is stated that these units are not STRONGER than the previus units, but is alot cheaper. The problem with that strategy is that even on epic time scale my modern tank or APC take 2-3 turns to crank out anyway. And when I get Autmation/Cyborgs my APC would probably take 1 turn to build. Whats the point about cheap units when your expensive units takes 1 turn to build anyway? These might be better in general in marathon or snail speed. But on speeds anything lower than epic, I cannot see what use these have.

Siege Quinceremes: I love the graphics and the ide. In my opinion all early ships are way to slow to make them usefull. With roads, any land-based unit outrun them anyway. And then, whats the big point? Is it possible to increase the speed to atleast 2 (base speed of 4)? Also is it possible to increase the speed of ships in known terretory? I can imagine boats
go alot faster if you know the land. So That speed is maybe 4 within your own cultural boarders but drops to 2 outside?

Sea-planes: Could have been fun since they can be put on a cruiser, but in my game they
were obseloout before I could try.

Bazooka & Flamerthrower: these could be upgraded to Powerarmor units?

Special Forces: I actually like these a lot due to the comando promotion.

The UN vehicles. Even though I might not use them, I realy enjoy the ide of being able to send in UN forces to defend a city versus an attacker.

Clone units: I had barely time to add some new units to Transhuman era and there was no tweaking made for existing units before i had to rush the patch out so you could play the mod with BtS 3.19 - there will come more unit tweaks in later patches. At least I changed the graphics for few clone units in v2.7...

Basically whole Transhuman era units are open for discussion how to tweak them and what units to be added. I think I got graphics for at least dozen or more new unit types There needs to be better 'rock-paper-scissors' system for Transhuman era units and since there's so many unitcombat groups, it won't be easy task to modify them (I should be done with it by the next christmas )

 

[os79]

Clone units: I had barely time to add some new units to Transhuman era and there was no tweaking made for existing units before i had to rush the patch out so you could play the mod with BtS 3.19 - there will come more unit tweaks in later patches. At least I changed the graphics for few clone units in v2.7...

Basically whole Transhuman era units are open for discussion how to tweak them and what units to be added. I think I got graphics for at least dozen or more new unit types There needs to be better 'rock-paper-scissors' system for Transhuman era units and since there's so many unitcombat groups, it won't be easy task to modify them (I should be done with it by the next christmas )

*yip* Next Christimas? OUCH!

 

[strategyonly]

*yip* Next Christimas? OUCH!

Dang a big OUCH!!:suicide:

 

[zappara]

*yip* Next Christimas? OUCH!

Well, if you think about that v2.6 took 3 months to make and now v2.7 took another 3 months - we could be well at next xmas before v2.9 - at least slow patch cycle leave you more time to play each version

 

[Grand Seeker]

I enjoy this a lot, because this means you are open for suggestions.

I have no clue how easy it is to fit things from Fall from heaven 2 into your mod, but
some elements there could be used here. For example I have a realy cool ide what can be done about clone units.

The orcs in Fall from heaven 2 have a building which enables the orc to build two units
in the same time. So whenever the orc builds a spearman, it gets two.
Wouldn't this fit perfect for some clone units? Whenever you build one, you automaticly get three

Also, wouldn't it fit to make a building to give clone units more free XP? You could
also have several buildings, each with different requirments. For example
-building 1, +1 xp to clone units, requiers level 2 unit
-building 2, +2 xp to clone units, requiers level 4 unit
-building 3, +3 xp to clone units, requiers level 6 unit
-building 4, +4 xp to clone units, requiers level 8 unit
-building 5, +5 xp to clone units, reuqiers level 10 unit.
(with all buildings +15xp+ whatever else you have)

To balance this massive free xp clones should have in general lower strength

I also want to see more unique promotions for each class. (espesially for the droids)
-Automatic targeting system (droids only) :bonus versus clone units for example
-Power shields (droid only) :stronger verson of trench.
-Repair self (droids only):withdraw + some healing
-Missile Batteries: Can store one missile.
-Missile Factories: allways have one missile to use (here you can use the summon ability from FFII) You should not be able to store the missiles you produce, but having a unit which can use one missile each turn would be sweat

Somebody also wanted to see a robocop upgrade of the police unit. I enjoy

 

[cheesemijit]

Siege Quinceremes: I love the graphics and the ide. In my opinion all early ships are way to slow to make them usefull. With roads, any land-based unit outrun them anyway. And then, whats the big point? Is it possible to increase the speed to atleast 2 (base speed of 4)? Also is it possible to increase the speed of ships in known terretory? I can imagine boats
go alot faster if you know the land. So That speed is maybe 4 within your own cultural boarders but drops to 2 outside?

i remember someone before suggesting sea lanes (like roads) that you could build, you could let a work boat chart coast which gives the coast tile extra movement (probally at the cost of the work boat so you can't do it too quickly) or maybe build a lighthouse (which could have a small graphic).

 

[vincentz]

already did it see my signature (sea harvest)

 

[strategyonly]

OK here's what i got so far, tell me how far i am off or right on, this is for units only so far.
Will have the unit then the proposed str #, let me know what you'll think??

WarDog - 5
Pikeman - 9
LongBowman - 9
Light Cav - 10
Hvy Footman - 13
Knight - 13
Hvy Cav - 14
Bombard - 15
Adventurer - 15
Arque - 16
GuardDog - 15
FlintLock - 19
Cannon - 18
Grenadier - 23
Artillery - 25
AirShip - 20
Light Air Gun - 30
Motorcycle - 32
Guerrilla - 38
Light Artillery - 36
Flak 88 - 36
Light Tank A3A1 - 48
Police Aquad - 50
Sam Inf - 58
Mod Marine - 70
Anti Tank - 68
Humvee - 70
Mercenary - 70
Modern Para - 85
Hi Tech APC - 90
Auto?? - 90
ACV Sam - 130
ACV - 130
Sentinel - 220
Hi Tech Robot - 310
AH64 - 90
Walker Droid - 100

 

[strategyonly]

I need some comments/complaints etc, what do you think or needs to be changed? I cant believe nobody hasn't responded yet?

 

[Grand Seeker]

I dont have the units at hand so I cannot give spesific details.
Also, some of these idees might be slightly more difficult to implement.

In generall I'm in favor of finding others ways of balancing units than simple changing their strength.
Its far more fun if the units having low strength have special powers which makes them on par with the more powerfull units.

Pikemen/spearmen
The pike and the spear was historically a far better weapon than both the sword and the axe.
They dominated the battlefield for sentories. In cIV they are a simple anti-horsery weapon, while in reality they were a lot more versitile and being used as the basic weapon for a very long time. Therefor I strongly belive that the pike should be greatly imrproved versus everything else.

Police:
I like these units due to the anti-spy and anti-revlutionary role. They dont need to be strong.
Although I have not used them cuz I did not need to the last game, these unit dont need to be strong to be usefull.

Light Artellery:
If artellery etc. in future will need a road to enter wood hexes, light artellery could be made more unique by being able to enter wood hexes as infanteri units. This would make the light artellery realy unique. Maybe abilites such as bonus in 'difficult terrain', some features resembeling 'camuflage' abilities such as harder to damage by air-units, better defence maybe, bonus versus tanks.

Reconance units:
It would have been nasty fun if reconance units could give a unique promotion to units in its hex.
Also add in defensive withdrawl-rate, and the reconance units does not need to have high strength to be usefull. Also, advanced reconance units could be given a special abillity to hunt down other reconance units first.

Walker Droid:
This could be made different from the modern tanks simply by making droids in generall have access to other (and more powerfull) promotions.

Auto:
For these units I would love to be able to build 2 (or more?) of these at the same time.

Tanks
When it comes to tanks. I do understand that you want the tanks to be the main offensive tool as it fits the classical picture of a tank best. Howerver tanks have never been good at attacking cities, so realistically tanks could get a HUGE penelty when attacking cities. Sadly in cIV most fighting happens in cities which realy i find dissapointing, but there is not much we can do about it.

Airships:
These are the first air units. Being able to rebase, do reconance and possible doing damage without the enemy being able to fight back is by far good enough. Airships dont need anything.

 

[civ_king]

the dogs should have unlimited collateral (the 'pedia says it does collateral), it would be unique and I'd use it (I'm a newb and tried building the dogs for the collateral but it didn't work, I built a stACK OF 20

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

the dogs should have unlimited collateral (the 'pedia says it does collateral), it would be unique and I'd use it (I'm a newb and tried building the dogs for the collateral but it didn't work, I built a stACK OF 20

I believe that dogs having collateral damage was what was causing CTDs in the BarbCiv and Revolutions components.

 

[civ_king]

I believe that dogs having collateral damage was what was causing CTDs in the BarbCiv and Revolutions components.

damn... are you sure? I want the Collateral

 

[Bezhukov]

there are some units people mentioned that i actually use:
medics (very helpful units if you build them in the stacked great general city so they can have heal 3 and woodsmen 3 - as good as a super healing great general unit)
flame throwers (good city attackers. AI used them to kill a good number of my tanks in cities)
machine guns (best defender against contemporary gunpowder units, as well as getting a bonus against mounted units, aka the huge stack of cavalry the AI loves)
riflemen (if you don't use these, you are probably not doing your research path right)
special forces (use bombers to reduce city defender strength, send in choppers to kill the weakened enemy units, march in a special force guy to take the city - you can take tons of AI cities which are not within normal striking range, and therefore not sufficiently defended by AI)
troop carriers - pretty good units actually. aside from helping slow infantry keep up with your mechanized force, you can also airlift a full APC and essentially transport 3 units with 1 lift

now there are units that i've found to be useless / have never used:
mercenary infantry - pathetic strength for a unit that costs 50 gold a turn
light artillery - how come they can't attack without declaring war? guerillas are useless without arty support
dog units - too weak
humvee - too weak compared to contemporary units. maybe move it to an earlier spot on the tech tree?

 

[strategyonly]

zappara:

Since your PM is full i had to transfer it to here:

Just wondering if you changed the Cultural Citystyles with the NEW ones that are in the thread?

I changed them around including all i could find with the updated nif's, that other people made for the thread and i must say they look Great.

If you need what i have, i think i might have missed alittle bit, but not too much, if you do, just tell me what you need and i will put it in FileFront for a d/l.

If you already changed ALL of it, nevermind this PM/post.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Police: Spy defense and can be promoted to be a last ditch city defender. I am hoping for a Robocop Future Era upgrade.

This is an awesome idea!! Please make this so!

 

[strategyonly]

nevermind, looked at something different.

 

[zappara]

zappara:

Since your PM is full i had to transfer it to here:

Just wondering if you changed the Cultural Citystyles with the NEW ones that are in the thread?

I changed them around including all i could find with the updated nif's, that other people made for the thread and i must say they look Great.

If you need what i have, i think i might have missed alittle bit, but not too much, if you do, just tell me what you need and i will put it in FileFront for a d/l.

If you already changed ALL of it, nevermind this PM/post.

I haven't merged the new Cultural Citystyles mod since it's still on version 0.55 - maybe later when it's more closer to v1.0.

 

[strategyonly]

I haven't merged the new Cultural Citystyles mod since it's still on version 0.55 - maybe later when it's more closer to v1.0.

I have a brand NEW scrolling civics screen also, that has been worked on by quite a few GOOD python people and it really nice looking, it scrolls from the left side and not from the top like Johny's.