Unity Mod

I sent some invisible paratroopers to capture a City State. True, there is a floating capture message but the city won’t be captured.
Man, this is so stupid. On the one hand there are diplomatic introductions when invisible, and on the other hand you aren’t recognized as conqueror.

Well, there are two things I can do:
1.) Removing invisibility from certain land units
2.) Adding the "Unable to Capture Cities" ability

I wouldn’t mind if Scouts can’t capture cities. Anti-Aircraft or Anti-Tank units don't need either, but it’s very disappointing with Paratroopers.
Either I remove Invisibility from Paratrooper and let the Scout be spy forever, or I’m going to add "Unable to Capture Cities" to the Paratrooper.

What would you prefer?
 
Or you could make a special force unit on the basis of the paratrooper but with the invisibility option.

The paratrooper would be use as an airborne division (which you can hardly hide :) ) and the spec force to do the spying and the dirty job.
 
Yeah, there is a spy/saboteur-upgrade line missing. I also think the paratrooper is too valuable to disable the capturing.

I've lately thought about adding new units. I guess this is a good reason for one. It shouldn't be hard to clone the paratrooper.
Maybe I'm even able to create new pictures with Gimp. Let's see...I've never done that before.
 
Hello Mentos,

if you want to use it here the file that I am using for the special forces.

The text entries support english, french and german.

You may want to adjust it (as it is I made them a special unit, able to load on a nuclear sub).
It uses the paratrooper art with 3 soldiers in it.
 

Attachments

Thanks, I've just created my "Commando" successfully here. It only needs different pictures. There are a couple of other new-unit mods where I can peek how to do that.

Ah, I see. Special Units are those cargo types. This is pretty cool.

I'm sure the AI could never handle such land unit cargo types, but who cares as long as they aren't gamewinners.
This makes me want to create immediately a transport helicopter out of the gunship! :D
 
So many cool ideas, so little time to implement them all and squash bugs too... lol! Glad I could make your life easier :lol:

Definitely wouldn't want to make paratroops unable to capture cities... that is one of their coolest abilities. As long as there is an invisible 'scout/spy/special forces' unit of some kind at every stage of the game, with invisibility, I'll be happy.

And as for AA/Mobile SAM/Helos being able to melee-capture cities, that is just wrong, anyway. Removing that won't hurt anything.

The upgraded scouts that found advanced weaps in goody huts and ended up upgrading to riflemen and eventually mech infantry... heh, I always lost track of them anway. They looked just like all the other riflemen and mech infantry units, and I never wanted to bother clicking on all of them to figure out which one was the sneaker. So the idea of a different-looking unique paratroop special-forces unit, is great!

I would be disappointed though, if you removed the ability for scouts to upgrade to archers while retaining their invisibility (one upgrade only- nothing past that). That extra oomph allows them to actually fight against barbs as they explore the world, and they're quite survivable. And the extra gold they bring in from looting barb camps, is a huge help. Without that, scouts will once again be boring as hell, just a clump of lame hobbits trying not to get killed by every stray chipmunk they run into.
 
Yeah, man, sometimes you fool around and have no plan what else to do, and then suddenly come these tidal idea waves drowning you with work.

Yes, I understand this Scout upgrade desire. These are the major finder of the Ancient Ruins. I don't play with these lucky-factor ruins in my games, that's why I never really noticed such capture mess can happen.

Ah, scouts aren't so squishy anymore like in vanilla with the Survivalism ability. The Skirmish promotions are very powerful with higher attack value and the invaluable withdraw ability to avoid damage. After withdrawing, they usually become invisible again what is very useful. The invisibility helps a lot to let them do their job: exploration.
Look, getting rid of Barbs should rather be the job of your military units, and not any time-walking scouts who steamroll over everything.

However, I'll see if I can create more earlier, exclusive Scout upgrades which slowly develop better combat quality. Bringing more units into the game is no problem, rather the missing graphic to distinguish them.
 
Mentos,

Your Mod sounds great! Can I ask if it will work with Thal's Balance Combined Mod? Or is there one certain aspect of Thal's Combined that can't be used with yours? Thanks in advance.
 
Yes, I also use TBC.

Starting with upcoming v8, I try to make all changes considering using TBC and not. In other words, I sometimes delete possible TBC features before adding them again. In some cases, I do my own thing and overwrite a few TBC features. These are mainly only unit features.
I also support my Barbarians! mod which alone isn't compatible to TBC anymore. My Unit-Tweaks' changes affect both, the TBC v6.4+ new barbarian units and the standalone Barbarians! units.
I'm not sure how UT will work with other balance mods. I don't have time to test them all. :D
 
v8
- New Scout Units for each Era: Outrider, Harbinger, Skirmisher, Mounted Infantry, Scout Helicopter, and Commando
- Many Combat Modifier, Movement, Obsolete, and Upgrade changes
- All submarines Range reduced by 1
- Caravel and Destroyer "Extra Sight" reduced by 1
- Minuteman Cost reduced from 135 to 100
- Caravel can be build one tech tier earlier with Compass in Medieval era
- All invisible units received "Unable to Capture Cities" because of a capture bug
- Paratrooper "Is Invisible (Camouflage)" and "Can Enter Rival Territory" removed again
- Mobile SAM and Helicopter Gunship received "Is Invisible (Camouflage)" and "Is Invisible (Pop-up Tactics)" respectively
- "Scouting" promotion of Recon and Scout Helicopter units additionally gives "Detect Invisible Units"
- "Ignore Terrain Cost" includes Mountain passability
- "Charge" additionally gives +20% Attack versus Fortified Units
- All abilities and unique unit traits lost with upgrade
- Started to change some Civilization traits related to units
- See mod description for details
- Incompatible to v7- saved games


Download
 
Catapults 3 range? Seems a bit extreme, don't you think? I can see cannon and MAYBE even Trebuchet, but catapults? And doesn't having them at 3 range take the value out of having a city defense? They can just sit outside where the city can retaliate and blow it to bits, then have one lone warrior come in and mop up. Not so sure how this is going to work, but I'll give it a try. I would be interested in your rationale for moving catapults/trebs/cannon out to 3 range.
 
One thing I discovered last night after updating with your latest mod version, is that early barbs now outgun my starting warriors. With rather large bonuses to their damage, like *double attack*, it's quite tough just to take on a single barb- but when you stumble up on two of them at once exploring through the fog of war, or a second one spawns right next to you while you're taking on another one... you gotta run like hell and escape to heal up, and hope you can catch them apart when you're healthy enough to come back. It takes way more time to deal with the varmints than it did before, a lot more time wasted running away and healing.

The first time i encountered this, was when i came up on a single barb warrior in a fortified camp, and as soon as i moved up next to him and the fog cleared, I saw another one right next to him and also in a tile right next to me, but across a river between us. It was the end of my turn and i had no chance to attack or back off, so I thought "ok, one of them is across the river, so with the penalty for attacking me across the river, i should survive both of them unloading on me once before i can either hit back or run away"... so first I got hit by the one in the fort, and he dinged me pretty good, and then the one across the river attacked, and I was down to about 1/3 life left, and I'm thinking now I'll get a chance to run away, at least, and heal up... when BAM! The first barb runs out and gets a *SECOND* attack on me, killing my one and only warrior right near the start of the game. I didn't realize you'd given them superpowers, so when he ran out and did that, I about crapped my pants! :eek: :lol: So I got no defense, no exploration, and a new city with no worker yet, and I'm screwed.

I gotta say, i DO NOT like having barbs right off the bat that kill my warrior like he was a girl scout. It's hard (and tedious) enough taking on one barb with a noob warrior in civ5, and if you're playing without taking the Honor SP (which I usually don't unless I'm planning on launching right into Domination, which I usually am not), and especially if you're not lucky enough to get an advanced weapons upgrade right off, then your civ is more at risk of perishing to a couple of caveman barbs, than to any other civ. Some may like that excess challenge to their existence right off, but I can do without the extra headache.

This part of the mod changes is rather of an imbalance against starting civs, in my opinion. If you are starting out as a non-aggressive civ, you can't get by without being forced to buy or build extra warriors for protection against these super-barbs, where you didn't have to before.... stalling your progress quite a bit early on, when it is most critical. Please remove the double-attack feature from them at least, thanks. Or let ME have it as a 1st round upgrade, too! :D Too imbalanced to let players have as an upgrade? Yeah, I agree... and way too imbalanced for barbs ever to have, either!

(and i'm on normal barbarians setting, not crazy-spawning barbs)
 
I've played through a couple of hundred turns now and have found some of the barbs to be clearly OP. I'm speaking of the double attack op promotion of ranged units in particular, and especially naval units. It makes a player's Trireme totally useless. The only defensive counter is a catapult with range 3, and then only under certain circumstances.

While barb archers with this promotion are tough, the horseman is a modest counter, making it almost required now in the early game. Historically, I build very few mounted units in general, but this change makes them almost mandatory which is good I think.

I think the promotion on melee units though works well. Barbs are tougher with it but at least they take damage when they attack which can create counter attack ops.

Applying this range promotion to CS's also changes the balance of the game. This is especially true for the Mongol's. Nobody is going to be taking on any CS's in the early to mid game that is for sure which hurts the Mongol trait.

Finally, I notice it slows the early expansion of the AI civs which in some ways I think of as a good thing. Only time will tell if it has too powerful an effect.

I like making Barb's tougher, but I think I'd recommend using another promotion on ranged units.
 
GoUtes53, I could also ask where is the rationale of Archer with Range 2 (Longbowman even 3) compared to catapults?
The point of siege weapons is to bring them into position before a city to safely bombard it. I wish I could make better differences between ranged weapons/units but that would stretch the later/modern siege weapons into crazy ranges easily smashing everything out of normal sight range. I don’t know if this really fun.
The largest range of 4 has later the battleship and the missile cruiser with "Range" promotion. These units got the largest calibers what is plausible to me at least.


Smokeybear, glad you enjoy the new "beserker rush" of the barbarians. ;)
Since I’ve started to play with my Barbarians! Mod with more barbarian standard units and increased spawn numbers, I’m used to play defensively at beginning and always pick Honor first.


Okay, maybe I’ve exaggerated a bit. I’m currently thinking about an alternative how to buff them because I really want them to be a challenge. You know they can’t heal at all what is a quite harsh penalty.
I think I’m going to change their berserker ability to work like Charge with bonus versus wounded, move after attacking, and a -20% defense penalty.

City States and Barbarians share one leader, that's why both have Blitz at moment. I've once created an extra leader for barbarians, but I know one case where it caused a crash. I try again to seperate them.


PS: The new "Berserker" attribute instead of "Blitz" will be following: +40% Combat Strength VS Wounded Units. Can Move After Attacking. -20% Defense.

"Berserker" is a dumb stampede "Charge" variant without the fortify ignorance of one level. The Barbarians can easily defeat any weak or unprepared resistance if they come in superior numbers.
However, if you have full strength units, the Barbs will have no bonus. If you have wounded/healing units in fortify mode, the barbs will also get no bonus after 2 turns of fortification (+20% def per turn, 2 turns max). The -20% defense penalty makes them quite vulnerable, so you should have a bit less work conquering their camps in the end.
I think this is quite fair and balanced. Now I only need to seperate those City State units from the Barbarian ones...
 
In my game last night using v7, I had two catapults at 3 tiles away each over flat ground. They successfully bombarded my opponent's city for two turns each, then all of a sudden on the 3rd turn they could not reach him from 3 tiles away and I had to move them one tile closer and into harm's way. What would cause this?
 
No idea, maybe upload a saved game before and after this bug so I can take a look at it.


Well, it doesn't look good about seperating City State units from Barbarian. I don't know how to give only the Barbarians a (unit) trait and LUA scripting is not my world.
 
v9
- Honor Policy Barbarian Combat Bonus: +20 (25)
- Removed Barbarian/City State trait
- Incompatible to v8- saved games

Download

Edit: I'm going to leave the Barbarians without any trait. No fussiness with City States then. For more challenge, you can still play with my Barbarians! mod or TBC, but please not both due incompatibility.
 
v9
- Honor Policy Barbarian Combat Bonus: +20 (25)
- Removed Barbarian/City State trait
- Incompatible to v8- saved games

Download

Edit: I'm going to leave the Barbarians without any trait. No fussiness with City States then. For more challenge, you can still play with my Barbarians! mod or TBC, but please not both due incompatibility.

Thanks. If I want tough-as-nails barbs, and being *forced* to choose the honor tree every time (something I really don't like or want), I'll go get your other mod ;) As long as the double-attack thing on barbs is gone, I don't mind the other tweaks so much. Any time any of my warriors or scouts got near mulitple barb units, and one of them was an archer (a single archer is all it takes to slaughter a scout, even a fully leveled-up one, before they can get away), they had to run like screaming little girls. Same with triremes. Didn't add any fun to my game.
 
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