Great idea. Love it.
Upgrading units leads to loss of experience points :O
- Thread starter thomson_2001
- Start date
Great idea. Love it.
But it also means we're spending quite a pile of cash to have the most veteran of units on 10 XP, while the military specialist city is pumping out green units at 11xp and a free Medic I and that's before military instructors (+3 barracks, +2 stables, +4 WP, +2 theocracy, +
Red Cross). Add Vassalage with just 2 instructors gives 17XP plus Medic I. Not being a warmongerer I find it rare to go above 26XP without leaders, so upgrading almost invariably leaves me with poorer units than building anew.
Making units drop to their last promotion point, or being able to "retrain" them in cities would be OK, but as it is, it's just very tiresome and unrewarding.
weregamer
Gandhi of the Mongols
I don't know when this was introduced, but it is extremely draconian and makes experienced units extremely less valuable. If I had more time to do a python or SDK mod I'd change it to "half the experience points over 10" at least.
It particularly cripples a quality unit that is upgrading to a new type for which one promotion (which wasn't available to the older unit type) is valuable. It also penalizes players who follow the loading-screen tip and "save" promotions.
It particularly cripples a quality unit that is upgrading to a new type for which one promotion (which wasn't available to the older unit type) is valuable. It also penalizes players who follow the loading-screen tip and "save" promotions.
Pfeffersack
Deity
On the other hand this restrictive rule makes the use of a GG as Warlord valuable - otherwise the other options would be too strong compared.I self pay a lot attention to promoting units in the right moment and to give outdated ones "easy kills" to grab promotions in close range, so I don't see this as really problematic.The military science idea isn't bad, but 20 sounds a bit too much, if I think of the charismatic trait e.g. - I would suggest 17 at max, thats the 4th promotion for non-charismatic civs.
onedreamer
Dragon
But it also means we're spending quite a pile of cash to have the most veteran of units on 10 XP, while the military specialist city is pumping out green units at 11xp and a free Medic I and that's before military instructors (+3 barracks, +2 stables, +4 WP, +2 theocracy, +
Not being a warmongerer I find it rare to go above 26XP without leaders, so upgrading almost invariably leaves me with poorer units than building anew.
Making units drop to their last promotion point, or being able to "retrain" them in cities would be OK, but as it is, it's just very tiresome and unrewarding.
The situation you describe can only happen in one city and you can't even build the Heroic Epic there, and it does not regard ANY unit but only mounted... you are being a bit extreme don't you think ?
Any unit with 4 or more promotions (excluding free promos) is worth upgrading IMO. Even if they will never be promoted again, they are already powerful enough.
But it also means we're spending quite a pile of cash to have the most veteran of units on 10 XP, while the military specialist city is pumping out green units at 11xp and a free Medic I and that's before military instructors (+3 barracks, +2 stables, +4 WP, +2 theocracy, +
Not being a warmongerer I find it rare to go above 26XP without leaders, so upgrading almost invariably leaves me with poorer units than building anew.
Making units drop to their last promotion point, or being able to "retrain" them in cities would be OK, but as it is, it's just very tiresome and unrewarding.
One significant exception to this is macemen -> grenadier/riflemen upgrades. CR2 or CR3 grens are extremely powerful, and I frequently find myself building maces as I'm researching grenadier prereqs just to have more city raider units available after gunpowder units become all I can build from scratch.
For non-cav it's only 1 instructor difference.
I'd much rather take the WP + Red Cross combo for elite units, than combine either with heroic epic. Assuming you're not fighting everybody at once, it's not necessary. Well, if you are fighting everyone at once, you've probably got a spare GG for an academy, and more than a couple of instructors to boot.
In any case, I don't see the point in making veteran units essentially non-upgradable once upgraded, and the highest promotions essentially unobtainable.
Max Duke
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2020
- Messages
- 30
Incredibly after years of playing and countless hours I just discovered this feature! Civ4 is amazing!
Firstly I though it was a BTS thing, instead by your replies it's common to any release.
This news changes my gameplay now that I'm in the year 1694 AD with Isabel trying to keep Charlemagne top AI player who got a huge empire in Large Oasis map with 5 civs no barbs.
My army is based on War Elephants which now can be finally upgraded to Conquistadores, many have 4 promos, the war with Ragnar just ended with his defeat, punished for his umpteenth war declaration. Upgrading will involve also 4* Longbows, Axemen (still unupgraded in 1694), Macemen, Chariots, Horsemen, and four mythical Swordsmen which have been protagonists in all the city conquers. And about 14 Trebuchets with 4 promotions (coming out green with 10 or 12 exp thanx to Citadels).
I have to rethink all the upgrading now, I guess some will be put in reserve/ready to be promoted in case of necessity.
Now finally I can value the use of the GG as Leaders (I have 2 leaders now level 6), which otherwise I considered more valuable as instructors or military academy builders.
The upgrading depends also on your Gold, and I'm just came off a terrible infinite (being in marathon speed) lack of gold (huge empire on Large map with 5 civs).
For example I kept in reserve a Chariot level 5, which now costs 440 gold to become a Conquistador: would it be good to assign a GG to that unit? I would spare 440 gold.
Although now I have to rethink the gameplay ( it will be a new challenge the next game!) my strategy of non-upgrading (Swordsmen to Macemen, Chariots and Horsemen into Knights) has been the right one, besides I had no chance to do otherwise since my economy was struggling. It's been nice to conquer cities with Swordsmen and Chariots up to 1700 AD, after some Trebuchet attacks. But Charlemagne can now research Rifling and I guess the time of the sword is passing.
s.bernbaum
Mostly lurking
Don't forget that you do not lose any existing levels when you upgrade a unit. You just lose all existing promotion points beyond 10. So, your units with, for example, 5 promotions keep them. They just have a long way to go in order to accumualte enough points to get any more promotions.
6K Man
Bureaucrat
OK, first, holy necro, batman 
Second, you upgrade the unit after it has the promos you need, which is not ALL the promos. In BtS that's probably 26xp for Commando, at most. More often, it's a CR3 Treb or Mace being upgraded to Cannon/Grenadier. Sure, Combat 5 Commando City Raider 3 units are fun, but they're overkill. And siege does the heavy lifting, anyway.
Lastly, the problem with GGs as leaders is that even leaders die. For non-AW games, most people seem to go for the super medic (Woodsman 3/Combat 1/Medic 3) with their first GG, and settle the next few in the Heroic Epic city.
Always War games are different because you get tons of GG and having super units led by GGs allows you to compete with the hordes of AI units despite the production disadvantage the human is at.
Second, you upgrade the unit after it has the promos you need, which is not ALL the promos. In BtS that's probably 26xp for Commando, at most. More often, it's a CR3 Treb or Mace being upgraded to Cannon/Grenadier. Sure, Combat 5 Commando City Raider 3 units are fun, but they're overkill. And siege does the heavy lifting, anyway.
Lastly, the problem with GGs as leaders is that even leaders die. For non-AW games, most people seem to go for the super medic (Woodsman 3/Combat 1/Medic 3) with their first GG, and settle the next few in the Heroic Epic city.
Always War games are different because you get tons of GG and having super units led by GGs allows you to compete with the hordes of AI units despite the production disadvantage the human is at.
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