Vassal Weirdness

[Öjevind Lång]

In a recent game, Gandhi was attacked by Montezuma, and when things went badly for him, he asked to become my vassal. I obliged and beat up Montezuma. However, after that the game started to tell me that the inhabitants in some of my oldest cities (with massive culture and wide border lands against Gandhi) were "rightfully demanding to join India" and ask me if I wanted to hand them over. This can't be how it's meant to work.

Another strange thing was that when I captured Indian cities from Montezuma, I was not given the option to keep them or return them to Gandhi; they were automatically returned to Gandhi. That seems a bit buggy to me too. (One of them would have fit neatly into my empire.) On the other hand, when I wanted to give a captured *Aztec* city to Gandhi, the game wouldn't let me; the only options were to keep it myself or hand it back to Montezuma. It was useless to me, so I gave it back, but if I had known about this when I captured the city, I would have razed it.

Another weird thing (which, however, I did anticipate as a possibility) was that when I built privateers to harass Montezuma a bit in peacetime, Gandhi's frigates chased them down and killed them. I was aware that this might be happening, but I think it is wrong too. Surely a vassal should be able to see that the privateers sailing past belong to the boss.

 

[Evil Twin]

1) Bug. Turn off advisor popups.

2) Usually happens when your vassal's city has very recently been captured.

3) Realistically even your own navy should be hostile to Privateers, since there's no immediate giveaway as to who's side they're on.

 

[deanjack]

I was playing as the Maya and was the dominent force. I declared war against Egypt and took and destroyed several of his cities. We made peace with him as my vassal. I was playing a Europe map where he had the UK and ROI and i had France,Germany, Spain, Denmark and a lage portion of Europe. When we made peace a city with 100% Mayan culture and 6 Mayan tiles between the city and Egypt and had been my city forever (3000BC) and asked to switch.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

1) 3) Realistically even your own navy should be hostile to Privateers, since there's no immediate giveaway as to who's side they're on.

No, in real life, every privateer had a lettre de marque issued by a country. That was the difference between them and ordinary pirates. They simply hove to when told to by any ship belonging to the navy of their own country, showed the lettre de marque to the commander of the naval vessel and were let go. Of course, with ships from other navies it could be a very different matter. In principle, the lettre de marque was supposed to be respected by all nations (the privateers were *private* naval vessels engaging in warfare for private gain), but if a naval commander from another country was in a bad mood it could end very fatally for the crew of the privateer. And of course, privateers that preyed on both sides were regarded as common pirates and treated as such.

In game terms, I do think you should be able to send out privateers without fear that they'll get sunk by your own vassals.

 

[TheLastOne36]

YAh i have had a similar thing to. And Ghandi didn't even lose a city the entire game.

(except by a cultural conquest by me)

 

[Gaius Octavius]

Yeah, I think having your own vessels sinking your privateers would be too confusing, both historically and game-wise, as mentioned above.

 

[Carabodes]

In Islands map, one island had cities belonging to Mao and Huyana, Mao having one city, Huyana 3 cities. Huyana and I had been best of friends for centuries. I mingled in, established 2 cities on the island and thought this would prthaps ruin my relationship with Huyana - close borders and all that.

Huyana continued to be totally friendly however, but he vassalized and handed his 3 cities over to Washington (for the life of me I cannot understand the historical aspect of Inka giving anything up to USA, he should be giving it up to Spain).

A couple of turns later the weirdness begun. Huyana contacts me and asks me to slaughter his Washy vassal, seemingly oblivious to the fact that this would have ment me going to war against himself as well. Of course I declined, I had no intensions of entering into warfare against my best friend.

Then, a few more turns down the line, Washington broke free from Huyana. What went on in chambers between master and vassal I don't know, but they really hated each other. So, I went to war, seeing Washy's 3 cities would fit nicely into my empire.

Washington lived but 50 years, his 3 cities was really no match to my warpover produced in 4 different islands. The war ended and Washy totally dead, I discovered he really had no friends in the world, all the AI's loved me for my actions, and stayed friendly throughout the rest of the game.
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(og jeg vil ha igjen Jemtland og Herjedalen)

 

[Öjevind Lång]

(og jeg vil ha igjen Jemtland og Herjedalen)

Näggum du det får, norrbagge.

 

[Carabodes]

Näggum du det får, norrbagge.

Had to give it a try, I've always wanted those two counties back where they rightfully belong.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

Had to give it a try, I've always wanted those two counties back where they rightfully belong.

You forgot Bohuslän. That used to be Norwegian too. I meant to wave back, but I couldn't find the emoticon.

 

[TheLastOne36]

i always wanted to learn swedish or danish or something scandinavean...

 

[Carabodes]

You forgot Bohuslän. That used to be Norwegian too. I meant to wave back, but I couldn't find the emoticon.

You can keep Bohuslen, haven't appealed to me after having having my car crash down (blown waterpump) in the middel of a main street crossing (effectively blocking impatient trailerdrivers heading for Southern Europe) at 2 in the morning (night) on a Saturday, having to do a wakeupcall to a relative in Göteborg to come and get me, then return to Uddevalla early Saturday morning to hunt down a mechanic.

Ever tried to find a good mechanic in Uddevalla willing to work on a Saturday? And pressed for time, knowing that come monday morning you're supposed to be back at work in Oslo? And all the time having that stupid, but frightfully haunting/cathing tune of "vägen til Uddevalla" in your head?

No, keep it, Bohuslen for the swedes!!!

Jemtland and Herjedalen is different, though, that's norwegian by definition, and no 1905-treaty should have been able to say otherwise. The deep forests of my ancestors, they belong to me! (Very much the same attitude I adapt in Civ . if I've seen it, it's mine! ) And the so-called diplomats had no democratic right to sell out those two counties for the freedom of the rest of Norway! And after having obtained freedom from the swedish king, the same lame diplomats invited a dane to rule us.

Norway, the land of constant vassalge! Talk about vassal weirdness: As soon as we broke free from 400 years of slavelike conditions under danish rule, we made a constitution, decided it was very scary to be free, and went into union with Sweden, accepting the rule of the swedish king. Finding king Oscar too hard to like, we sold out 3 counties for our freedom and wanted a dane as a regent.

No, Norway as a republic, and Jemtland and Herjedalen back where they rightfully belong. In return, you can keep Bohuslen.
(Allthough some 30 odd years ago, they sold some awfully tasty spareribs at Västra Frölunda. )
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And the wavey emoticon you find by pressing more and taking your time searching in the lefthand row, about midway down the line. Now, next time you can back.

The simplest things you have to explain to a swede!
(look who's talking, I have swedish blood running through my veins on both sides of the family)
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Has it occured to you that allthough our discussion across the much disputed border might catch the interest of other swedes and norsemen, the rest of the world might be perfectly oblivious to what we are talking about
But somehow, it's very , though.

 

[Carabodes]

In a recent game, Gandhi was attacked by Montezuma, and when things went badly for him, he asked to become my vassal. I obliged and beat up Montezuma. However, after that the game started to tell me that the inhabitants in some of my oldest cities (with massive culture and wide border lands against Gandhi) were "rightfully demanding to join India" and ask me if I wanted to hand them over. This can't be how it's meant to work.

I have just tried it out. Normally I do not accept vassals, but my current game was rotten anyway, so I thought "Why not" when Mao wanted me as master.

And it started imidiately, city after city demanded to rightfully belong to China. After a while I noticed that this only happened in cities that still wasn't fully equippet in regards to espionage defence. And every time it happened, one of Mao's caravels was leaving the city. (Island map)

So I thought, I'll better try this out. At first I thought he must have used the function "spread culture", but that couldn't be. That's a very expensive form of espionage that costs over 10 000 EP's, and Mao only had around 8 000, whilst I had around 90 000.

Next option in line was "Support city revolt", an extremely cheap form of espionage, costs round about 200 EP. I tried it out on Gandhi (who was not my vassal, even though he wanted to be). Before I did, I checked his city. From close borders with me, and my culture being much stronger than his, he had saying "Down foreign influence".

After having placed my spy and ordered him to support city revolt (the city was not in revolt at that moment), his espionage caused the city to go into revolt for one turn. That made me think "This is nothing, has no apparent effect other than slowing down production for one turn".

A couple of turns later, I revisited the city. Gandhi now had saying "We yearn to belong to the mother land", as well as saying "Down foreign influence".

Apparently what that espionage function does, is placing a couple of your own nationality in the foreign city, and they act as homesick emigrants. So, if you have enough happy faces, all that the homesick people do, is express their longing for their mother country, thus the popups. If you're low in happy and high in angry, the result will be revolt and city flipping, as in my case happened.

I didn't get rid of the popups from Mao, all his homesick people still wanted to live in China. But since I was more advanced than Mao, and also bigger and more cutural, I had happy en masse, about 60 per city. I even had 3 "OH YEAH" in each city. The constant popups was a bit annoying, though, as many as 4 cities per turn wanted to belong to China.

So now we know how to obtein dominition. As early as possible, put your homesick emigrants in every foreign city on the map . If AI's really had emotions, they would indeed be irritated by the constant popups. And if you them with this for 4 milleniums, they just might give in to the demand, because apparently, once moved in, the homesick stay in the city forever.
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has made warfare almost redundant, AI can stay your friends and you at every opportunity. Plunder your food, steal your gold and your tech, poison water, make your inhabitants unhappy, effectively crippeling you. If that doesn't help, make the city change nationality. Why use ? And when you sell them something, they most probably pay you with your own gold!

 

[Bhruic]

In game terms, I do think you should be able to send out privateers without fear that they'll get sunk by your own vassals.

Except that there are some times where I actually want to hamper my vassal, so I'll use Privateers to do it. It would be unfair if they couldn't fight back.

Bh

 

[Angst]

i always wanted to learn swedish or danish or something scandinavean...

Vil du? Jeg kan da lære dig det hvis du har lyst bare sig til, jeg skal nok lære dig noget

 

[Quildavyr]

Vil du? Jeg kan da lære dig det hvis du har lyst bare sig til, jeg skal nok lære dig noget

Let me try to translate it
Want you?Everyone can learn.....

oh i cant!what you said?

 

[Angst]

Let me try to translate it
Want you?Everyone can learn.....

oh i cant!what you said?

Do you want that? I can teach you if you want just say the word, and I'd teach you something

I just love speaking Danish out here
Jeg elsker at tale dansk herude

I have so much fun now!!
Det her er skideskægt!!

 

[Quildavyr]

Damn i thought this "jeg" were "everyone" like in german "jeder".After this i cant understand anything more

 

[Angst]

Damn i thought this "jeg" were "everyone" like in german "jeder".After this i cant understand anything more

Resemblance: it sounds like Iai, which sounds like I somehow (You get it right?)

 

[Quildavyr]

Yep i got it.Thanks for your help