very helpful

[PtitCon]

This forum is amazing, extremely helpful.


I had a very hard time winning a game as monarch, I tried the Romans, the Greeks, the Germans, the Chinese and the indians without success, then I read that Hiawatha or Shaka would lead me more surely to success, and it helped a lot.
Then I learned that you shouldn't trust the AI to automate your dumbass workers, and I have to admit that I had a lot more fun playing when I was focusing on managing the workers (I used to automate most of them) in addition to the more effective cities and bigger populations.
Also the "Pope strategy" was a big help.

All the tips I got from this forum were essential in my leap from regent to monarch, and now I'm Hiawatha the wise!

So thank you for your posts.

I'm gonna go look for more

 

[HellboundHeathcliff]

What's the pope strategy?

 

[Frollo]

What's the pope strategy?

Culture assimilation by prayers, I guess

No, seriously, what is it?

 

[PtitCon]

I spent half an hour looking for the post where I read about this strategy, but I couldn't find it!

From what I remember, one guy was saying how he didn't waste any money on research, instead he bought from civs and sold to others, making money while getting lots of new techs.
He focused on making more settlers to expand and more combat/defense units to discourage his neighbours from attacking.
When one of the neighbors did attack, he bribed the others to fight the agressor off.

So basically, he had the other civs fight his batlles and do his research while he had all the money in the world. In a reply to this guy's original post, someone called his strat the Pope strat...

I tried it, and it worked. Won twice as monarch this way, one space race, one cultural victory as the Iroquois.
I'm gonna try one more game as monarch before the big leap to emperor, I read that's where it gets really difficult.

 

[Drakan]

The Pope strat or the Tech Broker strat are the same thing. Basically it boils down to being the leader techwise in the game. But instead of hoarding the newfound techs you sell them straight away, providing there are not linked to some Wonder you are interested on, unless you have a prebuild already. You sell it first to the richest AI civ for all the gpt they can possibly afford. Then you sell the tech to the second richest civ and repeat, you do this with all the civs within the same turn. In twenty turns more when the deal has expired they will again have cashflow availaible for newer deals. You trade again selling them new techs.

What you are doing is bleeding the AI cashflows. The techs are highly priced in this game. So you are de facto crippling the AI ability to research because it has to adjust its science slab decreasing it in order to pay you for the techs. So you end up being subsidized by all the AI civs of the game, get the chance to have some SGL's being the first to research many techs, in addition, which can rush wonders and eventually becoming filthy rich.

IMHO you can do this until Emperor level but not above because you'll be lagging behind in tech at demi or above. Even at Emperor you'll be behind in tech playing catch-up untill the beginning of the Middle Ages at least.
Anyways, here's a link to the War Academy and the classic Article written by Wislem on the matter:

http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3acad_crippleai.shtml

 

[Gainy]

Even at Emperor you'll be behind in tech playing catch-up untill the beginning of the Middle Ages at least.

Nah In my first civ game for a while (Emperor level), i've got a quite comfortable tech lead over the AI --- half way through the ancient age. It's like that for all of my (Emporer) games

You can't really make judgements like that, cause each player has their own abilities. It all depends on how you play the game...

Regarding the tech broker strategy: I don't like it. Because of the SGLs in C3C, yer really just kicking yourself in the teeth if you do that. You are letting the AI get them (them = SGLs)

 

[Longasc]

Consider playing DEMIGOD Gainy bo, thought I never was as much ahead as you, I found I can do it, too.

This is mainly due to Cracker, Bamspeedy's Article about Settler Factories, the philosopy-republic-slingshot by DaveMcW and the many Articles by Ision, the first one gave me the basics, he made me think about what I am actually doing. Hope at least one of the persons mentioned reads this.

The way to get a tech lead at Demigod: Expansionist, good starting position and lots of luck or a questionable save-load-attitude.

My last game lasted 45-46 hours and 6-7 months... right now I am playing the Arabs, Standard Map, may be that they prove to be less tedious than huge ones in the endgame.

SGL's are another benefit of the mentioned strategy. My favorite strategy is right now playing poker to be the first to get philosopy and Republic right after it.

 

[morchuflex]

The Pope strategy no longer works in C3C because the CPs simply don't get into gpt deals anymore, except on rare occasions.

 

[sabo]

This forum is amazing, extremely helpful.

Not only that but this forum also keeps me interested in Civ.. (anyone listening out there in atari land?? )

 

[HellboundHeathcliff]

The Pope strategy no longer works in C3C because the CPs simply don't get into gpt deals anymore, except on rare occasions.

It still works but is harder to get started. They run a deficit and take the loss of units much more than ptw or vanilla. The trick is to catch them in a GA or right after one of them sold a tech to another CP for gpt.

 

[smackster]

My last game lasted 45-46 hours and 6-7 months...

My last game lasted ~40 hours and 5 days, I need to get out more

 

[Drakan]

The Pope strategy no longer works in C3C because the CPs simply don't get into gpt deals anymore, except on rare occasions.[/QUOTE)

I'm still playing with C3C version 1.0 and the broker strat works just fine. Are you talking of version 1.15 or 1.22?

@Gainy Bo:"You can't really make judgements like that, cause each player has their own abilities. It all depends on how you play the game... "


I start that paragraph you quote with huge capital letters that say:IMHO. For that early tech lead you mention are you actually building the GL and still putting your research high? I never build it normally at Emperor but do so at Deity. Also, are you disabling goodie huts for the AI or else are you enabling them playing yourself with an expansionist or seafaring civ? Are you playing archipiélago maps? Do you avoid seafaring or expansionist AI opponents? Do you play small or tiny maps? And, naturally, no save-load attitude whatsover. In other words, no deck-stacking at all. All these can explain a tech lead from the Ancient Ages at Emperor.

If you play without building the GL or capturing it (at least before Education), in huge, pangaea maps, with goodie huts activated, 8 or more AI (random), your own civ also random at Emperor or above you really have to explain to me how you manage to be in the tech lead half way through the Ancient Ages onwards in every game of yours. You should be in tech parity with the AI's in any case, IMHO.

I can manage playing catchup and leading early on from the Middle Ages at Emp but not before that and certainly not leading at all at Deity. For the simple reason that the AI pops 10 goodie huts and are automatically awarded 7 or more techs ahead of you in the AA unless you have seafaring trait with suicide galleys or play with expansionist trait and build 3 or 4 explorers at the beginning to pop all goodie huts you can. All this INMHO, I'll add. Please prove me wrong and explain to me how you do it then playing with the conditions of the fourth paragraph. I know you are a good player because I've seen you in the HOF

@Gainy Bo:"Regarding the tech broker strategy: I don't like it. Because of the SGLs in C3C, yer really just kicking yourself in the teeth if you do that. You are letting the AI get them (them = SGLs)"

I don't understand what you mean Gainy bo . You are kicking yourself on the teeth if you follow the Sbing strat by letting the AI get all the SGL's? If you follow the Sbing it will be YOU who leads the tech pace, therefore any chance of SGL's appearing will always be on your side 'cause you are the one that first gets to that tech. So in fact you are negating any chance at all of the AI to have a SGL if you are leading the tech pace.

 

[Aggie]

This forum is amazing, extremely helpful.

This is certainly true. But be aware that you have to learn the skill to seperate bad tips from good tips. I really learned a lot playing Succession Games, discussing strategies with other players.

 

[Masquerouge]

The Pope strat or the Tech Broker strat are the same thing. Basically it boils down to being the leader techwise in the game. But instead of hoarding the newfound techs you sell them straight away, providing there are not linked to some Wonder you are interested on, unless you have a prebuild already.

I thought the Pope strategy was : you NEVER research anything. You set your science rate to zero. Thus you have quite a nice cashflow. And every turn you check for new techs, and you buy them. If you're lucky you can sell these techs to others AI. This means high diplomacy, and a lot of contacts, hence the "Pope" name.

IMHO it's really different from the Tech Broker strat. The Tech Broker strat requires you to have high research.
Both strats are the exact opposite : the Pope means high cash giving lots of techs, and the Tech Broker means new techs giving lots of cash.

 

[Drakan]

Woops, my mistake then, I stand corrected. I had read in quite a few threads they were the same. Sorry for that.

I got the idea they were the same thing from the War Academy, amongst other threads:

http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3acad_diplodeity.shtml

"About science trading:

you're gonna use the strategy of buying technology - please - PLEASE - sell it also! I could've had even easier game had I traded the technology both directions, not just buying it like a regular shopaholic. But stupid is as stupid does. More sophisticated people call trading science the "Science broker" strategy, "Pope strategy" or similar. I bet there are articles about them. I might call mine the "Switzerland" strategy"


I have never tried the Pope strat because it sounds inefficient. Does it work at Emperor or above?

 

[Gainy]

I don't understand what you mean Gainy bo . You are kicking yourself on the teeth if you follow the Sbing strat by letting the AI get all the SGL's? If you follow the Sbing it will be YOU who leads the tech pace, therefore any chance of SGL's appearing will always be on your side 'cause you are the one that first gets to that tech. So in fact you are negating any chance at all of the AI to have a SGL if you are leading the tech pace.

Initially, you said:

The Pope strat or the Tech Broker strat are the same thing

After reading PTitCon's explanation of the Pope strategy, I assumed it was the same as the tech broker one (cause of what you said)
If they were the same, you would be letting the AI get all the SGL's.

I start that paragraph you quote with huge capital letters that say:IMHO.

I appreciate what I said may have come across as arrogant, but I don't mind, as i'm right!

For that early tech lead you mention are you actually building the GL and still putting your research high?

I never build the GL, and you'd have to be a bit of an idiot not to set your research high (if trying to be the science leader)

Also, are you disabling goodie huts for the AI or else are you enabling them playing yourself with an expansionist or seafaring civ? Are you playing archipiélago maps?

I don't like barbarians. I don't play with barbarians. They're pointless, hence I turn them off. No barbs, no huts. In the game I was describing, I was playing as the Celts. So no seafaring or expanionist. I was also not playing on an archipegalo map, it was Pangaea.

Do you avoid seafaring or expansionist AI opponents? Do you play small or tiny maps?

I dont choose my opponents, they are all random. I always play standard sized maps.

And, naturally, no save-load attitude whatsover. In other words, no deck-stacking at all. All these can explain a tech lead from the Ancient Ages at Emperor

When I first got Civ (2001), I had a tendancy to save-load. I came to CfC in March 2003, and realised this was just plain wrong. I stopped. No idea what Deck-stacking is, and besides the "putting your research high" thing, I don't think any of those apply to me.

If you play without building the GL or capturing it (at least before Education), in huge, pangaea maps, with goodie huts activated, 8 or more AI (random), your own civ also random at Emperor or above you really have to explain to me how you manage to be in the tech lead half way through the Ancient Ages onwards in every game of yours. You should be in tech parity with the AI's in any case, IMHO.

Normally once I get to Chivalry, i'll stop researching completely, and just build up a huge army. Ideally, i'll then wait till the AI gets into the Industrial age, then capture tGL. That's not to say I can't keep up my tech lead, it's just it would be more beneficial for me to do it that way. I can't explain how I do it, I just do. I don't have any set method (that i'm aware of anyways) Before I came to CfC, I was playing (and winning) at Deity. All be it with reloading (not excessively). Hence, I can't really say abiding to any of the Strategy articles has helped me that much (although some of it is really good )
I'm sure there's plenty more people that can do it too.

I know you are a good player because I've seen you in the HOF

Cheers But my submissions to the HOF aren't really what i'd call good. Normally they're just simple Jag-rushes, and I only submit them so I can get my name up there

I may come across as arrogant, that's mainly because I am I don't mean to offend anyone, but y'all will just have to live with me

PS: There are loads of players who I know are better than me, don't get me wrong.

Edit:

Consider playing DEMIGOD Gainy bo, thought I never was as much ahead as you, I found I can do it, too.

I havent tried DemiGod yet, but I found that I had to concentrate too much when playing Deity -- if I wanted to do well. I noticed that Demigod AI get a free settler, hence it's not going to be muchos different from Deity.
I play only to see how high a score I can get/for fun, not for the challenge

 

[Drakan]

Yes, well half of my family are from Glasgow anyway so I do understand that attitude Gainy Bo. No problem