Warlord Difficulty Questions

[Yooka]

Hey all. I'm a pretty terrible player. Overall, my strategy for improving will eventually include posting up save files and screeners, to fully document my ineptitude in a particular context. But I haven't gotten around to working on that yet. I've just been trying to take some of the hints and guides that I've found here, and applied them to my playstyle. Hasn't really worked.

Someone suggested to play a few games at a low setting and work your way up to a difficulty you find challenging. Sadly, for me that is warlord. Chieftain is no challenge, and Warlord I seem to always have problems with. The funny thing is before I read so much here, I would win about 50% of my warlord games. Recently, I can't win any.

Anyway, what I've been having a problem with on these forums (in no small part due to the similarly named expansion pack) is finding advice for the warlord difficulty level, or common mistakes people make after moving up from chieftain. I realize I am waaaay below average for these forums, so I'm not expecting many to be able to offer me much help besides reading the guides I've probably already read. But if anything comes to mind under the heading "Things that no longer work on Warlord Diff"... please feel free.

Thanks. Oh, I play BTS... btw.

 

[DaveMcW]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=314007

 

[TheMeInTeam]

You have to protect yourself, that's about it. Rudimentary city specialization should blow the AI out of the water on warlord (well, up through monarch once you're USED to it).

A lot of people don't know this, but before my time on the forum I was a builder, including throughout civ II and III, because I only played them casually and here and there, not really trying to improve.

Around January 2008, I was doing well in a space race on warlord difficulty, I even had a defensive pact! Then I got invaded and lost. The seething anger was unbearable. The builder decayed and was burned away. That @#$@ing game as Roosevelt was the birth of "TMIT" - serial warmonger, diplo manipulator, and a proud executor of . If they're going to ruin my game, I'm going to do it back! Haha!

In other words, build enough military to protect yourself, and learn to manage diplo. That's all you really need on warlord, though the better you get at higher-level skills the more easy the transitions to higher levels comes.

 

[Jrrd Tzu]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=314007

I don't think this helps. This only suggests you and I are morons for not doing 2 things. It's overly simplified, so I wouldn't pay attention to this. TMIT is solid though

 

[Trystero]

Hey all. I'm a pretty terrible player. Overall, my strategy for improving will eventually include posting up save files and screeners, to fully document my ineptitude in a particular context. But I haven't gotten around to working on that yet. I've just been trying to take some of the hints and guides that I've found here, and applied them to my playstyle. Hasn't really worked.

Someone suggested to play a few games at a low setting and work your way up to a difficulty you find challenging. Sadly, for me that is warlord. Chieftain is no challenge, and Warlord I seem to always have problems with. The funny thing is before I read so much here, I would win about 50% of my warlord games. Recently, I can't win any.

Anyway, what I've been having a problem with on these forums (in no small part due to the similarly named expansion pack) is finding advice for the warlord difficulty level, or common mistakes people make after moving up from chieftain. I realize I am waaaay below average for these forums, so I'm not expecting many to be able to offer me much help besides reading the guides I've probably already read. But if anything comes to mind under the heading "Things that no longer work on Warlord Diff"... please feel free.

Thanks. Oh, I play BTS... btw.

Could you be more specific? Or maybe post a save from a game where you are having trouble? Are you losing because you are invaded by neighbors? Because you are falling behind in tech?

 

[Tempesta13]

Settle cities so they have at least 1 food resource.

Build more workers - try not to work unimproved tiles at all.

Don't build wonders early in the game if you don't really think you need them and you really need more workers/settlers.

Think a bit before you select a build - choose the building that will help the most. Only build something that will give you a decent benefit. Build forge/barracks/units instead if nothing else will help. Only your best commerce cities have to have a library/market etc...

Think a bit before selecting next tech to research. Pick the one that will help the most. Or you can pick one that you don't need the most, but know that you can trade it for 2 or more techs that you need after you get it.

Use Hereditary Rule or Representation to raise Happy Caps. Trade away extra health/happiness resources you have for whichever you need the most (happy or health). If you don't need any trade extras for gold per turn.

Use slavery in cities with low production but adequate food to get stuff built.

Put Herioc Epic in your best production city (unlocked after literature if you get a 10 xp unit)

Put Oxford university in your best science city (after education and you build the minimum # of universities).

When attacking cities use city raider promotions - attack with siege first to do collateral damage.

Early great people settle in your capital, or build an academy in your best research city. Bulbing techs like philosophy/education/printing press/chemistry etc... can help too. Golden ages are better later in the game so don't waste your first one too early. Trade missions with merchants help too. Send them to the biggest/furthest AI city.

There's a lot more, it's a pretty complicated game.

 

[Yooka]

Thanks all, I appreciate the attention.

Jrrd Tzu, I believe Dave, and the creator of the "Attacko" guides are being partly satirical (and very tongue in cheek) in their suggestions. While I don't doubt that those techniques are somewhat effective, they are far from universal - sort of taking the joke that duct tape fixes everything to humorous extremes (amnesia, the recession, particle physics, etc). I could be wrong, after all, there is no tone of voice on the internet.

TheMe.. I've read your guides, and while I know I'm not great at specialization, I hate to think I'm that bad at it. I can't rule it out though. I'll get some screeners and saved games prepped eventually, though my home PC needs alot of maintenance now, which is higher priority for a while.

Trystero, as earlier mentioned, the detailed stuff is coming, this was a more superficial/general question. But since you asked, I do realize that dipping down in military ranking is a quick way to get attacked. Balancing staying at the top of tech and in the top three of the arms race seems to be a huge balancing act that always topples over at some point. That, and tough spots diplomatically (though I do think I've improved in this alot). Not that it's an incredible tale, but in the game I'm playing now, I started Hinduism, Judism and just as I started Christianity, Charlemagne got all 6 other AIs to go Bhuddism within 5-10 turns. Even after I went Pagan/NoState, the warmongers had me in their sights.

But yeah, balancing economy v production, tech v military, and spreading too thin to early to nab resources are all ways I've identified as screwing myself over. That, and I can't help but automate some (but not all) workers, because after a few cities, they just get so darn tedious.

 

[Jrrd Tzu]

@ Yooka

I don't doubt it

 

[DaveMcW]

I am being totally serious.

These strategies are so important and so effective, they don't need other strategies cluttering the article.

 

[Trystero]

Trystero, as earlier mentioned, the detailed stuff is coming, this was a more superficial/general question. But since you asked, I do realize that dipping down in military ranking is a quick way to get attacked. Balancing staying at the top of tech and in the top three of the arms race seems to be a huge balancing act that always topples over at some point. That, and tough spots diplomatically (though I do think I've improved in this alot). Not that it's an incredible tale, but in the game I'm playing now, I started Hinduism, Judism and just as I started Christianity, Charlemagne got all 6 other AIs to go Bhuddism within 5-10 turns. Even after I went Pagan/NoState, the warmongers had me in their sights.

But yeah, balancing economy v production, tech v military, and spreading too thin to early to nab resources are all ways I've identified as screwing myself over. That, and I can't help but automate some (but not all) workers, because after a few cities, they just get so darn tedious.

No rush with posting a game, it just makes easier to see what's going on, and why you are having problems.

I have two suggestions: First, since you are having military problems, I would try a game using Julius Caesar or an Aggressive leader like Genghis Khan. JC in particular has very nice traits for quickly getting a dominating position at the lower difficulty levels. Rome also has one of the best Unique Units in the game. Learning to wage war will put you at a distinct advantage, since the human player is much better at this aspect of the game than the AI.

Second, at this stage avoid adopting a religion in the early game. If you want a religion, let the AI spread it to you. Having a different religion from the AI civs puts you at a -4 diplomatic penalty. Also, you would be better off teching worker techs or something that unlocks a military resource like bronze or iron, or a technology you can trade for religious techs.

I was playing at Warlord a few months ago, but I have recently moved up to Prince, I would be happy to offer any other suggestions, whenever you get around to posting a game. Good luck!

Edit: Also, I can't recommend highly enough reading through Sisiutil's ALC series and other games posted on the forums as a way to learn various strategies better players implement in the game.

 

[aapo]

Effective strategies in attack:

1. Attacker faces defender's best troop, so stacking different types of units is helpful.

2. Game tells how high probability your units have to win the battle. Pay attention to this and don't sacrifice your units if you don't have huge stack of them. Building Barracks/Stable, getting promotions (leader abilities give these too), attacks from forest/hill will all increase your possibilities. If probability to win against city is very low, you need war machines.

3. The more you battle, the better you (literally) become at it. Units gain promotions and occasionally you'll get great generals. Settle these in your military city for powerful troops right at the start.

4. You don't have to necessarily conquer everything straight away. Horseback units (with 2 moves) are great at pillaging enemy mines, farms, cottages and roads (which your troops can't use by the way). This will cause all manner to problems to enemy. He can't make strong troops without resources, disconnected cities face problems with lack of resources, research is slowed etc. Capturing their cities is really the last nail in coffin!

Don't play too large maps! I started at standard size with 6 civilizations and the game would take forever. Duels and 3-man games are great for practice.

 

[henrebotha]

Religion is an addiction. Shed it. Seriously, you're way better off leaving the AI to found them, for two reasons:

• One of the best reasons to found a religion is to build that religion's shrine and get +1 per turn for every city that has that religion. However, this requires (aside from controlling the holy city) that you spawn a Great Prophet, and use him to create the shrine.
• Spreading a religion requires quite a investment in Missionaries to actually get other civs to convert to it (and to get maximum return from your shrine).

Much, much easier to just spend the , , and building an unstoppable army and taking the shrined holy city of a widespread religion from the greedy AI bastard who built it. (You also then have the advantage of having A KICKASS ARMY with which you can perform further conquests, and one or more conquered cities that are already partly developed for you.)

2. Game tells how high probability your units have to win the battle. Pay attention to this and don't sacrifice your units if you don't have huge stack of them. Building Barracks/Stable, getting promotions (leader abilities give these too), attacks from forest/hill will all increase your possibilities. If probability to win against city is very low, you need war machines.

Attacking from a forest or a hill gives no attack bonus. It does, however, make your troops far more resilient to counter-attack.

4. You don't have to necessarily conquer everything straight away. Horseback units (with 2 moves) are great at pillaging enemy mines, farms, cottages and roads (which your troops can't use by the way). This will cause all manner to problems to enemy. He can't make strong troops without resources, disconnected cities face problems with lack of resources, research is slowed etc. Capturing their cities is really the last nail in coffin!

I have long wondered whether this is true, and it seems to come down to whether or not your enemy is trying to produce additional troops in the middle of the war (because producing troops is the only real way for him to work his way out of war, and harming his happiness, productive capabilities etc will keep him from producing troops). Obviously, if the bulk of your target's military production happens during the war, then pillaging his land is a great idea. However, in my experience (which only goes up to Prince, mind), the vast majority of troops get built before war - the most I've seen built during a war is one or two Longbows. In a case like this, not only are you not significantly hurting your enemy, but you're preventing yourself from making use of all the improvements he built for you once you capture the city.

 

[mi6agent]

To win Warlord on Standard map : Have 6 cities , cottage 5 of them .

 

[aapo]

I have long wondered whether this is true, and it seems to come down to whether or not your enemy is trying to produce additional troops in the middle of the war (because producing troops is the only real way for him to work his way out of war, and harming his happiness, productive capabilities etc will keep him from producing troops). Obviously, if the bulk of your target's military production happens during the war, then pillaging his land is a great idea. However, in my experience (which only goes up to Prince, mind), the vast majority of troops get built before war - the most I've seen built during a war is one or two Longbows. In a case like this, not only are you not significantly hurting your enemy, but you're preventing yourself from making use of all the improvements he built for you once you capture the city.

- I just had a 5-hour struggle with Justinian on tiny map and warlord difficulty. My grenadiers vs. his Cuirassiers. He had about twice as many cities as I did and sea of towns. I even built Statue Of Zeus, I had so many great generals that my troops started with 4th Strength promotion. It just seemed to be one endless stalemate, his score about 800 above mine. Perhaps I should've captured cities rather than trying to cripple his economy.

 

[mi6agent]

why play tiny . i think you only play tiny when you need a deity win badly

 

[Sian]

i go on a limb here, suggesting another thing many new players forget

are you using enough siege? ... are you using it proberly?

 

[Liszt]

great tips here.

Here's another good one...

Make your 2nd city a military production city. Just farms and mines, then pump out units. Non stop, unless you really need a building. (I often run an engineer to get an early Great Engineer to fast build a high cultrue wonder there, otherwise you might lose a culture war)

 

[henrebotha]

I prefer Chopin and Scriabin. The Transcendental Etudes hold no appeal for me.

 

[Liszt]

indeed - and Scriabine wrote fantastic sonatas too.

However, Liszt's best work is the annee de pelerinage. I played them in a concert once (quite badly though).


(edit, and Dudley Moore wrote the best sonatas. Here's me playing one of them http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhMi-3JVv-g )

 

[nanomage]

unfortunately, i am too bad myself at giving advice on warlord difficulty, but there was a thread here in the forums,
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=314428
and it's author (Yorgi) did an attempt to thoroughly describe the process of winning warlord.
the attempt failed though, and i think now the thread is abandoned, but it still contains some usefull information.
however, i think the best way for you is to start your own game at warlord or even a noble and ask for specific advice on what to do every 20-30-40 (normal) turns. I'll be sure, that with advice and explanations from the community, you will be able to beat AI's easily.