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well, that didn't work! (re: DoW)

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by ShakaKhan, Dec 21, 2016.

  1. ShakaKhan

    ShakaKhan King

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2015
    Messages:
    924
    I see that denouncing an opponent 5 turns before declaring war defines it as a formal war instead of a surprise war, which halves the warmonger penalty (or was it war-weariness? either way...) So I denounce my neighbor (Teddy), wait five turns, check the diplomacy screen and, sure enough, the option for formal war is there. Others opinions of him range from slightly sour to slightly good, he's no one's BFF. I then move my troops into position, Teddy complains about troops near the border, gives option to either move troops away or DoW, so I declare war. I'm guessing this is the wrong way to do it, and you need to declare war before moving your units there. Because after I declared, I took just one of his 3 cities, and not even the capital, and EVERYONE denounces me, including Sumeria who has already eliminated an entire civ.

    Also, again I'm unsure if it was warmonger or war weariness penalty, but either way they are both way too steep in the game. I was only in the classical era, and I understand the penalties become more severe with era, and this very first level is completely unacceptable in both cases. For warmonger, I take one city and diplomacy is effectively out the window with everyone. And the war weariness, I was losing three amenities in the size 8 capital after just 15 tuns. I'm glad they fixed the civ5 problem where the optimum strategy is to have a very small empire and a large, sprawling empire can't compete with a 4 city empire, which makes no logical sense. But in order to make a large empire you need real estate and war is the way to do it. These penalties are way too harsh.

    I'm sure I'll get some helpful advice here, and I'm sure I'll master it like I did in civ5, where I was able to be the menace of the world but still tricked everyone into loving for it, because I completed the "diplomacy checklist" of getting all the positive modifiers to counter the negative ones... but I don't want to because that is the very reason why I stopped playing civ5... it became very formulaic play and make the game unenjoyable. I'm hoping there is or soon will be a mod that just removes war weariness from the game, and makes warmonger penalty more acceptable.
     
  2. AlazkanAssassin

    AlazkanAssassin Engineer

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    Maryland
    Yeah, the declare war button in the negotiation about troops near the border is always a "surprise war", regardless of your available diplomatic excuses.
     
  3. weregamer

    weregamer Gandhi of the Mongols

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2006
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    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    All you need to do is "ignore this" when he complains, then declare the non-surprise war on your turn.

    You are always declaring a surprise war if you do it in that leader dialog, or if you do it by just attacking and saying "yeah, I wanna attack and declare war".
     
  4. Chibisuke

    Chibisuke Warlord

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2016
    Messages:
    268
    Yea this whole thing where they ask if you are trying to go to war is an utterly stupid mechanic. If you say yes in that dialogue, it will always give you the worst possible warmonger penalty. So, there is never a reason to do that. Also, if you don't intend to go to war but are just keeping your troops there for deterrent purposes, they will still denounce you if you don't move the troops away whether you say you aren't going to war or not. So the only real option is to ignore them. Thus there is no point to the mechanic and it's just a waste of your time having to see their ugly mug pop up and listen to their speech.
     
  5. ShakaKhan

    ShakaKhan King

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    Helpful, thank you.
     
  6. greygamer

    greygamer Feudal Lord

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    Just be prepared for him to denounce you for the remainder of the game because you refused to make a promise to him
     
  7. Forster

    Forster Prince

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    That's if he is still around.
     
  8. greygamer

    greygamer Feudal Lord

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    In which case be prepared to be denounced by everybody else for the rest of the game. Being denounced is just a by-product of going for domination or securing enough space.
     
  9. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Messages:
    11,503
    The crippler for war wearyness is loosing units. This you need to avoid.
    The penalties for warmonger are very harsh, and razing cities harsher still. If you want to be menace of the world, in civ 6 currently there is 0 opportunity to make others love you.
     

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