What happened to Stalin?

[Instant_Cereal]

Why Catherine and not Stalin? Hmmm, well there are probably many reasons why. I believe one reason would be gender; they wanted more female leaders in the game. There was Peter, Lenin, Stalin, and Ivan, all of which were male, but what other famous female leaders has Russia had other than Catherine?

 

[RockStar-holic]

Naw, forget about Stalin. Gorbachev is the man. Whenever you meet him for diplomacy his "birthmark" alters to reflect the shape of his nation at the time; beware when it grows to cover his entire face.

 

[michael4000]

Wasn't Stalin actually Georgian? If I remember that little detail right (it's been a looong time since high school Global Studies, friends), it's a fine reason for him not to be a leader of the Russian Civ: he wasn't Russian.

They probably left out Stalin and Lenin to skirt the whole question of how Russian the Soviet Union was. (A: It was pretty Russian, but it wasn't really "Russian.")

 

[TripleGemini]

Wasn't Stalin actually Georgian? If I remember that little detail right (it's been a looong time since high school Global Studies, friends), it's a fine reason for him not to be a leader of the Russian Civ: he wasn't Russian.

Stalin was Georgian.

Perhaps what we need is a Soviet Union mod... Complete with both Stalin & Lenin or whomever one wants to have there (Khrushchev?)

 

[MattJek]

Wasn't Stalin actually Georgian? If I remember that little detail right (it's been a looong time since high school Global Studies, friends), it's a fine reason for him not to be a leader of the Russian Civ: he wasn't Russian.

They probably left out Stalin and Lenin to skirt the whole question of how Russian the Soviet Union was. (A: It was pretty Russian, but it wasn't really "Russian.")

Yeah, but he was a Russian Leader.... one of the most well known and imfluencial ones at that!

 

[Koheleth]

Wasn't Stalin actually Georgian? If I remember that little detail right (it's been a looong time since high school Global Studies, friends), it's a fine reason for him not to be a leader of the Russian Civ: he wasn't Russian.

They probably left out Stalin and Lenin to skirt the whole question of how Russian the Soviet Union was. (A: It was pretty Russian, but it wasn't really "Russian.")

Saladin wasn't Arab, he was a Kurd, and didn't really even lead an Arabian nation. Stalin at least led Russia. That being said, he's far too modern and evil to be in any game. There are still people alive today who were tortured by him or who had their families killed by him. It's the same reason why the Arab UU is the Camel Archer and not the suicide bomber.

 

[GeneralMikeIII]

Saladin wasn't Arab, he was a Kurd, and didn't really even lead an Arabian nation. Stalin at least led Russia. That being said, he's far too modern and evil to be in any game. There are still people alive today who were tortured by him or who had their families killed by him. It's the same reason why the Arab UU is the Camel Archer and not the suicide bomber.

Firstly, I agree that actually having lead a nation is reason enough to consider a person as a posibility when deciding who the leaders should be in the game.

Secondly, I don't think being evil is a reason to keep a leader out of the game. "If we ignore the past, we are destined to make the same mistakes"-or something to that effect. However, I would accept the reasoning that he was too controversial to be put in the game, since the main reason for making Civ IV was probably to make money, not to provide a completely accurate recreation of human history. There are no male leaders of the English, for example. I would be interested in seeing if having a contriversial leader would make people not buy the game. As soon as I figure out how to open a thread and put a poll in it I have an idea for a little experiment...

Thirdly, you may want to watch your presentation a little more. In one sentence, you say Stalin is too modern to be in the game, then 2 sentences later you imply that suicide bombers should be the UU for the Arabs, unless you ment to say "THEY are the same reasonS why...".

 

[Underseer]

Being evil is definitely not a reason to keep people out of the game, particularly since there are evil leaders already in the game.

Ghengis Khan didn't just slaughter his way across Asia, Europe and the Middle East, he is history's most prolific serial rapist. Approximately 0.5% of the world's total population (or around 8% of a large part of Asia) are direct male descendents of Ghengis Khan. There's no telling how many total descendents he has living today.

 

[csrjjsmp]

Being Georgian should not be a problem, other leaders (Alexander, Napoleon) weren't really born in the countries they lead. They also have leaders such as Mao and Ghandi who are just as modern (and in the case of Mao, just as easy to see as evil) as Stalin. I think he is a much more recognizable leader than the ones they currently have. when I think Russia, I definitely think of Ivan the Terrible and Stalin before Catherine.

 

[henrycccc]

I think Stalin should be put in the game along with Hitler, and any other politically incorrect leader. The truth is these leaders had an affect on their countries histories more than any other. If Stalin and Hitler never existed, what would the world be like?

 

[csrjjsmp]

That's not the point, though. Frederick Barbarossa would make a better second German leader than Hitler would. Adding people undeservedly is just as bad as leaving people out.

 

[Koheleth]

. There are no male leaders of the English, for example. I would be interested in seeing if having a contriversial leader would make people not buy the game. As soon as I figure out how to open a thread and put a poll in it I have an idea for a little experiment...

Having Victoria as a leader is plain stupid. Easily the stupidest choice in the game as she was just a figurehead (although having Saladin as an "Arab" is almost equally stupid). The 2nd English leader should have been Churchill or Disraeli.

As for controversial leaders, the game does have Mao, who was an evil tyrant . . but not quite as evil as Stalin.

 

[Koheleth]

I think Stalin should be put in the game along with Hitler, and any other politically incorrect leader. The truth is these leaders had an affect on their countries histories more than any other. If Stalin and Hitler never existed, what would the world be like?

If you want anti-political correctness, how about Bin Ladin as leader of the Arabs (UU suicide bomber), the Kamizake pilot as Japan's UU, the white flag as the UU of the Vichy French civilization, the Inquisition National Wonder etc.

It would be politically incorrect, but it wouldn't necessarily be fun, and a lot of people just wouldn't buy the game.