When does AI declare war?

[d_profesor]

Just short question, When does AI declare war? does it relate to their attitude (annoyed, cautious,etc)?

I've read "AI attitude by Baamspeedy". It said that if we have power lead then we get +20 point, if we don't have power lead we get +40 point. Both possibilities is bad. can i conclude that i have to stay on "average military army from them?

I found sometimes, some civ, like Hitities, Sumeria did sneak attack but others didnt do it. I played Rome. Why did it happen? is there any exact calculation for AI Declare war? (of course they were strong than me )

Thanks,

 

[Nergal]

There is an exact calculation but its hidden in the game engine. The only way to avoid war 100% is use Always Peace lol. Apart from that its affected by a zillion factors. The Zulus and Germans are pretty much always up for a war, other civs seem to have various warlike moods depending on the Age. The factors that seem to affect are IMHO :-
Close borders, ie in cultural competition.
If you have a resource and they dont.
If they are trying to expand and you are in the way.
Running settlers or troops through their territory.
Being weak and under-developed.
General attitude, ie annoyed or furious are way more likely to attack than Cautious. Cautious appears to indicate their troop strength is weaker than yours by a small margin.

In general the best way to avoid war is build plenty of troops, guard your borders and (seriously) kill everybody.

 

[MAS]

It is a combination of free land for expansion available, attitude, difference in military strength, aggression level, and a random element.

The most important factor is probably military strength.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

If the AI gets something from you on per turn basis (esp.for free) it is extremely unlikely that you will be attacked. In my diplo games for the HoF I have given away luxuries, resources and gpt and I cannot remember a single instance of being sneak attacked.

A clever thing to do is IMO to make a small gpt donation before you sell a tech to the AI for all the gpt they have. That way the gift costs you absolutely nothing.


OK, so much for "When does the AI NOT declare war?" Back to the scheduled topic.

Oh, and when you play enough games you will probably be sneaked by any of the civs. I don't think some of them are more likely to do it than others, at least not much.

 

[Sweetchuck]

I usually trick the AI into declaring war at times when they try to pass a ship through my coastal waters.

Enough turns of "move your units or declare war" usually results in a DOW by the AI.

Once, and only once have I ever had the AI just straight-up declare war on me without contact.

 

[NickyH]

One detail concerning this:

I don't know if you have the same expression in English as we have in Swedish. It translates into something like "The opportunity makes the thief." Whenever you have a city with really weak defenses, attacking it seems irresistible to the AI.

A question about who's weak and who's not: Will the AI simply judge strength based only on the number of troop, and which troop is the most advanced? (Like when the advisor says a Civ has cavalry for example.) When the advisor says their troops outnumber ours (or the other way around) it seems that even harmless troops like warriors count, but do Enemy AI have a more detailed knowledge of our troops?

An example was when I had recently got Modern Armor, and the Germans had no tanks of any kind. My military advisor said that "compared to the them, our military is weak." I attacked and conquered Germany in the only war (so far) that I would call easy and painless.

 

[d_profesor]

I aggree with Negal for:
If you have a resource and they dont.
If they are trying to expand and you are in the way

For Mas, The main factor is military strength, i know that but I found the same thing with NickyH. I don't understand with military advisor suggestion to build Archer (2/1/1) instead Legionary (3/3/1). this fact indicate that AI give more respect to archer. I know archer is attacking unit, but legionary? Is it defending unit? and how to calculate the number and composition of unit (attacking defending, artilery) so that AI know i still have power.

Lord Emsworth, in my game AIs do not interest for gpt trade in the Ancient Era. Is it normal? In the next eras, i trade for gpt with some of them (maximum, 3 of them). Others likely have became poor. cant afford for a tech.I always play with huge map, 15 civ, archipelago 70 % water.

Btw.. i feel that AI was made in a different character. Some tend to be sneaky, tricky,.. etc. and the other tend to be gentle, fair. When i played as Rome, now still playing Rome, I found that Xerses , Abu Bakar, Summeria, Cleopatra are "sneak" leader. Carefull with them. Civ, like Greece, Byzantine, America, Netherland, England look like has more fair and intellegence leader. For example, First group always ask for demand tribute for many times than the second group. of course in the early game i have to pay for them. i dont know this is true but i feel like that way. oh yes, and i think the AI have different ability and war strategy. Is it true?

Thanks

 

[ThinkTank]

The article Study of Inner Workings of Military Advisor in the War academy explains how the military advisor judges army strength. Part of it is that it adds up the strengths of all your units using a particular formula that is explained in the article:

The formulae used by the mil advisor are:

Units Strength player 1) = Hitpoints * (1.5* AttackPoints + 1 * DefensePoints + 0.175* Bombard Points)

Army Strength (player 1) = Sigma(1-n) Unit Strength (player 1)
ArmyStrenght(player 1) > (1.2) * ArmyStrength (player2) : Player 1 is rated strong
ArmyStrength (player 1) < (0.8)* ArmyStrength (player2) : Player 1 is rated weak
In between armies are rated average.

For example, an army of 30 warriors will be judged stronger than an army consisting of 1 modern armor. This is one of the weak points of the formula. Another one is that it disregards movement point of units; as well as retreat for mounted units. So a horseman (2.1.2) and an archer (2.1.1) are judged equally strong.

As a rule of thumb, build veteran units, and prefer high attack over high defense. This way your army will be judged strong. There are also other reasons why these units are good:

That the military advisor would advise to build an archer (2.1.1) instead of a legion (3.3.1) is probably governed by another mechanism.

 

[Nergal]

I think the advice on which unit to build is time related as well. I noticed in one of my games that an empty city wanted to build a warrior rather than a spearman. The only reason is the shield cost/time. The Advisors seem to look at immediate solutions rather than long term plans.
There is an article on AI Attitude ( http://www.civfanatics.com/civ3/strategy/ai_attitude.php ) by Bamspeedy. Its based on all sorts of factors but cultural grouping plays a part. I know individual civs have preferences towards certain actions, based on traits and a couple of other factors, you can see how it works in the editor. A lot depends on the current situation in a game.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

Lord Emsworth, in my game AIs do not interest for gpt trade in the Ancient Era. Is it normal? In the next eras, i trade for gpt with some of them (maximum, 3 of them). Others likely have became poor. cant afford for a tech.I always play with huge map, 15 civ, archipelago 70 % water.

Btw.. i feel that AI was made in a different character. Some tend to be sneaky, tricky,.. etc. and the other tend to be gentle, fair. When i played as Rome, now still playing Rome, I found that Xerses , Abu Bakar, Summeria, Cleopatra are "sneak" leader. Carefull with them. Civ, like Greece, Byzantine, America, Netherland, England look like has more fair and intellegence leader. For example, First group always ask for demand tribute for many times than the second group. of course in the early game i have to pay for them. i dont know this is true but i feel like that way. oh yes, and i think the AI have different ability and war strategy. Is it true?

Thanks

It is fairly normal that before the beginning of the Middle Ages (from the AI perspective) gpt deals are not to be had. This simply has something to do with their economic situation and is neither inherent in government nor age. (But don't hold your breath for a despotic civ shelling out gpt that you haven't given them to begin with.)

And I have probably been wrong about there being no difference in the civs wrt sneak attacks. There may be some, but it is not too much. When it comes to asking for tribute (or else) there is a difference which is IIRC linked to the aggression level of the civ. Civs like Germany and Persia have a very high aggression while France or India are rather tame.

Strategy wise all the AI function the same. They may feel different though because in some cases the UU makes them behave different from the norm. For example, if a civ in the AA has both iron and horses they will build swordsmen because they figure that 3/2/1 is better than 2/1/2. In the case of the Iroquois however even the rather dumb AI realized that the Mounted Warrior is a fantastic unit. Or take the Japanese who tend to use their knight replacement, the Samurai, as defenders (even in core cities.)

 

[rysingsun]

seems to me that they are more likely to declare war if you have a unit in their territory. interestingly they are also more likely to want to trade with you if you have a unit in their territory. i guess your presence just reminds them of your existence.

they are far less likely to declare war if you have rop with them, so much so that if you want to play a militariy-less game the way to do it is with lots of rops. rops with everyone at all times is one of my favorite exploits

if you have a much stronger military than they have then even if they do declare war they may refuse to leave their territory.

everyone says that settling right up next to their culture border and even grabbing a resourse this way aggravates them into declaring war. i disagree as i do this all the time. then again, i do it all time with civs that i have rop with

they don't declare much when there is lots of land still to be settled.

they seem to declare more if they are paying unit support.

they declare more if their attitude toward you is "furious", by whatever means it got that way.

 

[NickyH]

Many interesting points, rysingsun!

You say "i guess your presence just reminds them of your existence." I have no idea if thats true, but I'd love to hear other peoples opinion on that! It reminds me of Caesar, another of my favorite games. In that game, Mr. Caesar himself is likely to forget about you, if you don't remind him of your existence.

 

[Nergal]

Its even worse if you go to war, give them a whupping and then declare peace. That generally makes them furious, plus if it makes you leader on the scoreboard that annoys other civs. You can end up in a state where half the civs are furious, the rest are annoyed, or dead. Nobody will trade with you, and nobody will declare war because you are too strong. Occasionally one of the civs (usually furious) comes begging for luxuries through gritted teeth, which can alter their attitude a lot. Around this time one of the civs will build the UN and you get a diplomatic trouncing ...

 

[I. Larkin]

My impession also that if AI have reach the point that they can't support their military anymore they declare war no matter what...

 

[civverguy]

I found that if the AI wants to declare war on you, they move a couple units in your borders and declare war on you the next turn.

 

[JDAllison]

"Whenever they want"

Seriously, though, I've been declared on when I was smaller than they, when my economy was not so good, when I needed help against someone else, when a HUGE barb stack is approaching, when I grabbed the only iron or gunpower on the continent, or when I didn't give tribute to an aggressive civ that's about my size or larger.

Of course, it makes me happy when they do (usually), because it allows me to wipe them off the earth without me having to do the declaring. Helps some with the feelings of other civs, especially when I'm trying to get something I want from them.

 

[d_profesor]

seems to me that they are more likely to declare war if you have a unit in their territory. interestingly they are also more likely to want to trade with you if you have a unit in their territory. i guess your presence just reminds them of your existence.

.

I think this is true when they have a weak military, i dont have idea about the truth of it , i'll try.

My impession also that if AI have reach the point that they can't support their military anymore they declare war no matter what...

yeah, it look like happen a lot in every game i played, this thing often trigered the early war for me.and the worst, i'm not prepare yet. Cozz i concentrated to expand or bulid an early great wonder and I left my military became weak..

 

[eldar]

Usually whenever they feel the need to just give up on this life and move on to the next one...

(The sneaky ones will have a city on a one-tile island. If they happen to be Vikings as well, they'll openly laugh in your face about it.)

 

[d_profesor]

Mean that.. there's no exact number here.. They declare war whenever they want and could be in any different condition..

I just wanna figure out the possibilities to build some improvement (maybe GW), expand without any interupted from AI in the early game. I think, knowing the minimal condition so that AI not declare war or ask for tribute (ask for tech)could be helping me for that purpose. I mean,Maybe one of the ideas is build unit just in the right time..when it is a must.. I need to know when i must create unit, how many then ? of course, not for attacking.

 

[eldar]

Yesterday they (being the Germans, who'd already killed the Romans in 2900BC ) declared war when I'd just gone into anarchy Yeah so attacking a Hoplite fortified on a hill with an Archer wasn't the cleverest opening move, but it did give me 4 turns of anarchic golden age