Which buildings should and shouldn't be built in a Great Scientist city?

[rfcfanatic]

In post-Liberalism game, I guess it doesn't really matter, but in early game, getting "wrong" Great Persons can really be hurtful when running towards Liberalism. I usually make my capital as the Great Scientist city. Unless doing some really heavy micromanagement, the game will always assign merchants and spies as soon as I complete Market and Courthouse.

Which buildings are allowed to be built in cities where I'm trying to get Great Scientists? I guess that National Epic, Oxford University, Observatory and University are pretty obvious for such cities, but are there any more buildings that are recommended? Should wonders other than Great Library ever be built in science cities?

 

[guspasho]

The answer is probably "it depends". I'd also build a granary and lighthouse for growth and a forge for production and happiness, and other happy-producing buildings as necessary, because you're probably going to hit your happy cap early in the game with any food-rich city. I wouldn't worry about a courthouse unless your maintenance is high. I'd love some additional input on this myself.

Also, you should always be micromanaging your specialists in a GP farm. Oh and don't forget to build an academy with your first GS.

 

[Izuul]

It's generally not a good idea to farm GP in your cap. Exceptions could be the first GS early in the game to build an Academy, or a quick Caste + Pacifism starve for a GS on the way to Lib or GM to quickly upgrade units. Ideally, you want to be running Bureau with a high commerce cap, and those citizens should be working cottages (or production tiles), not consuming food as specialists. The cap is where your money comes from.

For a GP farm though? Granary + LH (if seafood) + NE, + science buildings. Theatre and other happiness buildings if necessary.

Post-Lib GP diversity is good though so you can start GAs. You can't do that if you get nothing but GS.

 

[shakabrade]

You don't need special buildings for GSs.

You can generate 1 or 2 GSs from Libraries by 1AD and can run Pacifism + Caste System GAge and starve your cities to get 3-4 GSs in that period, depending on your food in cities and traits (PHI helps, National Epic too ). That is more than enough to win you Liberalism. And it is almost risk free since your GP pool is clean. It was done many times on this forum. Very common on higher levels.

Edit: xpost with Izuul. Yeah, didn't refresh for 5 hours...

 

[VoiceOfUnreason]

In post-Liberalism game, I guess it doesn't really matter, but in early game, getting "wrong" Great Persons can really be hurtful when running towards Liberalism. I usually make my capital as the Great Scientist city. Unless doing some really heavy micromanagement, the game will always assign merchants and spies as soon as I complete Market and Courthouse.

Which buildings are allowed to be built in cities where I'm trying to get Great Scientists? I guess that National Epic, Oxford University, Observatory and University are pretty obvious for such cities, but are there any more buildings that are recommended? Should wonders other than Great Library ever be built in science cities?

So first of all, it looks like you are confusing two different ideas.

As a general rule, Oxford wants to be in your best city for research; in other words, the one producing the most beakers per turn. In games where Oxford matters, that will often be your capital, with Big Commerce + Bureaucracy multiplier + Academy and other research multipliers therefore Big Beakers.

The city with Oxford is where you will normally end up settling Great Scientists, in strategies that call for that play.

As a rule, that won't be the city where you are raising scientists, because the Bureaucracy multipliers don't apply.

In a city that's dedicated to farming scientists, you'll want to be working tiles for surplus food, and hiring as many scientists as you can. So you'd really like Granary + Library + National Epic + Caste System. If you don't object to polluting the pool with Engineers, you might sneak a forge in there as well.

 

[shulgi]

I didn't know bureaucracy multipliers didn't apply to scientist specialists, thanks!

 

[Mantic0re]

It is also important to note that Oxford is very expensive and generally not worth the investment.


The hammers spent on Oxford +6 Universities can build enough military units to make a big difference in the timing and outcome of war efforts.


If you expect to see tanks, nukes or the Apollo Program then it is probably worth the time and hammers. You can wrap the game up with Cavalry+Flight or Cannon+Rifles without Oxford.

Disclaimer: Monarch Normal Speed Player. Oxford doesn't get any cheaper at higher levels, but it may be harder to keep a military tech advantage without the boost in beaker %.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

Disclaimer: Monarch Normal Speed Player. Oxford doesn't get any cheaper at higher levels, but it may be harder to keep a military tech advantage without the boost in beaker %.

Yea yea, this sounds like my level of play too. This must be the "new" line of thinking, I really haven't heard outspoken critiques of Oxford until recently.

Monarch is such a middle of the road difficulty, it's hard to say whether avoiding Oxford will optimize your game more than any other choice. Indeed, "it depends."

To at least add something to the discourse, I will offer that Stone makes life easier.

 

[lindsay40k]

The hammers spent on Oxford +6 Universities can build enough military units to make a big difference in the timing and outcome of war efforts.

Alternatively, there can be things to be said for running a zero or low research economy whilst getting these buildings online. Split the money between upgrading units and deficit research after Oxford.

As for what I'll build in a GS farm... well, since it'll produce a fair number of raw beakers, Monasteries can be cool. They'll obsolete, but there's no harm in gaining +50% pre-SM, and being able to pop out Missionaries afterwards. (Some people regard them as a waste of hammers, but being able to get a veto in the AP can be priceless.)

A GP farm wants population, so a Courthouse might be an idea. Likewise happiness & health buildings.

 

[iggymnrr]

A granary. If running caste a library can be skipped unless the GL is in play. NE is helpful but philo or a golden age will work. Parthenon built somewhere else or captured is nice. But after a granary I sometimes forget about GPF cities for some time. There have been times, like after 4-5 scientists, I notice the city could have used a forge, CH, lighthouse or some such thing I guess.