Which civ do you believe needs changing most?

[jlim201]

Which civ do you believe needs changing most? What would you like changes to be?

 

[jlim201]

Japan is still underpowered after Fall Patch

I would change it to

Japan- Receive 75% the food/production in gold from internal trade routes. Trade routes to other civs gold income reduced by 25%.

UU: Samurai- Open Terrain Bonus (Shock ll) Bushido (Former UA) and has +4 strength over the Longswordsman. Upgrades to Rifleman.

UB: Dojo- Replaces Barracks- When a melee unit is trained, receive a culture boost that is triple the units strength. All melee units are given Amphibious. +3 Culture.

 

[Syailendra]

obviously indonesia, even the opening naration needs a change. Lets list the change needed.
1. UA, too situational! Why not give the first luxes a capital?
2. UB, again too situational, its hard enough to find a other 'continent', why did they think that you also needs a fresh water source.
3. UU, AGAIN too situational, have you got 3 bad promotions in a row? What should i do next? Restart?
4. Another UU rant, i never found any majapahit history saying that there is a squad armed with the kris daggers as primary weapon, even more imposible with kris swords.
5. The candi icon, C'MON firaxis! Its a split gate icon you put there, some people called it 'candi bentar', but its not a candi, its like you put a bike (bycicle) icon for a motorbike unit!
6. And of course the spanish narrator.

 

[jlim201]

im bored,

Denmark- +100 gold when pillaging a resources/trade routes. -1 movement to embark/disembark
UU- Berserker
UU- Longship- Replaces the Trireme. +2 movement. May enter coastal land tiles, but when on land, acts as an embarked land unit.

America- UA Manifest Destiny- All units have +1 sight. Ideological pressure generated doubled towards all civs. Happiness from cities reduced by 25%.

UU- Minuteman

UB- Monitor- Replaces the Ironclad. -25% production cost. +15% strength when defending. Does not require coal.

India- Religious pressure exerted increased by 25%. All religious units may spread religion 1 extra time.

War Elephant- Replaces Horseman. +3 strength, -1 movement. All enemy units beside a War Elephant receive a 5% penalty when attacking.

Mughal Fort- Replaces the Barracks, +5 XP for all land units. +2 Culture, +3 gold once Economics is researched.

Indonesia- Indonesian Islands- Each city on a different landmass gives Indonesia an extra 1 happiness. The first three cities founded (including capital) each gain an extra Luxury Resource.

UU- Kris Swordsman- Replaces the Longswordsman, available at Metal Casting.

New bonuses (reworked)

◾Invulnerability: +25% Combat Bonus when fortified/healing.
◾Sneak Attack: Flank attack bonus increased by 40%
◾Heroism: Unit awards combat bonus to nearby units as if it is a Great General. (stacks with GGs)
◾Ambition: +30% Combat Bonus when attacking.
◾Restlessness: May attack twice
◾Recruitment: Heals 25 damage if the unit kills a non-Barbarian unit
◾Enemy Blade: Has a 10% capture chance of barbarian units
◾Evil Spirits: Gain an extra 20 HP when pillaging. Spreads religion (exerts small amount of religious pressure) when within 2 tiles of an enemy city.


UB- Stupa- Replaces the Temple. +1 faith, Indonesia gains the pantheon belief of the most common religion in cities with a Stupa.

Songhai- Only change- Mandekalu Cavalry now have +1 movement and no movement cost to embark/disembark

 

[Galgus]

America

Manifest Destiny:

All land military units have +1 sight.

50% discount when purchasing tiles.

Gold purchasing buildings in newly founded cities costs 25% less .


Changes to Economic Superpower upon adopting an Ideology.


Economic Superpower:

-15% building maintenance cost and +25% Empire wide per turn.

 

[NukeAJS]

America -

Minute man - +1 sight, victory adds to golden ages, starts with drill 1.

B52 changed to Pioneer (replaces settler): +1 sight, can defend (10 strength), has a 20% chance of converting adjacent barbs every turn (but not ones in a camp). Always converts a barb that dies while attacking (but not while stacked). Cannot attack.

Manifest Destiny changed to exceptionalism: all gp production (including gg and gas) increased by 5% per era. Palace gets +2 gold and culture every era starting at classical.

 

[Arachnofiend]

India is unique in the fact that it is both bad and boring. Everyone else on the list is either one or the other.

 

[Megalomano]

I think India must be one of the weakest civilizations ever.

 

[MKDELTA3]

India is unique in the fact that it is both bad and boring. Everyone else on the list is either one or the other.

Heh, so true. I also find it quite odd that a civilization that is home to several religions gets no religious bonuses whatsoever. I understand that India was in the game before religion was but it's still quite strange. Afterall Firaxis did give Arabia some religion-related bonuses.

As for the others on the list:

Japan suffers mostly from the fact that melee units aren't very good. I guess Bushido is not such a great UA either but I miss it every time I'm not playing Japan. Oil-free Zeros are a bit odd but nice.

Denmark also suffers from the problem of melee units not being very good. The Norwegian Ski Infantry is a pretty oddball unit and I would have prefered to see a straight Viking civilization with a unique early naval unit.

Ottomans...the UA is bizarre. The Ottomans were a lot of things but I don't think they were a particulary naval civilization. If anything their UA should reflect their expansion and the vilayet system somehow. Janissaries are good while Sipahi suffer from the same problems as every other Lancer does.

America plays like it's tailor made for lategame domination victories. Which is in my opinion OK from a pure gameplay perspective but once again weird flavor-wise. The buffed Minutemen are very nice and everyone loves Bombers anyway. I can see why a lot of people are unhappy with America as it is now.

Indonesia is random to the point of being annoying. Candis don't make sense as Garden replacements. Post-patch we have an archipelago empire which plays out best as a GP generating machine. I'd make the Candi a Shrine replacement and remove the bad promotions from Mystic Blade while toning down the good ones. I myself like the UA down to the restrictions but a lot of people don't and AIs struggle with oversea settling so maybe it could just be first three cities.

Songhai has again a pretty weird UA. I can see the triple gold from camps & city pillage but I can't see the whole sub-saharan marines thing they got going on. It's not a bad civ but the UA is just so strange. Something along the line of rivers counting as roads for Songhai would be a better fit. Mud Pyramids are a nice UB but Mandekalus suffer from the same problems as every other melee UU without absurd unique abilities. Ranged units and especialy unprotected cities are way too good right now. Rebalancing the combat would probably improve like half of the civs on this list.

I'd give Songhai's War Canoes to Polynesia on top of the Wayfinding bonus. It would fith thematicaly and would allow Polynesia to explore and colonize with less fear of getting their units sunk by some random Galleys. Humans can of course cirumvent this with careful planning but the AI probably has massive issue with this. I was rather suprised to see that Polynesia isn't on the poll since it seems to be one of those civs that everyone is unhappy with.

 

[Arachnofiend]

America plays like it's tailor made for lategame domination victories. Which is in my opinion OK from a pure gameplay perspective but once again weird flavor-wise. The buffed Minutemen are very nice and everyone loves Bombers anyway. I can see why a lot of people are unhappy with America as it is now.

...Isn't late game domination pretty much one of the things real world America has proven very good at? The other one I'd pick them for is culture but having America as a warmonger that comes alive in the 19th and 20th centuries is perfectly acceptable flavor wise and is quite strong gameplay wise (Minutemen are the fourth best melee unit in the game with the Impi, Carolean, and Janissary in front of it and then there's a huge drop off after the Minutemen).

It is still kinda boring though. As much as I'd like a late game culture civ with fancy Great Works of Cinema there are other civs that need the boost more.

 

[Galgus]

...Isn't late game domination pretty much one of the things real world America has proven very good at? The other one I'd pick them for is culture but having America as a warmonger that comes alive in the 19th and 20th centuries is perfectly acceptable flavor wise and is quite strong gameplay wise (Minutemen are the fourth best melee unit in the game with the Impi, Carolean, and Janissary in front of it and then there's a huge drop off after the Minutemen).

It is still kinda boring though. As much as I'd like a late game culture civ with fancy Great Works of Cinema there are other civs that need the boost more.

America has done a lot of things, really.

Its not the Manifest Destiny idea I have a problem with, but how they implemented it.

 

[phaethon16]

I voted Songhai because I see Songhai as the most boring. India would go before Songhai, but I would rather split India into an India civ and the Mughals to give India a total face lift. So, the Songhai tops my list.

 

[Lights]

obviously indonesia, even the opening naration needs a change. Lets list the change needed.
1. UA, too situational! Why not give the first luxes a capital?
2. UB, again too situational, its hard enough to find a other 'continent', why did they think that you also needs a fresh water source.
3. UU, AGAIN too situational, have you got 3 bad promotions in a row? What should i do next? Restart?
4. Another UU rant, i never found any majapahit history saying that there is a squad armed with the kris daggers as primary weapon, even more imposible with kris swords.
5. The candi icon, C'MON firaxis! Its a split gate icon you put there, some people called it 'candi bentar', but its not a candi, its like you put a bike (bycicle) icon for a motorbike unit!
6. And of course the spanish narrator.

The UB doesn't require fresh water with fall patch, that means Candi everywhere, and that's a lot of faith, the bigger the map, the more faith, the more chances to find island to settle. But it's true there isn't synergy between their UU UA UB.
My changes:

UA Spice Islanders: The first 3 cities founded on continents other than where Indonesia started each provide 2 unique Luxury Resources (and can never be razed). Can embark coast immediately.

UB Candi: Replaces the temple
Cost: 120
+1 extra faith and culture.
+1 Culture and Faith for each religion present in the city.
Maintenance 1
Redone but it works like the old Candi, it works pretty well with piety. And it gives a nice culture bonus. I made it replace the temple because it'd be OP if it replace the shrine and gave that bonus that easily.

UU Kris Swordsman:
Replaces Swordsman
Cost: 70 (a bit less)
Requires Iron
Strenght: 14
Move: 2
Gains a unique random promotion (you don't need to battle)
Unique promotions:
Ambition: +25% offensive combat bonus.
Enemy Blade: +15% Combat penalty to adjacent enemies
Evil Spirits: +1 Movement. No movement cost to pillage improvements.
Heroism Nearby Units gain a +10% combat bonus. It stacks with Great General bonus.
Invulnerability: +25% defensive combat bonus, +15 Hit Points when healing.
Recruitment: Heals 75 damage if it destroys an enemy non-Barbarian Unit
Restlessness: May attack twice
Sneak Attack: +15% combat bonus for each Flanking Unit, not +10%

Got rid of the negative promotions and nerfed some of the OP promotions. As you don't need to battle to gain the promotion you can plan how to use the unit effectively.

 

[phaethon16]

I actually like Indonesia a lot now that the patch is out. The only change I would make would be to add a fourth spice that you get by founding the capital. Besides that, the Candi works a lot better now. In addition to producing a TON of faith (if you play it right) you get a garden in every city. I didn't build temples with Indonesia until I wanted the grand temple, because I didn't need to build them. As the for the Kris Swordsman, I get why people are annoyed with the negative promotions, but I feel as if some of the positive bonuses more than compensate. What I do is just mass produce Kris Swordsman, and once I find the ones that have bad promotions I use them as fodder during sieges. I really don't get why people hate them so much, because in my opinion they're really interesting, fun, and when you get a promotion like invulnerable they're pretty deadly too. Overall, I really don't think Indonesia needs any changes, because they're one of my favorite new civs.

 

[cpm4001]

Of the options in the poll, I think I'd have to go with Denmark - they just aren't "Viking"-y enough. I have absolutely no ideas on how to fix them, of course...
However, how about this for a slightly revamped America?

UA: Manifest Destiny
All land units receive +1 sight. Builds Civilian Units 50% faster and Civilian Units can defend themselves.

This would get rid of the pretty much useless tile purchasing discount and more accurately reflect the rapid settlement the US undertook. In addition, allowing Workers and Settlers to defend themselves represents the pioneers

UU: Minuteman
Cost: 150 Hammers/300 Faith
Combat Strength: 20
Movement: 2
Ignores Terrain Cost, and starts with Drill I.

Ditched the inane Golden Age Ability promotion (why they tacked that on, I don't know...) and gave the Minuteman a slightly weaker combat strength to offset their other abilities (and also to represent the fact that the real-life Minutemen were not well armed by any means.)

I think the B17 is a good enough unit as it stands (it's fantastic for late-game warfare).