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While you wait for Civ5...

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Rhye's and Fall of Civilization' started by Rhye, Sep 18, 2010.

  1. micbic

    micbic Optimistic Pessimist

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    This given, the Dutch could wage war at the French anytime, with the Belgians not taking notice, or confusing the flying arrows for shooting stars :p
     
  2. Crossphazer

    Crossphazer King

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    I think in an RFC-esque mod of Civ V, a collapsed Civ should collapse into a few City States for the important cities, and something like independents for the minor cities. Also, we need to get rid of the silly "can't destroy Capitals or City States" rule and perhaps add a domination type victory in % population/land area, because capturing ALL the world's capitals in a system with stability is going to be very difficult. Also because there aren't any vassals anymore (perhaps add this too.)
     
  3. nody

    nody Emperor

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    The map should be twice as large as the Civ IV map so an archer in Amsterdam can barely reach Brussel. Also the 1 UPT-rule should be modded out.
     
  4. Baldyr

    Baldyr "Hit It"

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    I think that the 1UPT rule is something you simply have to learn to live with. The other versions of Civ have similar non-believable features also - and we adjusted to them, right? (And I am still a big fan of the Panzer General games, which basically use the same combat rules.)

    While I'm not getting Civ5, at all, the deciding factor for me in the long run could very well be whether or not the AI has been greatly improved. Almost anything could be overlooked as long as there is a good enough AI, IMHO. This is after all why I'm not playing and modding Civ2 anymore... :rolleyes:

    The improved graphics I couldn't care less about. They will only serve to make modding more difficult, which pretty much defeats the point of a Civ game for me personally... :p
     
  5. Leoreth

    Leoreth Prince of Blood Moderator

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    I agree. Better AI would make me play Civ5. Graphics or their questionable game design approach to global strategy? Not really.
     
  6. nody

    nody Emperor

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    I would buy the game for having nice graphics and beautiful background music, too.

    Which are in Civ IV already great.
     
  7. killerkebab

    killerkebab Prince

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    I'm sure you don't really need our help to think of city states, that said since Spain/Portugal/Dutch are out I suppose it would be a good idea to have Madrid/Amsterdam/Lisboa as city states, also a whole load of city states in their usual colonial spots, maybe with a randomisation feature so that the game isn't too deterministic and the player can feasibly colonise somewhere ahistorical if they so choose.

    Since the Vikings aren't in either we'd need some cities in Scandinavia/Denmark, many of the Independents present in Civ4 RFC should make a re-appearence as city states imo, even if we increase the number of civs. City states such as Seoul, Patna, Samarqand amongst others.

    Seeing the Earth map present with the game (in the videos they released) I have a feeling it is smaller than the current RFC map (in terms of number of tiles). I may be wrong but it just feels quite small...
     
  8. nody

    nody Emperor

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    Of course Rhye will make his own Earth map, which will at least be as big as the Civ IV RFC map. RFC for Civ V should be an improvement on Civ IV, not a step backwards. I hope 'missing' features like certain resources (like corn, pig, copper, rice, crab and clam) can be modded in.

    Also, people who will play Civ V already must have a better computer than they needed for Civ IV. So a bigger map shouldn't be a problem if you are worried about loading time. I'm buying a new one within a few weeks. (of course I saved some money to be ready before I buy Civ V and another game that will be released shortly that I want to be able to play).
     
  9. killerkebab

    killerkebab Prince

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    I don't think it is quite so simple. This game has some pretty big system requirements - especially when compared to its predecessors at their time of release.
     
  10. Úmarth

    Úmarth Megalomaniac

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    Well, getting back on topic. I've taken a stab at selectively combining the suggestions so far, sorted them by period/region and into "necessary" and "less important", and used Wikipedia to get dates. Rather than just "filling up" as before I've tried to pay attention to having cities for each civ to deal with, more than one of that civ is otherwise isolated, and where possible placing independents between two or more civs.

    There are way more than 25, so it might have to be pared down. I say might, because I'd like to suggest that a lot more independent cities would be a good for representing the way most Empires were built by conquest and not colonisation, and how minor states constantly rise and fall alongside the major civilizations.

    Assumptions:
    - There will only be one start, 3000 BC or thereabouts.
    - Using the short chronology for the Near East.
    - The Greek civ, like in RFC, won't make coastal colonies in the west, so these are independent. Anyway this has an historical basis: they weren't deliberate 'colonial' foundations, but date to a much earlier period, and actually appeared about the same time as the polis back in Greece. They were culturally associated with Greece proper, but not politically subordinate to it. Same with the Phoenician colonies, but since there isn't a Phoenician civ that doesn't matter.
    - Germany will be like it is in RFC: just one civ, representing the HRE inc. Austria and then modern Germany (although personally I think this is a great opportunity to represent Germany/the HRE better).
    - Colonisation by missing civs (Spain, Portugal, Netherlands), will be handled some other way.
    - The Songhai civ will be used to represent the Empire of Mali too, otherwise maybe there is a case for having Malinese cities e.g. Timbuktu as independents before they spawn.
    - Siam will cover most of SE Asia.
    - The Indian civ will mainly represent northern Indian civilizations and Empires.




    ANCIENT NEAR EAST

    Necessary
    Hattusas (2000 BC)
    Babylon (1800 BC)
    Troy (1300 BC)
    Jerusaleum (1100 BC)

    Less important
    Knossos (3000 BC)
    Tyre (2000 BC - http://phoenicia.org/cities.html)
    Salamis (1100 BC)
    Antioch (320 BC)


    CLASSICAL EUROPE

    Necessary
    Syracuse (730 BC)
    Massilia (600 BC)

    Less important
    Caralis (700 BC)
    Tarentum (700 BC)


    CLASSICAL NORTH AFRICA/SPAIN

    Necessary
    Leptis Magna -> Tripoli (1100 BC)
    Carthage (800 BC)
    Carthago Nova (230 BC)

    Less important
    Cyrene (630 BC)
    Emporion -> Barcelona (575 BC)
    Tingis (500 BC)
    Saguntum (400 BC)


    MEDIEVAL WEST/CENTRAL EUROPE

    Necessary
    Edinburgh (600)
    Amsterdam (1300)
    Warsaw (1300)

    Less important
    Geneva (400)
    Dublin (840)


    MEDIEVAL BALTIC/SCANDANAVIA

    Necessary
    Oslo (1050)
    Copenhagen (1170)
    Stockholm (1250)

    Less important
    Nidaros -> Trondheim (1000)
    Riga (1200)


    MEDIEVAL SPAIN

    Necessary
    Madrid (1080)
    Lisbon (1140, foundation of K. of Portugal)

    Less important
    Barcelona (From Emporion, or 340)
    Cordoba (170 - Roman foundation, 710 - conquest by Muslims)


    MEDIEVAL RUSSIA

    Necessary
    Kiev (800)

    Less important
    Novgorod (1000)
    Kazan (1000)


    AMERICAS

    Necessary
    Tikal (200)
    Cuzco (900)
    Tlaxcala (1300)

    Less important
    Tiwanaku (400)
    Copan (420)
    Quito (980)
    Chan Chan (850)


    EAST ASIA

    Necessary
    Wiryeseong -> Namgyeong -> Hanseong -> Seoul (20 BC)
    or Pyongyang (400, made capital of Goguryeo)
    Lhasa (640)
    Hanoi (870)

    Less important
    Jakarta (400)


    SILK ROAD

    Necessary
    Balkh/Bactra (1700 BC)
    Samarkand (700 BC)

    Less important
    Turfan (?)
    Kucha (?)
    Kashgar (?)


    SOUTH ASIA

    Necessary
    Pataliputra -> Patna (500 BC)
    Kanchipuram (300)
    Pagan (870)
    (needs expanding, I think, but I know nothing about Indian history)


    ARABIA/EAST AFRICA

    Necessary
    Kerma -> Napata -> Moroe (they'll be on the same tile, presumably) (2500 BC)
    Aksum (1000 BC?)

    Less important
    Aden (100 BC)
    Musqat (700)
    Mogadishu (900)
    Mombasa (?)
    Kilwa (1000)


    WEST & SOUTH AFRICA

    Necessary
    M'banza-Kongo (1400?)
    Great Zimbabwe (1000?)
     
  11. LuKo

    LuKo The Royal Guard

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  12. Úmarth

    Úmarth Megalomaniac

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    None of the dates are properly researched, just quickly grabbed from Wikipedia. But I figured that was a start, at least.
     
  13. Sikandar

    Sikandar Prince

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    Why not include Babylon as a playable civ and just have an alternate made for people who didn't buy the deluxe edition?
     
  14. Magnificent One

    Magnificent One Stetsons are cool.

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    Spain should be in before Bayblon if any new civs are being created.
     
  15. Sikandar

    Sikandar Prince

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    Spain isn't in Civ V. Babylon is.
     
  16. Dargoth

    Dargoth Warlord

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    Roman start area (2)
    Syracuse (Sicily)
    Medolanum (Northern Italy)

    French start area (1)
    Massillia (Southern France)

    Greek start area (3)
    Rhodes
    Sparta
    Pella

    English star area(3)
    Dublin
    Edinbourgh
    Cardiff

    America area start area (0)
    None

    Arabia start area(2)
    Damascus
    Jerusalem

    Aztec start area (1)
    Tikal

    China start area (4)
    Hong Kong
    Maceu
    Taipei
    Seoul

    Egypt start area (1)
    Alexandria

    Germany start area (3)
    Vienna
    Copenhagen
    Warsaw

    India start area (3)
    Karachi
    Islamabad
    Dhaka

    Ottomans start area (1)
    Constantinople


    Russians start area (1)
    Kiev

    Siam (1)
    Ankor wat

    Hopefully you will be able to raise the number of city states over 24

    I was rather bemused that we already have a new fan made civ for civ5 up on this site The Celts maybe Rhye will get lucky and somebody will do Spain ;)
     
  17. onedreamer

    onedreamer Dragon

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    Civ isn't a grand strategy game. It's a strategy game. Strategy games include tactical battles.


    IT:
    In spain I would scrap Barcelona (not so important considering History from ancient days till today) and have Cadiz and some other, maybe La Coruna.
     
  18. SalmonSoil

    SalmonSoil Prince

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  19. Dargoth

    Dargoth Warlord

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    Nah its to small

    Apparently theres an Earth map for each map size in Civ 5. Im hoping that the biggest earth map will be at least the same size as the one Rhyes used for his mod in civ4 (ideally it should be bigger)
     
  20. Jusos2108

    Jusos2108 Deity

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    Sad to say this, but that world map looks horrible. Uhh, the rivers...

    EDIT: and it needs to be consirable bigger.
     

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