Why is war weariness so weak?

[Miserable Old Git]

I've been playing civ6 since it came out, generally on huge maps at deity level. I have never, ever, had any issues with war weariness.

In my current game I have now been at permanent war, mostly with several civs at the same time, for 127 turns. In that time, I have captured and occupied 53 cities, as well as having razed a similar number, and freed a few city states.

My current total war weariness, over my total 62 cities, is... errrmmmm... zero.

What is the point ???

 

[SaboteurINT]

Do you have high amenities in cities ornoow amenities ?

 

[Miserable Old Git]

Why amenities? Surely, if war weariness means what it says, it refers to body-bags, not baubles?

 

[Jaybe]

You should be more casual about losing units. If you would lose units, your war weariness will increase.

 

[Oberinspektor Derrick]

You should be more casual about losing units. If you would lose units, your war weariness will increase.

This is why this doesnt work. Compared to the AI (assuming single player, which most people play), the player tends to lose a lot less units compared to the AI. If you hardly lose any units (not unreasonable) this effect is close to null and void.

In this regard I think the civ 5 system was both simpler and better. Standing armies can and will often bankrupt you, and taking over cities need to be planned well in advance, because negative happiness can absolutely ruin your empire.
Of course that system had its issues as well, but civ 6 is imo way too forgiving in this department, as there is practically no downside to just mowing down the AI.

 

[cain3456]

Why amenities? Surely, if war weariness means what it says, it refers to body-bags, not baubles?

Bread and circuses

 

[Swissy]

I play exclusively multiplayer. War weariness is a huge problem. Since war weariness is calculated by the loss of units and apply to the building city, a major war can pile up the numbers for a few cities quickly. Playing MP you learn to war differently; don't use just a few cities to build units, kill enemy units instead spreading damage to blunt a push, get your wounded units out asap. Losing units has a long term effect on your game, as many player build units out of their larger cities, which cannot afford the amenities hit from war weariness. You begin to get the negative modifiers and you can find your game struggling even though you are actually winning a war. In single player you don't lose enough units, in multiplayer you can lose the number of total units you lost in 10 single player games in just 6-8 turns.

 

[blackbutterfly]

Yeah, play Gandhi or Alexander in MP.
Just DoW everyone and watch their FIMS collapse.

 

[UWHabs]

This is why this doesnt work. Compared to the AI (assuming single player, which most people play), the player tends to lose a lot less units compared to the AI. If you hardly lose any units (not unreasonable) this effect is close to null and void.

In this regard I think the civ 5 system was both simpler and better. Standing armies can and will often bankrupt you, and taking over cities need to be planned well in advance, because negative happiness can absolutely ruin your empire.
Of course that system had its issues as well, but civ 6 is imo way too forgiving in this department, as there is practically no downside to just mowing down the AI.

I have had some wars in the past which caused enough issues to be mildly inconvenient. But agreed, I would love to see a system which is punitive enough that even if a war is going well for you, over time the demands on your homeland is too much that you have to take a step back to recover. It's still way too easy to run a permanent war while the homeland is happily building backs and theatre squares.

 

[Aurelesk]

Something to know is that there is a maximum negative Amenities a city can have from War Weariness. It scales with Population. It can, at most, just double the Amenities a city need (10 Population cities need 5 Amenities, and War Weariness max at 5 additional required Amenities).

Since only a city under Unrest or Revolt is really impactful (a little less true in Gathering Storm), and a city can only reach it with at least 5 negative Amenities, the threshold when War Weariness could be harsh is rarely met. Basically a 10 Population with at least 1 bonus Amenity (Classical Republic legacy) is never going to hit that harsh threshold.

There is an exception: conquered cities. They can ask for quadruple Amenities instead of double. Which could be "impactful" mostly Loyalty-wise. If you lost a lot of units to get that City, it does mean you will have a hard time to continue the conquest so the newly conquered city will be severely hit by the Loyalty malus from the negative Amenities.

 

[pokiehl]

I’ve learned a lot about war weariness from this thread. I had no idea it applied to the city the defeated unit was from, or that there was a cap on amenities loss.

 

[megabearsfan]

Since war weariness is calculated by the loss of units and apply to the building city, a major war can pile up the numbers for a few cities quickly.

I didn't realize the War Weariness from killed units applied specifically to the city that built the unit. Given that knowledge, it would be really nice if the unit widget would specify which city the unit comes from. That way, if you have a city that is struggling with War Weariness, you can potentially pull its units from the front lines to prevent revolt.

Also, what happens when units from different cities are combined into corps/armies/fleets/armadas? I would assume that since the exp and promotions of the most-promoted unit is retained in the joined corps/army/fleet/armada, that highest-promoted unit's city of origin is also retained for the resulting corps/army/fleet/armada.