I don't like the science/culture penalties in CivV (haven't played enough VI); in real world every country scrambles for half-decent territory. Would rather raging barbarians to make early expansion difficult than arbitrary, unrealistic penalties. I realize there are 7 weeks to go; but I haven't kept up with all the announcements and I'm wondering what everybody's' thoughts are.
Will Civ VII favor wide, even ICS, more (like Civ II, III) or tall (V)?
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stealth_nsk
Deity
Civ5 was too focused on tall viability, it's not right for 4X game where big part of the game is to compete for land. So, Civ6 made expansion more important again.
Civ7 has totally different definition of wide vs. tall. While expansion is important for all playstyles, you could have small number of extremely large cities supported by multiple towns, or you could focus on having more cities, but without that many towns feeding them, they'll be unable to grow that much.
Civ7 has totally different definition of wide vs. tall. While expansion is important for all playstyles, you could have small number of extremely large cities supported by multiple towns, or you could focus on having more cities, but without that many towns feeding them, they'll be unable to grow that much.
Civ 7 is definitely a semi-wide game…..expand as much as you can up to an explicit settlement limit (the limit slowly grows. and it is soft so you can go over it a little, but there are escalating happiness costs for going over the limit.)
As mentioned, the big difference is how many of those settlements will become cities v towns
more cites=smaller cities because of less towns to feed them
As mentioned, the big difference is how many of those settlements will become cities v towns
more cites=smaller cities because of less towns to feed them
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There is some tall/wide dichotomy in the ratio between cities and towns, but also total amount of settlements vs. larger towns, and specialist economy vs. improvement economy. I don’t think we can really grasp viable strategies and define wide and tall yet, but it‘s definitely different from previous civs. Neither the few settlements of 5 nor (mindless) ICS of the other games seem reasonable at first glance.
Here‘s hoping that there are many good ways to build your empire and choices matter. It‘s Christmas after all.
Here‘s hoping that there are many good ways to build your empire and choices matter. It‘s Christmas after all.
It is hard to say without having played the game, but my guess right now is that it is going to play wider than Civ5 but taller than Civ6.
I have not seen anything which suggests that you wouldn't want to reach the settlement cap. It remains to be seen how viable it is to go over the settlement cap, but I doubt that marginal cities as you would plop them down in Civ6 would be a good idea in Civ7
I have not seen anything which suggests that you wouldn't want to reach the settlement cap. It remains to be seen how viable it is to go over the settlement cap, but I doubt that marginal cities as you would plop them down in Civ6 would be a good idea in Civ7
A marginal town under the cap probably is not too worthwhile… no penalty for having it, but the settler and buying buildings investment might not be worthwhile
Like in any other Civ game (or any 4x game, really), a settler is going to pay for itself even in a marginal spot, provided the new settlement comes with no empire-wide malus. But you might not want it to take up a spot in your settlement cap which could be filled with a juicier city (which your neighbor might happen to possess for the moment)
Lonecat Nekophrodite
Deity
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Firaxis claims that player can EITHRE play TALL or WIDE. depending on player's preferrence (or constrains)
I Myself prefers BOTH approach. Capitol not a border city. (And 'Borderlands' means land adjacency to other players, any coastal cities will be considered Border cities EITHER it has land border adjacents to neighbouring country, OR it is at the CORNER or TIP of any landmass.). AND with maximum radius to ensure late game metropolitan possibility.
I Myself prefers BOTH approach. Capitol not a border city. (And 'Borderlands' means land adjacency to other players, any coastal cities will be considered Border cities EITHER it has land border adjacents to neighbouring country, OR it is at the CORNER or TIP of any landmass.). AND with maximum radius to ensure late game metropolitan possibility.
stealth_nsk
Deity
The difference is in your city to town ratio. You can't have both.
It will definitely not favor ICS, but will be wider than 5. They are seeming to go for 'arbitrary' penalties (by your definition).
Basically there's a 'soft' settlement cap that can be increased, and can be circumvented with excess happiness. Exceeding it penalizes outputs across your empire and/or gives you less 'celebrations' (which increase bonuses/policy card slots). So going too wide too soon has some significant downsides.
However, they are also making a distinction now with cities (where you can produce things) and towns (which just generate yields (like gold) and give bonuses to cities). This is to reduce production queue management. It also indicates the expectation that you'll be somewhat wide by the end of the game.
Basically there's a 'soft' settlement cap that can be increased, and can be circumvented with excess happiness. Exceeding it penalizes outputs across your empire and/or gives you less 'celebrations' (which increase bonuses/policy card slots). So going too wide too soon has some significant downsides.
However, they are also making a distinction now with cities (where you can produce things) and towns (which just generate yields (like gold) and give bonuses to cities). This is to reduce production queue management. It also indicates the expectation that you'll be somewhat wide by the end of the game.
Isengardtom
Prince
More tall than Civ 6 thanks to specialists and support from the towns, but probably not as tall as 5
canadamufc
Prince
I'm sure Firaxis intended for wide gameplay to be viable in V and tall gameplay to be viable in VI.
The truth is, I don't think we will know until players start playing the game.
The truth is, I don't think we will know until players start playing the game.
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