Work in Progress - Conquests of Might and Magic III

[General 666]

Your preview looks nice. Very HOMM like.

 

[Balthasar]

I'm also planning to use the original artwork from the cards for Civilopedia and building graphics. Do you think I'll get in trouble for that, re copyright law?
Nick

This question comes up from time to time, and the answer is found in the list of Mods and scenarios already here. The Warhammer, Star Wars, Star Trek, Jurassic Park and other scenarios wouldn't exist but for the rare instance of common sense in the law. Some really wise person figured out long ago in the early days of the internet, when thousands of fan sites, some run anonymously, suddenly came into being that there had to be a way to define this as OK, or there would be millions of lawsuits clogging the courts of multiple countries. What they did was carve out exceptions in copyright law for "fan created content" and "fair use". So:

1. You can't ever sell it, trade it for profit, or place any inherent value on it.
2. You can't claim it as your creation. (i.e., "Vulcans were my idea!")
3. It helps to add a little note that your project is a homage, not a rip-off, is not to be sold ever, and that it's based on copywritten material owned by someone else. Encourage purchase of the original product - that couldn't hurt..

By the way, I'm not a lawyer and this is not a legal opinion, just my own opinion based on what I've observed. If you ever think you've crossed a line, for gawd's sake stop before you hurt yourself.

 

[nick0515]

This question comes up from time to time, and the answer is found in the list of Mods and scenarios already here. The Warhammer, Star Wars, Star Trek, Jurassic Park and other scenarios wouldn't exist but for the rare instance of common sense in the law. Some really wise person figured out long ago in the early days of the internet, when thousands of fan sites, some run anonymously, suddenly came into being that there had to be a way to define this as OK, or there would be millions of lawsuits clogging the courts of multiple countries. What they did was carve out exceptions in copyright law for "fan created content" and "fair use". So:

1. You can't ever sell it, trade it for profit, or place any inherent value on it.
2. You can't claim it as your creation. (i.e., "Vulcans were my idea!")
3. It helps to add a little note that your project is a homage, not a rip-off, is not to be sold ever, and that it's based on copywritten material owned by someone else. Encourage purchase of the original product - that couldn't hurt..

By the way, I'm not a lawyer and this is not a legal opinion, just my own opinion based on what I've observed. If you ever think you've crossed a line, for gawd's sake stop before you hurt yourself.

Thanks Balthasar. I'll follow the advise you give. That's a good common sense approach which allows me to create my scenario, and means I'm unlikely to be crossing any lines.

 

[DFBATTLER]

I'll contribute as much as I can. As of now, I'm looking for any kind of map of Enroth (and Antagarich if I can) with cities so you can release 5 biqs, and not just 3.

 

[DFBATTLER]

Map of Enroth found! Time for a new biq This is a h3m file compatible with any Heroes 3 Map Editor = View attachment New Enroth.h3m.zip Hope this will help with the Enroth city locations and scenario overall! If there's anything at all you need help with, I'll be more than happy to contribute!

 

[tom2050]

I take it from the above that you are going to restrict different Civs to different eras so that civs with the same culture group can have different graphics for cities, buildings etc thereby creating up to 20 culture groups at the cost of a much smaller tech tree. This is what I am planning to do in my fantasy scenario. Do you know if it has been done before? I was kinda hoping it was a new and exciting idea, but more than likely others have come up with it before, and obviously you have too. If it has been done before that at least means it works as I haven't tested it yet. I was very happy when I thought of it because many of the scenarios I want to build don't require big tech tress anyway, especially my fantasy scenario (not the MTG one).

It does work, and although I have never seen it done before.. it probably is not used because of the fact that it forces you to seperate civ's on the tech tree, and severely limits various aspects of the game. For instance, to use all 20 'culture groups', that means that 25% of all civ's would be limited to the ancient era tech, 25% to the industrial era, and so on.. otherwise their building graphics will change if they go to a new era. I only need 10 culture groups, so I can have half of the civs use the ancient/medieval and the other half use the industrial and modern.

The other side effect is that you cannot have a single tech tree, but it has to be split in 2, 3 or 4. With 20 culture groups, you would have to quadruple the tech tree to fit in each era. Similarly I will have to double the tech tree.

This can probably be used in Epic Games as well, since you would just need to start certain civ's off in the appropriate era. You should start a thread discussing this idea, I would be interested to see if others have used it or not.. input from the community is always good to see the ups and downs of using this.

Do you think I'll get in trouble for that, re copyright law? This is off topic again so I want post more on this subject.

Using music/sounds from games could be questionable though, although it could also fall under the same category that Balthasar mentioned. Since there is such copyright laws on distributing mp3 music (even if from a game), I would be on the safe side and email the company first to get a response. In my case, 3D0 doesn't even exist anymore, so I would have to email Ubisoft (since they own the rights) to see what they say about it.

Map of Enroth found! Time for a new biq This is a h3m file compatible with any Heroes 3 Map Editor = Attachment 223262 Hope this will help with the Enroth city locations and scenario overall! If there's anything at all you need help with, I'll be more than happy to contribute!

Thank You, that will be very helpful in creating a map! As far as cities go, it's likely there is no way to know their positions, as far as I've checked... so initial start position's of capitals will have to do, or placing cities with random HOMM city names (from the list I have compiled) could suffice as well.

I have found a few other maps as well that may help a bit.

Tom

 

[tom2050]

EDIT: Problem solved

 

[nick0515]

Started a new thread the more culture groups thing.

 

[DFBATTLER]

Thank You, that will be very helpful in creating a map! As far as cities go, it's likely there is no way to know their positions, as far as I've checked... so initial start position's of capitals will have to do, or placing cities with random HOMM city names (from the list I have compiled) could suffice as well.

I have found a few other maps as well that may help a bit.

Tom

Sweet! Waiting for orders now.

Started a new thread the more culture groups thing.

+1 That's awesome!

 

[tom2050]

Sweet! Waiting for orders now.

Okay, what do you think about this for map.... I have found these images as well (mostly 3DO maps released with various games, some were user created on other sites in attempts to make a full map)

Map of Enroth and Antagarich in their approximate locations...

I could use this for creating a pretty detailed map of Antagarich (for terrain)... Also, the from the map above, you can see where Vori is, should I include this as well? (I guess I would have to though) The Vori Elves I think were only ever included in the game Chronicles: Sword of Frost.. Capital is Vorlee, other than that, they are somewhat shrouded in mystery.

Then a couple maps of Erathia and Enroth... although the HOMM3 map you provided gives a bit more info on cities and an excellent layout for a conversion to a Civ3 map.

It appears you were correct, the correct spelling is Pierpont and not Pierpoint (as when I was searching around, I saw it spelled both ways, in the links you provided as well)

In the map above, I'm not sure what that city of Spaward is?? I suppose it belongs to Avlee?

So far, and from your info, here is what I have for Capitols:

Avlee Pierpont
The Contested Lands (Harmondale) Welnin
Erathia Steadwick
Deyja Moulder
Eoful Kreelah
Nighon Tarnum
Tatalia Tidewater
Krewlod Ulgak
Bracada Celeste

I have compiled a list of around 30-40 city names for each Civ for the game itself... so that should probably be sufficient.

Here is a pc of the cities... I have completed the Conflux and Inferno as well, but they are not shown here. The necro and tower cities may seem a bit small, but that's because of their height, and there is no way to make them taller, so I'm stuck with it the way they are.

Tom

 

[DFBATTLER]

Okay, what do you think about this for map.... I have found these images as well (mostly 3DO maps released with various games, some were user created on other sites in attempts to make a full map)

Map of Enroth and Antagarich in their approximate locations...

I could use this for creating a pretty detailed map of Antagarich (for terrain)... Also, the from the map above, you can see where Vori is, should I include this as well? (I guess I would have to though) The Vori Elves I think were only ever included in the game Chronicles: Sword of Frost.. Capital is Vorlee, other than that, they are somewhat shrouded in mystery.

Then a couple maps of Erathia and Enroth... although the HOMM3 map you provided gives a bit more info on cities and an excellent layout for a conversion to a Civ3 map.

It appears you were correct, the correct spelling is Pierpont and not Pierpoint (as when I was searching around, I saw it spelled both ways, in the links you provided as well)

In the map above, I'm not sure what that city of Spaward is?? I suppose it belongs to Avlee?

So far, and from your info, here is what I have for Capitols:

Avlee Pierpont
The Contested Lands (Harmondale) Welnin
Erathia Steadwick
Deyja Moulder
Eoful Kreelah
Nighon Tarnum
Tatalia Tidewater
Krewlod Ulgak
Bracada Celeste

I have compiled a list of around 30-40 city names for each Civ for the game itself... so that should probably be sufficient.

Here is a pc of the cities... I have completed the Conflux and Inferno as well, but they are not shown here. The necro and tower cities may seem a bit small, but that's because of their height, and there is no way to make them taller, so I'm stuck with it the way they are.

Tom

I think so far what you've been doing it just awesome. Maps, Photoshopping, and h3m-to-biq conversion You're doing great! Keep going! I can't wait to get all the biqs played. BRB, releasing AW mod.

 

[nick0515]

The city graphics look great! The Necro cities look fine to me!

 

[DFBATTLER]

New Ideas!

- The SS Victory should be Grail Victory LOL
- The SS parts could be Grail 1, Grail 2, etc.
- The Techs should be changed to HOMM3 Names, like "Level 7" tech allows you to build the seventh-tier units like Titans and Blackdragons (based on your race).
- The Ages: IDK... "Before the Silence", "The Shadow of Death", "Restoration of Erathia", "Kreegans Expelled"... Something like this would sound really good
- The leaders - Both battle-created and the nation leaders... For example, Eeofol would have Lucifer Kreegan for its nation leader and Xenofex and Lucifer Kreegan as battle-created. Erathia would get something like Catherine Ironfist as nation and Catherine Ironfist, Roland Ironfist, General Morgan (is that his name?) as battle-created.
- The Wonders - Maybe things like Carnivourous Plant bring protection or something?

Whew! Done with ideas for now.

 

[tom2050]

New Ideas!

- The SS Victory should be Grail Victory LOL
- The SS parts could be Grail 1, Grail 2, etc.
- The Techs should be changed to HOMM3 Names, like "Level 7" tech allows you to build the seventh-tier units like Titans and Blackdragons (based on your race).
- The Ages: IDK... "Before the Silence", "The Shadow of Death", "Restoration of Erathia", "Kreegans Expelled"... Something like this would sound really good
- The leaders - Both battle-created and the nation leaders... For example, Eeofol would have Lucifer Kreegan for its nation leader and Xenofex and Lucifer Kreegan as battle-created. Erathia would get something like Catherine Ironfist as nation and Catherine Ironfist, Roland Ironfist, General Morgan (is that his name?) as battle-created.
- The Wonders - Maybe things like Carnivourous Plant bring protection or something?

Whew! Done with ideas for now.

Thank You for your ideas! I'm not familiar with the Carnivourous Plant of HOMM If it exists, it can be added...

Almost forgot about the Grail structures! That would be good to add to the tech tree. As it stands, since HOMM didn't deal with any kind of tech, I need to incorporate research into the game somehow, with creatures being the most obvious (and creature buildings).

I haven't made a dead-set decision yet, but to keep in-line with the HOMM3 structure (which was you built a town building, which then produced that creature every week), I will likely keep to that idea of having to build a building which autoproduces the appropriate creature. I will probably have Level 1 and Level 2 creatures be able to be built from the start, but their creature structures can be built to bring in additional troops, as well as those structures being prerequisites for higher buildings.

I like the Leader idea (can call them Heroes )... There was 16 Heroes in each town type in the game, so all of those could be included, as well as custom graphics for some of them.

The tech tree can go along the lines of providing creatures and structures, with branches off of the main line for their upgrades.

For magic use, there are some ways to incorporate it into the game (I would probably need to make new graphics for these though, although that would be relatively easy compared to making a full unit graphic).

1. Magic such as Town Portal/Dimension Door/Teleport could be incorporated using Airlift option.
2. Portals in the game could be incorporated using the Teleportation ability of the hacked editor.
3. Meteor Shower/Chain Lightning/Lightning Bolt and like magic attacks could be used as Air units bombing runs.
4. The magic spell Visions could reveal entire map.
5. The Spell Anti-Magic could act as Anti-Aircraft against spells such as in #3.
6. The Spell Scuttle Boat could be a lethal sea unit.
7. Magic Arrow/Ice Bolt could also be a bombard type unit.
8. The Spell Cure could work with a Heal in Enemy Territory Sm. Wonder
9. Armageddon spell can act as the Nuclear Weapon
10. Land Mine Spell when researched can autoproduce invisible mines.
11. Similarily, the spell Fire Wall can autoproduce invisible fire wall unit (would have to make a custom graphic)
12. Implosion spell would be a Lethal Land type unit.
13. Earthquake spell could act as a Prec Bombing unit.
14. Summon Elementals could be a Sm. Wonder which autoproduces one of the four Elementals.

These were just my first thoughts, much more can likely be done... It should be interesting to get it going.

Tom

 

[tom2050]

Here's the latest image of the Conflux and Inferno towns... along with some of the resources...



And the Dragon Utopia, about to be attacked by Castle forces in an attempt to take it's massive gold resources.




Tom

 

[nick0515]

Re magic, Your not planning to use cruise missile style spells? Just air units. Also if your not aware Aaglo made 5 spell attack graphics. Also there is the spell attack from WH 2.5. I'm planning to combine the Aaglo attacks with the WH spell as the default and run for my own fantasy scenario. I'm using them as cruise missiles. Air units are good too because you don't have to build so many of them and also you can defend against them with anti-air/magical defence units as you said.

This is going to be super cool. The screenshots look fantastic. Terrain looks good. The resources from the original game look great in civ.

I think this could end up giving the WH mod a serious challenge as the best fantasy mod! Great work!

 

[tom2050]

Re magic, Your not planning to use cruise missile style spells? Just air units. Also if your not aware Aaglo made 5 spell attack graphics. Also there is the spell attack from WH 2.5. I'm planning to combine the Aaglo attacks with the WH spell as the default and run for my own fantasy scenario. I'm using them as cruise missiles. Air units are good too because you don't have to build so many of them and also you can defend against them with anti-air/magical defence units as you said.

This is going to be super cool. The screenshots look fantastic. Terrain looks good. The resources from the original game look great in civ.

I think this could end up giving the WH mod a serious challenge as the best fantasy mod! Great work!

I will use Cruise Missles, but will have to test first to make sure the AI makes good use of them. Very often, the AI will hold Cruise Missles where it builds them and never move them, so a Cruise Missle unit would have to be a Spell that has a far bombard range, to make sure the AI will not horde them in it's towns.

I'm working on the Lava/Volcanic terrain now, and I am almost complete. The terrain is thanks to Ares de Borg (his beta terrain pack) and the creators of portions of the compiled pack. An absolute must-have! The one possible problem is that I have too many terrain types to be able to fit them all in an EPIC game (one too many, which is the lava terrain). The Lava terrain required me to fit it into one of the LM terrain types, so Epic games don't use LM terrains, which is quite unfortunate. I'm not sure what to do about this, unless I take out another terrain type and replace it with the Lava terrain.

Thanks for the info about the spell attacks, I remember seeing a few around somewhere, I'll check them out.

Tom

 

[nick0515]

Here's the link for the spells. I don't think the spell graphics from WH 2.5 are available for download outside of downloading the whole mod.

 

[DFBATTLER]

Here's the latest image of the Conflux and Inferno towns... along with some of the resources...

View attachment 223461

And the Dragon Utopia, about to be attacked by Castle forces in an attempt to take it's massive gold resources.

View attachment 223464


Tom

Good stuff!

Thank You for your ideas! I'm not familiar with the Carnivourous Plant of HOMM If it exists, it can be added...

Almost forgot about the Grail structures! That would be good to add to the tech tree. As it stands, since HOMM didn't deal with any kind of tech, I need to incorporate research into the game somehow, with creatures being the most obvious (and creature buildings).

I haven't made a dead-set decision yet, but to keep in-line with the HOMM3 structure (which was you built a town building, which then produced that creature every week), I will likely keep to that idea of having to build a building which autoproduces the appropriate creature. I will probably have Level 1 and Level 2 creatures be able to be built from the start, but their creature structures can be built to bring in additional troops, as well as those structures being prerequisites for higher buildings.

I like the Leader idea (can call them Heroes )... There was 16 Heroes in each town type in the game, so all of those could be included, as well as custom graphics for some of them.

The tech tree can go along the lines of providing creatures and structures, with branches off of the main line for their upgrades.

For magic use, there are some ways to incorporate it into the game (I would probably need to make new graphics for these though, although that would be relatively easy compared to making a full unit graphic).

1. Magic such as Town Portal/Dimension Door/Teleport could be incorporated using Airlift option.
2. Portals in the game could be incorporated using the Teleportation ability of the hacked editor.
3. Meteor Shower/Chain Lightning/Lightning Bolt and like magic attacks could be used as Air units bombing runs.
4. The magic spell Visions could reveal entire map.
5. The Spell Anti-Magic could act as Anti-Aircraft against spells such as in #3.
6. The Spell Scuttle Boat could be a lethal sea unit.
7. Magic Arrow/Ice Bolt could also be a bombard type unit.
8. The Spell Cure could work with a Heal in Enemy Territory Sm. Wonder
9. Armageddon spell can act as the Nuclear Weapon
10. Land Mine Spell when researched can autoproduce invisible mines.
11. Similarily, the spell Fire Wall can autoproduce invisible fire wall unit (would have to make a custom graphic)
12. Implosion spell would be a Lethal Land type unit.
13. Earthquake spell could act as a Prec Bombing unit.
14. Summon Elementals could be a Sm. Wonder which autoproduces one of the four Elementals.

These were just my first thoughts, much more can likely be done... It should be interesting to get it going.

Tom

Very, very good ideas!

We are really incorporating every little bit of HOMM3 into C3C, this is turning out really well! So are we going to have city improvs like Mage Guild, marketplace, blacksmith...

Also how about this: For city improvs, the Citadel can act like an aqueduct (and more) and the Castle is a hospital (and more)! What do you think?

-- DFBATTLER
The Idea-Giver.

 

[tom2050]

Here's the link for the spells. I don't think the spell graphics from WH 2.5 are available for download outside of downloading the whole mod.

Ahh, thank you for the link, those will come in handy. I have the WH mod (it is quite a great mod), and will see where that spell graphic can fit in.

We are really incorporating every little bit of HOMM3 into C3C, this is turning out really well! So are we going to have city improvs like Mage Guild, marketplace, blacksmith...

Yes, yes and yes All Mage Guilds will be in, which will provide spells, and will be in the tech tree. Blacksmiths will provide the Ballistas (I don't see a way to have Ammo Carts and First Aid Tents in Civ3; no way to have them give any benefit), so I may have to provide all Civ's the Ballista, any ideas on this would be very helpful.

In HOMM3, the marketplace allowed to trade resources for another resource, so I'm not sure how this could be incorporated in the game (unless it acted as an Air trade route ability with other civs, or perhaps sea trade ??). Same with Resource Silo, with provided a specific resource, don't think this can be done in Civ.

The Halls will act as Marketplaces do normally, providing trade boost and being prerequisite buildings as well. Village Hall, Town Hall, City Hall, and the Capitol (which will probably be a Sm. Wonder).

Most of these are already entered, but I haven't gone through specifying exactly what they do yet.

Also how about this: For city improvs, the Citadel can act like an aqueduct (and more) and the Castle is a hospital (and more)! What do you think?.

That is an excellent idea! Did not think of that... and it makes perfect sense as well.
Right Now here are the benefits of each:
Fort: provides defensive bonus (walls)
Citadel: Gives 50% production bonus and additional defensive bonus (Moat/Arrow Towers); can act as Aqeduct
Castle: Gives 100% production bonus and additional defensive bonus (Upgraded Arrow Towers/Walls); can act as Hospital

Thanks for all the input from everyone, it has been and will continue to be invaluable!

Tom