Worst start position ever?
- Thread starter Greyhawk1
- Start date
My worst start was an island with nothing but tundra and hills. Three things made it worse.
1. I was playing the Double Your Pleasure Mod which meant that I could not settle on the tundra unless there was a forest there.
2. I was playing a no research varient (science slider permanently set at 0% and no running of scientific specialists), which meant no new tech until somebody came sailing by.
3. I was playing an "extra huge" map and for the first time experienced significant computer lag time.
I finally gave in around 400 AD as nobody had gone sailing by and the lag time was intolerable considering that my only activity was pushing "next turn". I would have played it out if it wasn't for the lag time as it would have been a challenge to see how much progress I could make once my primitive civ was discovered.
1. I was playing the Double Your Pleasure Mod which meant that I could not settle on the tundra unless there was a forest there.
2. I was playing a no research varient (science slider permanently set at 0% and no running of scientific specialists), which meant no new tech until somebody came sailing by.
3. I was playing an "extra huge" map and for the first time experienced significant computer lag time.
I finally gave in around 400 AD as nobody had gone sailing by and the lag time was intolerable considering that my only activity was pushing "next turn". I would have played it out if it wasn't for the lag time as it would have been a challenge to see how much progress I could make once my primitive civ was discovered.
general_kill
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2003
- Messages
- 2,870
that map is definitely mod made, I mean so many silk neatly packed and the starting place seems suspicious... so tell me, is it costum made and can I get a copy?
pdescobar
Moo, baby. Moo.
I often saw silks (and ivory as well) neatly packed like that under standard rules. As for the starting position, it actually could be worse. At least there's a luxury and one grassland nearby 
I've had games where I started on a small resourceless island without fresh water; probably a side effect of my cramming as many civs onto a 140x140 map as possible (24 under standard rules, 31 under DyP) It wasn't jungle, but it was bad enough for me to restart; I'm not a masochist
I've had games where I started on a small resourceless island without fresh water; probably a side effect of my cramming as many civs onto a 140x140 map as possible (24 under standard rules, 31 under DyP) It wasn't jungle, but it was bad enough for me to restart; I'm not a masochist 
Hygro
soundcloud.com/hygro/
Greyhawk, had you settled one tile south, you coulda taken advantage of Whales.
Darkness
Shadow creature
Originally posted by cromagnon
I routinely find 4-5 spices or dyes clustered around the AI capitals.And I never use mods.
Clusters of luxury resources are pretty common in maps created by the map generator. In almost every game I play, there's at least one of these near some AI's capitol...
Yeah, I didnt notice them until I settled - dumb of me but hey...
Well, here's the current state of play. I managed to wipe out the Ottomans - just. I gambled on my Immortals being able to prevail and the Ottomans not to be able to field many Horsemen. I had no Horses so I had to rely on foot soldiers.
My Veteran Archers got cut to pieces by their Horsemen and my Immortals were being badly mauled by their Spearmen but I kept up my production due to every tile having a mine in it so I won the attrition battle - it was a close call.
Anyway I'm 4th out of the 8 remaining in the histograph with no chance of getting any better. My measly score is embarrassingly low - 222! I got the Great Library by a fluke but all other wonders have been built by the other civs. I have a Leader I gained in the Ottoman wars so I'll keep him to one side for a rainy day.
The Spanish are on top and they're right next to me and demanding tribute. I'm not too bothered about a war between islands in the Galley era though so I told them to get lost. They are at war with the Greeks right now.
The GL will keep me up to date for a while but I very much doubt I'll get very far in this game.
Here's the map (zoomed)
Good job, you survived that awful start!
As for resource clustering, it happens. In my last game, I got FOUR wheat in my capital
.
And FOUR COWS in my 2nd city.
Don t blame me, computers can t handle "randomness" very well.
Of course, I ve got starts even worse than massed jungle. How about massed deserts, mountains or tundra? Without a single resource in sight?
As for resource clustering, it happens. In my last game, I got FOUR wheat in my capital
.And FOUR COWS in my 2nd city.
Don t blame me, computers can t handle "randomness" very well.
Of course, I ve got starts even worse than massed jungle. How about massed deserts, mountains or tundra? Without a single resource in sight?
That would have made it an even bigger disaster at the start. Moving one tile south to get the whales would have meant that his capital could work a MAXIMUM of 3 land tiles. That means it would only have 4 shield producing tiles until Miniturization. Whales are pretty to look at but would have sabotaged Persepolis to get within the city radius.
@Greyhawk1
You might consider building moving the Palace to Antioch and then after conquering the Spanish or even better the Green (Greeks?) island building the FP there, using the GL you have stored.
Or build the FP in Antioch and then use your GL to move the Palace. The advantage to moving your palace instead of building the FP is that your palace city, ie capital, cannot flip but your FP city can. Of course you lose all the culture the old palace had.
Good Job so far.
JJP
Great Player
Good job Greyhawk1. 
It'll be a while before I can do any decent invading - I'm not going to try with Galleys! But when Caravels or Galleons come along the Koreans are about to taste Persian steel. They have a four city island just to the south of my capital. Prime territory.
As to those who say this map is either a mod or user created I can assure you it aint. This is a computer generated hellhole - not one of my own making.
What use is a vast amount of silks? It looks nice but isnt much good for making happy faces. If I'd have had one of each luxury that would've been better..
I'll finish it this weekend for a laugh. I think I'm going to get my lowest ever score
but what the hell eh?
As to those who say this map is either a mod or user created I can assure you it aint. This is a computer generated hellhole - not one of my own making.
What use is a vast amount of silks? It looks nice but isnt much good for making happy faces. If I'd have had one of each luxury that would've been better..
I'll finish it this weekend for a laugh. I think I'm going to get my lowest ever score
but what the hell eh?
You don't lose all the culture the old palace had. You never lose culture. All you lose by re-building the palace somewhere else is the one extra culture per turn that you get from the 1000-yr bonus.
Just to clarify,
Renata
Just to clarify,
Renata
jack merchant
Internationalist
Greyhawk, you may not know it, but you're actually in an excellent position now, and you've done very well to get there.
I I were you, I'd rush the FP in Antioch ( since this is a large map, this should benefit your entire island), turn off science (you have the Library, right ? So why research ?) to make a good deal more money and switch to Republic. In Republic, use the luxury tax to keep your people happy.
Furthermore, you need some harbours for trade and to grow your coastal cities. Some more workers could come in handy, too.
With an FP and Republic, you'll see your income skyrocket. With the extra income and the surplus of silks to trade, you should easily be able to keep up in tech after the Library expires and buy any tech the others get.
I I were you, I'd rush the FP in Antioch ( since this is a large map, this should benefit your entire island), turn off science (you have the Library, right ? So why research ?) to make a good deal more money and switch to Republic. In Republic, use the luxury tax to keep your people happy.
Furthermore, you need some harbours for trade and to grow your coastal cities. Some more workers could come in handy, too.
With an FP and Republic, you'll see your income skyrocket. With the extra income and the surplus of silks to trade, you should easily be able to keep up in tech after the Library expires and buy any tech the others get.
Ukas
Pthooey of Tomainia
This is a reconstruction of a last game I played before I got PTW(used same map). Not everything (roads, mines etc.) is just the way it was but this is as close as I can get to portray the worst time I had playing that game.
I modded the game but difficulty was about emperor level, only thing is I've somewhat cut down the ai tech trade to 125 and made techs around 30-50% more expensive for all. This way civs trade techs, but not all the time. I had added some extra buildings, units and techs in the game. Starting conditions were normal for all.
I also modded map a bit - just added few small extra islands. There were two great continents, third smaller one and an big island for one civ. The part where my civ was located and the island I later settled were by the generator.
140x140 map w 70% water
16 civs
Phase 1. I noticed there's lot of water around us and suspected if we have born on an island. There are no resources nearby immediately so I walk forward for few turns, get ceremonial burial from a goody hut and then meet a persian warrior. This alarmed me, I decided to build Berlin straight away.
Phase 2. Luckily because of fish I can grow the city to three to build a settler. I find other goody hut persians neglected for some reason near to their capital and get the wheel, hurrah! The situation becomes clear to me - I have enough space for three cities! The Persians (with whom I always have trouble) are my neighbors with all kinds of fancy resources. I soon meet with the Egyptians and the Russkies, latter is kind enough to change two techs.
In a desperate action I attack the persians with an army of five warriors, wipe out one of their cities and almost manage to conquer Persepolis. One warrior still alive I withdraw to just formed Hamburg. I defence it against few attacks until peace is solved rather fast. I establish Leipzig and let workers do their stuff. Hamburg is the place where I have the most military, can you guess why? I don't dare to explore since the Persians are bit touchy about my warriors walking on their soil. I was nervous all the time if Hamburg would join the Persians. The picture is from that time - I considered quitting the game, since it was bit boring and didn't promise anything good.
Phase 3. Map making at last with those wonderful galleys! At the time I was very happy I didn't make the Galley require timber resource. I guess by this time every worthwhile place is already settled on the continent so I send them to explore the high seas. And I find an isolated island, rich with resources, larger than my corner of the previously known world! I immediately send three galleys w. settlers and spearmen I had reserved. The French try to co-conquer the area but I already had enough troops there to get them before they had a chance to build a city - got my first slave workers there. As a result I faced two pathetic landing attempts and some charges against the fort before Hamburg. The cities grew, I build the forbidden palace. The Island was producing the economical etc. support (in my mod trade through sea comes bit earlier) and I concentrated to build forces on the main land.
Phase 4. I slay the Persians in middle ages, conquer big part of the world and by the end of the industrial era my civ was leading. Didn't play it to the end though, got PTW before that and started to mod the game seriously.
I modded the game but difficulty was about emperor level, only thing is I've somewhat cut down the ai tech trade to 125 and made techs around 30-50% more expensive for all. This way civs trade techs, but not all the time. I had added some extra buildings, units and techs in the game. Starting conditions were normal for all.
I also modded map a bit - just added few small extra islands. There were two great continents, third smaller one and an big island for one civ. The part where my civ was located and the island I later settled were by the generator.
140x140 map w 70% water
16 civs
Phase 1. I noticed there's lot of water around us and suspected if we have born on an island. There are no resources nearby immediately so I walk forward for few turns, get ceremonial burial from a goody hut and then meet a persian warrior. This alarmed me, I decided to build Berlin straight away.
Phase 2. Luckily because of fish I can grow the city to three to build a settler. I find other goody hut persians neglected for some reason near to their capital and get the wheel, hurrah! The situation becomes clear to me - I have enough space for three cities! The Persians (with whom I always have trouble) are my neighbors with all kinds of fancy resources. I soon meet with the Egyptians and the Russkies, latter is kind enough to change two techs.
In a desperate action I attack the persians with an army of five warriors, wipe out one of their cities and almost manage to conquer Persepolis. One warrior still alive I withdraw to just formed Hamburg. I defence it against few attacks until peace is solved rather fast. I establish Leipzig and let workers do their stuff. Hamburg is the place where I have the most military, can you guess why? I don't dare to explore since the Persians are bit touchy about my warriors walking on their soil. I was nervous all the time if Hamburg would join the Persians. The picture is from that time - I considered quitting the game, since it was bit boring and didn't promise anything good.
Phase 3. Map making at last with those wonderful galleys! At the time I was very happy I didn't make the Galley require timber resource. I guess by this time every worthwhile place is already settled on the continent so I send them to explore the high seas. And I find an isolated island, rich with resources, larger than my corner of the previously known world! I immediately send three galleys w. settlers and spearmen I had reserved. The French try to co-conquer the area but I already had enough troops there to get them before they had a chance to build a city - got my first slave workers there. As a result I faced two pathetic landing attempts and some charges against the fort before Hamburg. The cities grew, I build the forbidden palace. The Island was producing the economical etc. support (in my mod trade through sea comes bit earlier) and I concentrated to build forces on the main land.
Phase 4. I slay the Persians in middle ages, conquer big part of the world and by the end of the industrial era my civ was leading. Didn't play it to the end though, got PTW before that and started to mod the game seriously.
Attachments
Well I took the advice given here to stop my research - good call. I got three or four techs with the GL but I had my income on 100%. The money I saved there is going towards my current research.
My FP is complete and my entire island is pretty productive now. Been trading Silks with the Spanish for this and that but they on no account will trade techs no matter what I offer them so I've been researching the lesser known techs and using that as a bargaining chit.
I took a risk with a Galley and chanced upon the Aztecs, the first to find them. I traded their comms with everyone for some petty cash and updated maps which was a lucky turn of events.
The Spanish declared war on me out of the blue as I expected. They virtually telegraphed their intent with a flotilla of three Galleys, I moved some Knights down to their landing point and easily repelled the four Horsemen and two Archers they landed (why did they bother??).
The Spanish have been overtaken by the Greeks and the Egyptians. The Egyptians' land is chock full of cows. Their capital is ridiculous, 33 production with no factories or anything! I've just overtaken the Germans in the histograph. Still getting nowhere fast!
Here's my savegame if anyone wants it
(PTW v1.14f)
Persia.sav
My FP is complete and my entire island is pretty productive now. Been trading Silks with the Spanish for this and that but they on no account will trade techs no matter what I offer them so I've been researching the lesser known techs and using that as a bargaining chit.
I took a risk with a Galley and chanced upon the Aztecs, the first to find them. I traded their comms with everyone for some petty cash and updated maps which was a lucky turn of events.
The Spanish declared war on me out of the blue as I expected. They virtually telegraphed their intent with a flotilla of three Galleys, I moved some Knights down to their landing point and easily repelled the four Horsemen and two Archers they landed (why did they bother??).
The Spanish have been overtaken by the Greeks and the Egyptians. The Egyptians' land is chock full of cows. Their capital is ridiculous, 33 production with no factories or anything! I've just overtaken the Germans in the histograph. Still getting nowhere fast!
Here's my savegame if anyone wants it
(PTW v1.14f)Persia.sav
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