Zwi1 - Low Pressure Deity

Got it, will play tomorrow afternoon. Man, I'm impressed.

Scratch that, I've got some tests still to grade, complete turns tomorrow evening (7 Oct.).
 
Preturn - rushed settlers in Tampa * Oakland.

860 AD - WASH b cav, set to cav; SF bm/man, set to m/man; MIA b m/man, set to aquedy=uct; MEM b cav, set to cav; OAK b settler, set to courthouse; TAMPA b settler, set to courthouse.

870 AD - Medicine researched, set to Sanitation; NY b cav, set to courthouse; traded Medicine, silk, wm, & 413 gold to France for Industrialization; traded Medicine, Industrialization, wm, ivory (last one), & 40 gold to India for Nationalism (w/ out our last ivory, would've cost 600+ gold); oncreased lux by 10%.

880 AD - BOST b cav, set to cav; increased research by 10% [3-6-1].

890 AD - WASH b cav, set to fact; StL b mkpl, set to r/man; CLEV b uni, set to cav; PHOE b uni, set to cav.

900 AD - MEM b cav, set to fact; SD b uni, set to cav.

910 AD - BOST b cav, set to fact; SF b r/man, set to fact; DAL b courthouse, set to cav.

920 AD - NY b courthouse, set to fact; S/Fe b wkr, set to wkr; Olympia founded; Hunt Valley (Firaxis hometown?) founded.

930 AD - LA b wkr, set to wkr; ATL b cav, set to cav; CLEV b cav, set to fact; PITT b courthouse, set to cav; ORL b wkr, set to wkr.

940 AD - Sanitation researched, set to Electricity; PHI b uni, set to r/man.

950 AD - BALT b uni, set to r/man; SD b cav, set to courthouse; L/Vegas b wkr, set to wkr; PHOE b cav, set to cav; ALb b wkr, set to wkr.

Observations:

We were able to build two cities just west of the mountins south of Memphis; I didn't trade Sanitation to any civs yet, just because they didn't have much to offer, we still are the only one w/ the knowledge; we're 7 turns from Electricity (heading for ToE), but we're 11 turns from US in pralace prebuild city (but I don't tink we need it); may need to tweak the prebuild to time it for Scientific Method (probably should've held off railroading there); considered giving the Iroquois Nationalism to help defend against the French; w/ the exception of our newest cities, everything ought to be connected by rail.

French techs:
french_tech.jpg


American techs:
american_tech.jpg


american_palace.jpg


Save file.
 
With over 3000g in the treasury, we may be able to research at a deficit to get Scientific Method quicker. Also, we might be able to get by with 0% luxury tax even without ivory, but I'm sure tao can sort that out.
---------------------------------------
tao <- Up Now
gormdragan (out until 9th of October)
Zwingli
KELLO (reconfirm interest)
dojoboy
 
Originally posted by Zwingli
tao <- Up Now
gormdragan (out until 9th of October)
Got it and will play tomorrow the latest (stuck in gotm24).
 
Originally posted by Zwingli
With over 3000g in the treasury, we may be able to research at a deficit to get Scientific Method quicker. Also, we might be able to get by with 0% luxury tax even without ivory, but I'm sure tao can sort that out.

Well, I failed to bump the slider the first turn after trading away the ivory and many cities fell out of wltkd. Net turn, I bumped it, and those cities went back in to wltkd.
 
i'm back
 
I look at the game and see lots of work still to do. ;) Both Olympia and Hunt Valley are abysmally placed missing fish and whale. :( We have 26 cav, don't want to start a war and thus I stop all cav builds. Upgrade 9 muskets to riflemen. Switch NY to hospital and hurry it. Some adjustments to other cities.

Our strategic road network is mostly done. Now our workers need to concentrate on improving key cities. I will also build some more workers in growth-constrained cities.

Increase research to 100% getting electricity in 5 at -106gpt.

Look at trade possibilities: donate Iroquois into Industrial Times and give them nationalism to kick the Frenchmen. :D French do not accept gpt deals from us? I can't recall, what we did to them? Buy wines, economics from France for sanitation, 150g. Wines are good, because our Indian spice deal expires in 4 turns, and we don't want to spend our hard-earned cash on prolongation, but give of the techs we get from ToE. India gives 15gpt, 60g for sanitation. Hit return.

960
Washington b factory s coal plant; disband warrior, hurry coal plant
Boston hurries factory

IBT India and France sign mpp

970
Wash b hospital s Smith's as Hoover pre-build
Boston b factory s coal plant; disband warrior , hurry coal plant

IBT India declares war on Iroqoius
Los Angeles flips to India :(

980
Boston b cp s US
hurry temple in Denver next to LA

990
we loose Indian spice; research down to 80%

1000
electricity; scie meth in 5 at 70% (timed w pre-build),
France has corporation

IBT Bagalore b Shakespeare's
France an Iro sign peace, France declares war on Iro; the joy of mpp

1010 zzz
1020 zzz

1030
renew dyes for gems deal w France; instead of paying 16gpt, we now get 226gpt upfront from Joanie :)

1040 zzz

1050
Science Advisor tells us about discovery of scientific method. We select atomic and ask for the big picture. Switch to cities screen, switch Washington to ToE.
Theory of Evolution completed in Washington. We learn atomic and electronics. After selecting hospital for Washington, we switch thru our cites and change Chicago to Hoover. Hoover Dam completed in Chicago. Boston switched to Smith's.
France gives corporation, 23g, 25gpt for electricity
India gives incense, 25gpt for electricity, silks and 30gpt for corporation.
replaceable parts is due in 7 and with 20% lux a lot of wltpd should start pushing our production.

We made great progress and hope to get Smith's in 3 turns. Once we have rep parts, I suggest to build artillery. With tons of arti, we can beat any French attack. The only "problem" currently is, that the other civs can't pay us enough money for our techs.

The Save.
 
Originally posted by tao
I look at the game and see lots of work still to do. ;) Both Olympia and Hunt Valley are abysmally placed missing fish and whale. :(

Their placement was influenced by Iroquois and Indian settlers w/ in a tile of building cities. If I took another turn for optimal placement, we would've lost the sites.
 
Preturn:
Hire a tax collector in San Franc (no change in production, up by 3gpt + WLTPD)

(1)1060:
Portland makes temple, starts aqua
Oakland makes market, starts court
Tacoma makes worker, starts worker
Hunt Valley makes worker, starts worker

(2)1070:
Washington makes hos, starts rifle
NY makes hos, starts cannon
Memphis makes rifle, starts cannon


(3)1080:
Wash makes rifle, starts rifle
NY makes cannon, starts cannon
Boston makes Smith, starts hos
SF makes hos, starts cannon
Balti makes hos, starts fac
Memphis makes cannon, starts cannon
Cleve makes hos, starts bank
SD makes temple, starts bank
Phoenix makes temple, starts bank

(4)1090:
Wash makes rifle, starts rifle
NY makes cannon, starts cannon
Atlanta makes fac, start hos
SF makes cannon, starts cannon
Memphis makes cannon, start cannon
Rich makes market, starts bank
Minn makes market, starts fac
Pitt makes temple, starts fac

(5)1100:
Wash makes rifle, starts rifle
NY makes cannon, starts cannon
SF makes cannon, starts cannon
Memphis makes cannon, start cannon
Phili makes hos, starts fac
Cinn makes hos starts fac
Dallas makes hos, starts fac

Lower lux to 10%

(6)1110:
Wash makes rifle, starts rifle
NY makes cannon, starts cannon
SF makes cannon, starts cannon
Memphis makes cannon, start cannon
Miami makes rifle, starts fac
Houston makes lib, starts fac
Buf make cat, starts hos
St. L makes lib, starts fac
Detroit makes hos, starts fac
NO makes bank starts fac
Denver makes cannon, starts court (WTLPD in 3)
Cleve makes bank start cannon

Lower research to 50% (RP due in 1)

(7)1120:
RP is discovered, started Refining (due in 7)
We have 1 source of rubber.

Wash makes rifle, starts arti
Seattle makes bank, starts fac
Olympia makes worker, starts worker


(8)1130:
Wash makes arti, starts arti
NY makes arti, starts arti
Boston makes arti, starts arti
SF makes arti, starts arti
Memphis makes arti, starts arti
Cleve makes arti, starts arti

French built WS in Rheims

(9)1140:
Wash makes arti, starts arti
Altanta makes hos, starts arti
Chicago makes fac, starts hos
SD makes bank, starts fact

(10)1150:
Wash makes arti, starts arti
NY makes arti, starts arti
bos makes arti, starts arti
SF makes arti, starts arti
Memphis makes arti, starts arti
Cleve makes arti, starts arti
Phoenix makes bank, start fac
Oak makes court, starts fac

We lost our wine, rene wine+99g for silk

Summary:
Refining in 4
Maps are current
We have 2 cat, 16can, 13 arti.




The Save
 
I see that we also got Smith's. :)

I would upgrade the rifles to infantry.

I would build infantry now where we can't build artillery in one turn, but infantry in two.

In both New York and Atlanta I would build a cathedral to push against Indian culture.

I usually don't build factories in cities lower than 20 raw shields.

Once we traded for communism, building police stations reduces waste and corruption.

Railroading is nice, but in many cases roads, irrigation, or mines are more efficient, e.g. Phoenix.

I think we should start selling tech to France and India to get their money fund our research even more.

What is our strategy? Keep peace and go for SS? Go for domination/conquest and start a war ? With India to get wines, incense and France next? Or ally w India vs. France? Winning the easy way diplomatic?

I don't think that there is any doubt on us winning? :D
 
Originally posted by tao

What is our strategy? Keep peace and go for SS? Go for domination/conquest and start a war ? With India to get wines, incense and France next? Or ally w India vs. France? Winning the easy way diplomatic?

My vote is for SS, but not shying away from conflict if it arises. We can still fight a war along the way. We ough to switch from artillery to bombers once we gain flight.

Question: This is the first time I've experienced deity to this extent. Is it always possible to match or exceed the AI's research rate via development? I realize having only 3 rivals may be a variable in this particluar game.
 
I will have limited internet access for the next 2 weeks but should still be able to play (if you dun see a "got it" posting in 48 hours, you could skip me if you dun want to wait)
 
Originally posted by dojoboy
My vote is for SS, but not shying away from conflict if it arises. We can still fight a war along the way. We ough to switch from artillery to bombers once we gain flight.
The downside is, that it takes a lot of time to finalize a game already in the bag. If we avoid war, diplomatic is much faster and with only 3 civs alive, we need just one vote which is quite easy to get.

Question: This is the first time I've experienced deity to this extent. Is it always possible to match or exceed the AI's research rate via development? I realize having only 3 rivals may be a variable in this particluar game.
I have limited deity experience, but yes: it is definitely possible once you gain the lead via ToE. On deity, you can sell techs for large amount of money speeding your research and crippling the AIs.

This game is special, since there are only 3 AI civs to "milk" and they do not have much money because of their long war.
 
1150 AD (0)
Upgrade 14 rifles to infantry
Upgrade 13 cannon to artillery
Upgrade 2 catapults to artillery
Sell the now useless Scientific Method to France for Espionage + 520g + 89gpt.
Cancel the saltpeter shipments to the doomed Iroquois but buy their worker for 25g.
Turn lux tax down to 0% saving 122gpt and hire a few specialist to keep wltk going in corrupt cities.
Science is raised to 90% and refining is due in 3 turns.

(1)
Washington starts the Intellegence Agency.
The Iroquois lost 3 cities in between turns and are down to a single island city.
Buy Communism from India for Scientific Method + 61gpt + 200g (many cities would benifit from police stations).

(2)
We start a few police stations, and begin building more infantry.
France has completed Refining, and we buy it for 45g.
Sell Refining to India for Free Artistry + WM + 12gpt + 70g.
Steel set as the next target, due in 5 turns.

(3)
India signs peace with the Iroquois.
Rush a settler in Tuson to attempt to grab some former Iroquois land which is open due to all the razing.

(4)
Sign ROP with India and send the settler to claim an ivory resource in former Iroquois territory.

1200 AD (5)
I notice we have no oil at all in our territory. France has 3 connected sources and India has one unconnected source. No oil is close to our border.

(6)
We complete the Intelligence Agency in Washington. I won't risk a spy planting for now, but we have the option as our millitary is strong enough to repell a potential attack.
More cities complete Police stations and become more productive, and workers begin improving all of the mountains.

(7)
We learn Steel. Sell Medicine to OCC Iroquois for 5gpt + 23g while they are still alive.

(8)
Most worked mountains are being improved, and workers are increasingly occupied by pollution cleanup.

(9)
France has learned Replacable Parts, but they have no connected rubber. India has 1 connected rubber and 1 unconnected rubber. France has rubber at their island possesions, but they haven't built a harbor yet.

1250 AD (10)
France destroys the Iroquois.
Combustion is due in 2 turns at -67gpt deficit. (about 1400g in the treasury).
The Save
zwi1_1250ADtact.jpg

Zwingli
KELLO (reconfirm interest)
dojoboy <-- Up now
tao
gormdragan
------------------------
At this point we can go for either Conquest or Space race victory (note that Domination and Diplomatic have been disabled). Until France hooks up or trades for rubber we have a temporary advantage which we could use to make major territorial gains with cavalry, infantry, and artillery. With the oil gained in French territory, we could then attack with tanks to finish off France and India. On the other hand, we have a commanding technological lead, and can win the space race quickly and easilly barring a last minute surprise attack one of the AI. Also, India and France have amassed large armies which will take much time to destroy, so conquest will not be a walkover.

I would vote for conquest since many of our cities have nothing left to build except troops or happiness buildings anyway (and we don't have much of a problem with happiness). We wouldn't necessarilly have to start right away (I don't know how much experience dojoboy has with artillery based offense), but pressing the advantage while France lacks infantry would greatly speed up the process. Probably a failed spy mission or demanding France to leave our territory would be all that is necessary to start war.
 
Originally posted by Zwingli

I would vote for conquest since many of our cities have nothing left to build except troops or happiness buildings anyway (and we don't have much of a problem with happiness). We wouldn't necessarilly have to start right away (I don't know how much experience dojoboy has with artillery based offense), but pressing the advantage while France lacks infantry would greatly speed up the process. Probably a failed spy mission or demanding France to leave our territory would be all that is necessary to start war.

I love artillery. Sieging cities is a personal favorite; however, against the French, it may be best to let them invade first (fortifying our cities that are within 2 tiles of French cavalry), then bombard and pick off Joan's wounded units. Simulataneously, a heavily defended stack of artillery could also move into French territory to reduce France's invasion force. What do we currently have to offer India for an alliance? I'll take a peek at the save in a moment. I'll also look over the terrain, some opptions may be best through Indian territory. But, I'd hate to have a force exposed if India sides w/ France. Are we open to mobilizing the economy? I probably won't get to the game until tomorrow night during the ALCS, so you guys check out the save and offer strategic plans, in case we go this route. I guess the bottom line is how soon do you want to be finished w/ this SG. I'm in no hurry myself.
 
A general plan for conducting a war might be:

Turn 1: Demand that the French leave our territory or fail to plant a spy, they respond by declaring war. Buy an alliance with India against France (probably costing ~500g or 25gpt). Fortify multiple infantry in all cities bordering France and use artillery to bombard French cites in range from our territory.

Turns 2-3:
Hold back on the offensive advance until the French have exhausted their reserve of cavalry. Artillery will be very helpful on defense, so keep it inside our territory for mobility. They may attempt to attack the more weakly defended Indian cities rather than our line of metropoli, but we would want to avoid capturing French cites only to have them recaptured on the same turn.

Turns 4 and on:
Bombard French cities until the defenders are redlined and take the cities with cavalry. Use the new borders to move (heavilly defended) artillery deeper into French territory to repeat the process on more cities.

------------------------

If you decide not to go to war, it might be interesting to see whether the other civs will be able to catch up in technology once they revolt back to democracy. I would expect that well developed Deity cities in democracy might be able to generate enough of a surplus to cut into our tech lead, and perhaps become competitive by the Modern Age.
 
Sorry this has taken so long. Through the first six turns, I've not taken detailed notes on what each city has built, needless to say production is very high. And, we continue to build infantry and artillery while improving other less productive cities. I opted to wait on declaring war on France; however, IBT my 4th & 5th turns, France declared war on India. Thus, I making this quick post to see what options we would like to take. We've got about four deals w/ France currently on the table, two (totally about 70 gpt) are about to end my next turn. India will probaby survive a war w/ France but where would that leave us compared to France. We're 4 turns from Motorized Transportation. On my sixth turn, I traded Steel to India for incense, 181 gpt, 200 gold, & wm. Now, they could end up declaring war on us due to their war w/ France; defaulting the payments. Oh, do we want to build Battlefield Medicine?

Comments?
 
I prefer not to break any deals. On the other hand, we need oil. Can't we get the source near Oka? By settling on the hill?
If you can make France declare war on us, we should "survive" some turns picking up French cavalry w our artillery, but afterwards we want to start being offensive w tanks.
 
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