Russia continues to deliberately target civilians.


Not one, not two, but three missiles. On civilians.
Your source doesn't say anything about "deliberate targeting civilians".
As far as I know, the hotel in Chernigov which was destroyed by three cruise missiles, was used for troops stationing.
If you think for a bit, the only reason to spend three missiles on a single building is if you believe it is important target.
 
Rishi Sunak promises UK’s largest ever military support package for Ukraine

I wonder what the 'boats' are. Amphibious landing crafts?

So do I.

The UK closed down its ship building industry several decades ago.

I'd guess:

(a) his father-in law may be sourcing them from India.
OR
(b) perhaps they are the inflatable dingbies abandoned on the South
Coast by African, and other migrants, after crossing from France.
 
Easy question to answer, they threw in a ton of support for Israel as well - settled some of the hardliners.

I wish Ukraine's support didn't come at the expense of advancing imperialistic projects elsewhere, but you can't win them all. The focus here is on Ukraine after all.

As I understand it, a large portion (~1/3) of the "package for Ukraine" is to replenish the US army and raising production of missiles/shells for its own usage.
 
Finland Shifts Policy To Counter Moscow
BY THOMAS GROVE
ONTTOLA, Finland—Armed Finnish border guards on cross-country skis patrol the country’s eastern flank, NATO’s newest and longest border with its main adversary, Russia. Helicopters and drones buzz overhead along new fences being constructed— 13 feet high in places—with barbed wire on top and 24-hour electronic surveillance. The new measures are meant to protect Finland from increasingly aggressive Russian operations. Those have included waves of migrants, which Helsinki says have been sent by Moscow to overwhelm the country’s remote borders in recent months.

Finland believes the influx of migrants, which has continued even after it closed its border to Russia late last year, is part of the hybrid warfare Moscow is deploying to intimidate and test Finland’s security services after the Nordic country’s decision to join the North Atlantic Treaty Organization last April. Since then, Russia has promised to re-establish Soviet military districts along the border. Some Finns also believe Moscow was behind the mysterious severing of a gas pipeline and a telecommunications cable in the Baltic Sea in October. And Finland is fending off cyberattacks and disinformation it says are being cooked up by Russia. “We have thought about peacetime and wartime as separate for decades,” said Jarno Limnell, a Finnish parliamentarian who has long warned about Russia’s threat to Finland. “The edges of those concepts are slowly be --coming blurred with shades of gray between peace and war. This is the new normal in living with Russia.”

Finland, which has an 830mile border with Russia, has for decades struck a delicate balance in its relations with its much larger neighbor. It has studiously avoided policies or actions that Russia could deem threatening, but has also prevented Moscow from getting too close. But with its accession to NATO, Finland has radically revised its Russia policy, re --framing Moscow as its main adversary. Since Russia’s invasion of Ukraine in early 2022, Finland has ramped up its military spending, boosting its defense budget to above 2% and snap --ping up U.S. rocket sys --tems, as well as Israeli anti --tank and air-defense systems. The country is preparing to base F-35 jet fighters it will receive from the U.S. just over 100 miles from its border with Russia.

The shift in its Russia pol --icy was further illustrated in March when President Sauli Niinisto stepped down after two six-year terms. New Presi --dent Alexander Stubb has sig --naled openness to removing a longstanding Finnish prohibition on transporting nuclear weapons over its territory, as the country fully embraces new NATO membership and
its nuclear deterrent.
“Now we have a hostile relationship with Russia, and that is a big risk, maybe not in the short term but in the long run,” said Heikki Talvitie, a longtime diplomat who served as ambassador to Moscow at the time of the fall of the Soviet Union and was awarded an Order of Friendship medal by Russian President Vladimir Putin in 2014. “Things have changed now, it’s existential.”

[IMG alt="image"]https://wsj-bcdn.newsmemory.com/eeb...,1220-0 &medDpi=199&pageW=203&pageH=354[/IMG]

Finland has an 830-mile border with Russia. JUUSO WESTERLUND/ INSTITUTE FOR THE WALL STREET JOURNAL
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Ukraine is using human shields is the obvious counter-argument here.

Moderator Action: Any evidence to support this or are you just being hypothetical? Birdjaguar

 
What was targeted there then ?
 

But this time was worse than usual, because, when rescue workers arrived at the scene, there was a second strike. Three of them were killed.

The following Friday, it happened again when Russian missiles hit Zaporizhzhia, a major city in Ukraine's southeast.

Rescuers and journalists rushed to the scene, and then two more missiles hit.


In total, four people were killed and more than 20 were wounded, including two local journalists.

Both the Kharkiv and the Zaporizhzhia attacks employed a technique called "double-tap" - when an initial air strike is followed by a second attack, killing rescuers trying to help the injured.

An Ukrainian "weapon system"

1713936583074.png


And one of its operator

1713936866063.png


There is a limited supply of first responders such as medics, emergency personnel and fire crews and they are difficult to replace.

"If you take them out by the second attack on the same spot, at exactly the time when they've congregated to help the victims of the first attack, you're actually achieving quite a lot."

Karolina Hird, an analyst at the US-based Institute for the Study of War, says double-tap attacks targeting rescue workers could, and likely do, constitute a war crime.
 
Photos from Chernihiv released by the Ukrainian Ministry of Emergency Situations show a man on a stretcher in a tactical uniform and two-tier metal beds in the windows. According to official data, the hotel was closed in '22.
 
Read somewhere these are mig-29s which are not flyable anymore and haven't moved in years. Confirmed by old satellite photo. At least the last ones.
Did you saw video? An old aircraft with rockets, maintenance devices and refuelled?
As for Tu - Ukrainian propaganda might as well credit the B1-B that crashed in January.
As well as a dozen SU-34s allegedly shot down a month ago. With evidence of burning grass as a pruf of the shootdown. (and the audio from this old video was removed, as the voiceover in the video is talking about burning grass).
 
No, but you are free to post it here...

I was talking about two previous claimed ones.
 
No, but you are free to post it here...

I was talking about two previous claimed ones.
48°21'33.4"N 35°04'46.7"E the coordinates of where the MIGs were parked


MIG-29 - short ranged fighter, so you need put it close to frontline. Ukraine use it as bomber with guided french bombs (as fighter you need fly high and will be shotdown quick)
Beside, no one will defend maquette with S-300
 
Last edited:
No, but you are free to post it here...

I was talking about two previous claimed ones.
AFAIK there were 3 Mig-29 on that base, one (or two) was/were active, and one (or two) was/were for spare.

I don't think the number is important, the point was that the base was hit, one can hope it was because of a lack of air defense missiles and that those stocks will be replenished when the F-16 will be in Ukraine.

edit: the other worrying point being that recon drone 100km behind the front.
 
Last edited:
Kharkov TV tower was destroyed by missile strike.


According to Russia's claims, it was used for military purposes.

 
Well in war everything is used for “military purposes”, oil refinery in Smolensk, also..


Edit, Same story in English here,

 
Last edited:
Ukraine is using human shields is the obvious counter-argument here.
Doesn't seem like a counter-argument. Seems like a lose-lose.

There's also something to be said about the disparity in a fighting force defending its own land from a foreign aggressor that we like to raise in different contexts - in favour of the defender.
 
Those who try to make an argument in this thread that "Ukraine uses civilians as shields" are either vile contrarian freaks or lack basic knowledge on how defensive warfare in a country under constant missile shelling is conducted.
In the real world of Ukraine's reality, any infrastructure asset available can and will be used for the purpose of defending the country. Because today in 2024 I'm not even sure if there are any dedicated military infrastructure objects left intact in Ukraine. Constructing new assets is rarely viable due to resource constrains and often futility of the effort as there will be a missile or Iranian drone attack at the spot as soon as it becomes visible via a satellite or a recon drone.
And I'm not claiming here that the Chernihiv missile strike was aimed at some sort of military target. I don't know. Firstly, the only proof the Russian propaganda has so far managed to produce was a single photo of someone's legs visible on a stretcher that could be military outfit.
Secondly, as I've been saying here before, there are no valid military targets for the aggressor state here. In a defending country, its soldiers are yesterday's farmers, IT workers, bartenders etc. They've only become military men and women because their country is getting invaded by a fascist state.
Those who push the "valid military targets in Ukraine" argument either completely lost their moral compass in idealistic technicalities or being purposefully disingenuous for the sake of implanting a false equivalence narrative.
 
Last edited:
And the explicit war aim of the Russian army is the Ukrainian citizenry, there are no "military objectives" in this war, Amnesty International is a bit behind the times.

The stated goal is the subjugation of the Ukrainian citizens, and the destruction of their govenment.

Nothing else.
 
Last edited:
perhaps that is simply the nature of war, after all.
 
Top Bottom