3UC/4UC for VP: Project Coordination Thread

[Hinin]

Alternative proposal: Have the corsair spawn a barbarian corsair (maybe two) when it plunders a trade route. That way you can get the ability to harass the opponent with barbarians without having to sacrifice your own units to do so.

Good idea. The only downside is that the spawned barbarians will attack your Corsair immediatly after, so the first victim will be you anyway.
In the end, would you be more in favor of removing the capability for the Chinese UM2 to freely enter rival territory by adopting the method suggested by pineappledan (increased influence gain in non-ally CS territory) or in favor of removing the malus from the Corsair ? I think one of the two must be changed.
Idea : Did you look at the Greek UA ? I think one of the hidden bonus of it is that all Greek units can enter CS territory without being considered tresspassing.

They weren't laborers, so allowing them to build improvements wouldn't be accurate.

Maybe, but like for the Chasqui (I have bad souvenirs about this unit now... your responses weren't that friendly...), I think giving a worker action could make the unit more unique in a certain way : for the Chasqui, I still think the ability to quickly build roads would be a good thing and, as you said, not very difficult to code (what is your opinion about this, @adan_eslavo, @Blue Ghost ?) ; for the Sofa, giving them the ability to only repair improvements in order to make a conquered city quickly up and running or to repair fortifications wouldn't be the most accurate thing, but, once again, it would make the unit the "always busy" type.

The Farari (mandekalu cavalry), being nobility, were expected to finance and maintain their own weapons and armor. Sofa were purchased and outfitted by the state. I don't know how you reflect this difference in-game, but I don't think simply reducing maintenance would do the trick. If anything, their maintenance should be GREATER than your cavalry.

I agree with you on that one. I was simply some idea I had, but I knew it was in direct contradiction with historical facts...

The two units would play extremely differently. Since your cavalry don't have penalties vs cities they form the melee core, while the sofas accompany the GG and siege weapons.

I agree with you on this one.

Qadi (Courthouse)

I like that one better : it reflects how Songhai became a center of Islamic knowledge in Africa (one of the reasons I wanted a University replacement some time ago) and has an original interaction with religion that can be even more beneficial when you haven't founded your own (something we could only find in the vanilla Indonesia UB).

 

[adan_eslavo]

• I managed to make workers not build quarry over marble source but there was one situation where AI went stupid:
  • h-m-s where h is hill, m is marble and s is stone. In such situation AI build MC on hill and stone source to maximize number of MCs, but then tried to connnect marble luxury which is priority for them and they went craze every time they stepped in and it turned out that they can't. So I finally deleted Marble from Monolithic Church.
• I deleted all beliefs changes from Latifundia:
  • Rhiannon gets yields only from basic improvements (there are no UI on the list),
  • Oral tradition would be to powerful for Rome.
• SPAD will get "Air Range" promotion (+2 Range)
• I made few updates to the main post. Read it please and tell me if it everything ok.
• Legion's unique promotion with faster working speed is probably undoable. Worker speed is programmed int o policies and I found only one function Unit:WorkRate which has no place for value change. I suggest modifying this ability or resigning from it. Unless someone has idea how to code that.

 

[David de Vasconcelos]

• I managed to make workers not build quarry over marble source but there was one situation where AI went stupid:
  • h-m-s where h is hill, m is marble and s is stone. In such situation AI build MC on hill and stone source to maximize number of MCs, but then tried to connnect marble luxury which is priority for them and they went craze every time they stepped in and it turned out that they can't. So I finally deleted Marble from Monolithic Church.
• I deleted all beliefs changes from Latifundia:
  • Rhiannon gets yields only from basic improvements (there are no UI on the list),
  • Oral tradition would be to powerful for Rome.
• SPAD will get "Air Range" promotion (+2 Range)
• I made few updates to the main post. Read it please and tell me if it everything ok.
• Legion's unique promotion with faster working speed is probably undoable. Worker speed is programmed int o policies and I found only one function Unit:WorkRate which has no place for value change. I suggest modifying this ability or resigning from it. Unless someone has idea how to code that.

I thought it was possible to decrease the speed of work, since the great pyramid does this only permanently. Is it possible to do that by adjusting the Legion to work with if it were at a lower game speed? If the speed of the game is epic, the Legion next to the general makes improvements as if it were at normal speed.

The shift to 1 from production to adjacent farms makes practically a mine, if it is built on hills with rivers.

About Latifundium, stealing foreign land will change opinion of the neighbor, as it happens in a citadel? I think it would be interesting.

 

[adan_eslavo]

@David de Vasconcelos I checked that in both: Pyramid and Policy there is column in table WorkerSpeedModifier and it equals 25(%). There's no such column in Unit_Promotions table. If I could put value to Units table it wouldn't work either, bacause it would be applied to all units not only that one affected by GG. The same problem applies to your idea with GameSpeed modifier.

 

[David de Vasconcelos]

@David de Vasconcelos I checked that in both: Pyramid and Policy there is column in table WorkerSpeedModifier and it equals 25(%). There's no such column in Unit_Promotions table. If I could put value to Units table it wouldn't work either, bacause it would be applied to all units not only that one affected by GG. The same problem applies to your idea with GameSpeed modifier.

@dan_eslavo And about the prisoner of war promotion, it is not possible to make a promotion like this that reduces the working time instead of increasing?

 

[Hinin]

Legion's unique promotion with faster working speed is probably undoable. Worker speed is programmed int o policies and I found only one function Unit:WorkRate which has no place for value change. I suggest modifying this ability or resigning from it. Unless someone has idea how to code that.

The Legion is already very powerful as it is (and even more with the new version of "Pilum" which stays on upgrade). I'm not against the idea of not giving it the "Praefectus Castrorum" promotion.

I deleted all beliefs changes from Latifundia:

The description you give can be ambigous : can the latifundia be built on all luxury resource tiles, or only on the ones a Plantation could be built on (in addition to bonus plantation resources) ?

 

[adan_eslavo]

Right. Only plantation ones. It is coded that way.

@David de Vasconcelos Great! I forgot that latest update added that promotion and it is now available in the promotions table. It modifies that attribute so I think it will be possible to code that very easily along with ballista's promotion.
After Latifundia coding and checking my head almost exploded. Thank you for help.

 

[David de Vasconcelos]

@adan_eslavo Glad to have helped you. About the Latifundium, now that it is a substitute for planting, do not allow a pantheon that benefits the latifundium like it would with the plantations feels like wrong for me, now the player will not be able to choose a specific pantheon. And are monopolies with Latifundium working properly?

 

[pineappledan]

for the Sofa, giving them the ability to only repair improvements in order to make a conquered city quickly up and running or to repair fortifications wouldn't be the most accurate thing, but, once again, it would make the unit the "always busy" type

Having 2 UCs at the same time would make it more imperative that the unit’s keep moving, and capitalize on their power spike.
I’m softening on the repairing of pillaged tiles. Maybe even allow them to build pastures. I don’t think either of these abilities would be in line with their playstyle though.

not allowing a pantheon to benefit plantations to wrong for me

the latifundium gives a plantation resource when it is built. Making latifundia give pantheons would double the yields from goddess of springtime, once the figs are planted. There would now be a 10 turn delay on the effects of GoSt, but you would get fig resources off of wheat as well, so you could potentially have even higher yields in the end

And about the prisoner of war promotion, it is not possible to make a promotion like this that reduces the working time instead of increasing?

It’s funny that Gazebo gave us the tools to do this part AFTER we proposed it ourselves.
I believe the promotions can be done entirely in sql, with the table additions G made. There’s a new table for giving promotions if unit is X tiles away from Y unit.

-- Combat Modifier for determined range near a defined UnitClass
ALTER TABLE UnitPromotions ADD CombatBonusFromNearbyUnitClass INTEGER DEFAULT -1;
ALTER TABLE UnitPromotions ADD NearbyUnitClassBonusRange INTEGER DEFAULT 0;
ALTER TABLE UnitPromotions ADD NearbyUnitClassBonus

 

[adan_eslavo]

Ok. For now I was using Goedendag code after modification, but this should be really easier method. Where is it possible to define unit class for this? "RequiredUnit" column?

 

[pineappledan]

On mobile. I can’t find it for you today. It is in the TableAdditions.xml file I believe

 

[adan_eslavo]

It would be good but we need to restrict promotion for ballist and its upgrades, legion or land units (goedendag) and this cannot be done with this simple table. Even if it would work. I almost finished roman promotions and goedendag works so I probably pass reworking this.

 

[climat]

The Carthage dll doesn't support 43 Civs. I should wait.. Endless tourism and military supply are tempting, though.

 

[pineappledan]

@adan_eslavo i just looked through your updates for the next patch. Everything looks good as far as I can tell.

Re agora, I’m not what the faith is there for. The Arab bazaar already gives Faith, so I think it should be dropped for either more culture or 2 production. I don’t think Agora should boost wine, but If agora is going to boost wine a small amount, I would also have it boost olives.

I still am against more than 30 hp for the renewal cycle on Holkan...

50XP is a lot of XP for k’atun Ahaw, but it’s over 80 turns, so why not? . I would have started with 5/10/10/15, but If people complain then we can just go back and tweak

@Blue Ghost i noticed University of Coimbra and schutzstanden icon art has not yet been updated. They are bundled in this post. Perhaps you are waiting for Inca and Germany to be done and to change all the icons at once though?
Exam hall on China still does not appear on the civ select screen. I haven’t tried a game with China to verify if it is working

 

[Blue Ghost]

@Blue Ghost i noticed University of Coimbra and schutzstanden icon art has not yet been updated. They are bundled in this post. Perhaps you are waiting for Inca and Germany to be done and to change all the icons at once though?

I don't see them in the attachment. Are you sure they're there?

If we're removing the barbarian conversion from the Corsair, should we keep the border bypassing? I'm slightly concerned that being able to pillage and spawn barbarians with impunity might be too disruptive.

 

[Blue Ghost]

Released v0.5 with pineappledan's Carthage and Venice included. For the sake of a quick release, I haven't yet made any of the proposed changes to the existing civs. Those will come in the next release, along with Germany and Japan.

 

[Hinin]

Released v0.5 with pineappledan's Carthage and Venice included. For the sake of a quick release, I haven't yet made any of the proposed changes to the existing civs. Those will come in the next release, along with Germany and Japan.

Does your v0.5 include the CvGameCore_Expansion2.dll file posted by pineappledan which allows the Sophet to not break the game through endless historic events/military supply ? If not, is it possible to include it ?

 

[pineappledan]

I don't see them in the attachment. Are you sure they're there?

You might not have the most recent version of the art assets downloaded (last update: Dec 17). The most recent updates are bolded in blue. There is an icon sheet which has 4 icons:
Austrian Schutzenstand
Portuguese University of Coimbra
Incan Tambo
Order (the current order icon will be used for the German teutonic order
I also added the art assets for slaganz, so if you don’t have the 4 icons above you wouldn’t have that either.

If we're removing the barbarian conversion from the Corsair, should we keep the border bypassing? I'm slightly concerned that being able to pillage and spawn barbarians with impunity might be too disruptive.

I would pick one or the other. Personally, I would do the converts on disbanding option. If you keep the enemy territory thing on XiaGua then the two will be more unique. I also think it sounds cooler, and makes more 'historical sense'

EDIT: I can confirm that the updated .dll is not in there. That's fine, you can just download it separately or hold off on adding carthage to games until it's in the base VP.

 

[Jarula]

What will orders icon be?

 

[pineappledan]

The castle of the grandmaster of the knights of Rhodes