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Tomatekh's Kyivan Rus' (Yaroslav the Wise) for VP

I think I checked the DLL for this recently and it was the case that this switch is what causes the connections.
 
Have you been thinking what to replace river's bonus with as it is gonna become universal ability pretty soon with an update.
 
:trade: Trade Routes with :c5citystate: City-States generate +1 :c5influence: Influence per turn per each owned :trade: City-State Trade Route (up to +5).
Gain 15% of :c5gold: Gold from diplomatic deals with other Civilizations as :c5greatperson: Great Merchant points, :c5culture: Culture and :c5science: Science.
:trade: Land Trade Routes gain +50% Range.
The bolded part is probably the bit that is not very unique. I know it's on the original civ but we've kinda stolen this effect for Statecraft (and Freedom has it too I think?)
In Traits there is TradeRoutesPerXOwnedCities. This effect is sort of already on the Veche Hall, although (a) perhaps the Veche Hall does a bit too much? and (b) you could have it kick in earlier than Chancery to get some bonus early (15% gold -> yields is awesome but presumably you get very little when trades are only worth like 4 gold due to rounding and so forth)
In Traits there is TradeRoutesPerXOwnedVassals. Cool effect but probably doesn't make historical sense.
There is also Trait_YieldChangesIncomingTradeRoute which is currently unused. Could gain additional culture and science for receiving routes (I assume that's what it does)
Finally you have thing like Trait_SpecialistYieldChanges and Trait_ImprovementYieldChanges, you could consider culture on merchants, gold on villages, etc.

Unrelated point. The Sich UB has so much text. That's 5 additional things it does!!
+1 :c5greatperson: GG point by Major Civilization with which you are at war
All religious building (build by Faith) in the city +1 :c5science: Science

I would get rid of these things.
 
Hi Hokath,

Thanks to your return, do you play it or is it just a design analysis?
The bolded part is probably the bit that is not very unique. I know it's on the original civ but we've kinda stolen this effect for Statecraft (and Freedom has it too I think?)
It's funny how everyone perceives originality. If I adapted this civ it's precisely because I found it really original and fun to play. Many features take up policy mechanisms and vice versa, but this one is really unique, at least I think.
I must also say that I hate the micromanagement of emissaries, diplomats and other envoys to gain points of influence on cities. All civs that use more global influence effects suit me well, this is the case with this one.
In fact the only part of the UA that doesn't really suit me is the second. It is too weak at the start, can eventually become too strong on large maps but above all, it is too player oriented against the AI. The power only takes into account the positive balance of gold per turn, the player can therefore favor direct gold purchases and gold sales per turn. I am therefore looking for a similar but more balanced yield mechanism.
Unrelated point. The Sich UB has so much text. That's 5 additional things it does!!

I would get rid of these things.
Maybe it's a bit busy, it's a compilation of a lot of ideas from Jarcast and myself :lol: but removing it would greatly weaken the civ (especially GG's points) and after many games with or against, I can say that it is far from OP.

For the veche Hall, I could remove this part:
Land and Sea :trade: Trade Routes gain +25% Range
redundant with the new part of UA
 
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I play with them fairly often. I think it is my favourite Tomatekh civ, perhaps it is the best modded civ for BNW, I'm not sure :D
I agree the civ is not OP, I think it actually pretty good balance based on where I think a civ should be.

I would still encourage you to trim the Sich. Perhaps you can increase the culture from allies to +2. Or, because great general points are a valid yield, you could even make it like +1 culture/+1 great general point per ally. If you want to keep the +science, I would just give the building +2 science; the extra complexity has no significant payoff for the space it takes up. If it were something like +5 science per faith building then sure -- but of course the AI doesn't know about this either.

Edit: Yes I would remove that part from the Veche Hall about trade route length now you have it in the UA. I don't know what a good number is, maybe you can bump it to 66% even.

But on the main point of the UA influence effect, for me, if I have this Veche Hall and Sich UBs then already: I am going Statecraft and I am sending trade routes to city states. The part of the UA doesn't really impact the way I play, it is the fact the kit is diplomacy oriented overall. The UA makes it better but it doesn't make me want to do anything new. That's the part of the civ I find underwhelming as a VP civ.

Another idea that came to me. In my Devotion ideology I have a tenet that gives Great Merchant trade mission +influence boost.
You could do the same thing but the other way around: I.e. Great Diplomat mission gives gold. You could even give this to all diplomatic units.
Of course you just said you don't like using diplomatic units ;) but you do have +25% (up from 10%) :c5production: on the Veche so it does make sense!
Edit: another way to replace the part of the UA you don't like would be to have gold->yield on purchase conversion, like how bank does gold->science. I must say I do like that part myself but you make good points about its shortcomings.

Sorry for wall of text, I have drunk a coffee in record time.
 
Sorry for wall of text, I have drunk a coffee in record time.
:lol: no problem.
If you want to keep the +science, I would just give the building +2 science; the extra complexity has no significant payoff for the space it takes up. If it were something like +5 science per faith building then sure -- but of course the AI doesn't know about this either.
I wanted to image this part of the history of the Sich and give a Science boost.
"The administration of the Sich provided Orthodox churches and schools for the religious and secular education of children. "

The Veche gives +2 science, that's a bit of a repeat to also give +2 Science.
Or, because great general points are a valid yield, you could even make it like +1 culture/+1 great general point per ally.
This was our first idea with Jarcast but it's really too many points. And I also like the fact that you only do point if you're at war.
Edit: Yes I would remove that part from the Veche Hall about trade route length now you have it in the UA. I don't know what a good number is, maybe you can bump it to 66% even.
I need to play around a bit with the new design and the new VP to see what works best.
But on the main point of the UA influence effect, for me, if I have this Veche Hall and Sich UBs then already: I am going Statecraft and I am sending trade routes to city states. The part of the UA doesn't really impact the way I play, it is the fact the kit is diplomacy oriented overall. The UA makes it better but it doesn't make me want to do anything new. That's the part of the civ I find underwhelming as a VP civ.
I agree that it does not change the resolutely Diplomatic orientation of the mod but it allows you to start taking control of neighboring CS much more quickly. it also guides the choice of tech to be able to quickly have 2 commercial routes, the number necessary to start gaining influence.
Another idea that came to me. In my Devotion ideology I have a tenet that gives Great Merchant trade mission +influence boost.
You could do the same thing but the other way around: I.e. Great Diplomat mission gives gold. You could even give this to all diplomatic units.
I'm not opposed in principle, believe me. But it would take a really attractive new engine for me to lose the fun on this one.
Your idea is interesting, there may be some digging to do. Something like: all diplomatic units generate gold and GMerchant points when they gain influence on a CS.
another way to replace the part of the UA you don't like would be to have gold->yield on purchase conversion, like how bank does gold->science. I must say I do like that part myself but you make good points about its shortcomings.
Jarcat's idea is very good all the same and original, if we change, it would be to stay quite close all the same. I might be thinking of using the absolute value of gold per turn (exchanges in both directions contribute to the development of Kyivan) and of course lowering the yield which would then become too high. This way, there is no need to “tinker” during exchanges to have the most positive gold balance per turn possible.

Finally, it could make an UA of this type:

Diplomatic missions generate :c5gold: Gold and :c5greatperson: Great Merchant points in addition to gaining :c5influence: Influence.
Gain 10% of :c5gold: Gold from diplomatic deals* with other Civilizations as :c5greatperson: Great Diplomat points, :c5culture: Culture and :c5science: Science.
:trade: Land Trade Routes gain +50% Range.

*considering gold per turn in absolute value
 
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