(8-14a) Redcoats and Other 4UC English Marvels

[ma_kuh]

Doesn't need to be all Civilians, just give it to Diplomats, Archaeologists, and maybe missionaries (but there's nothing else explicitly faith-driven in the kit, so I'd be fine without that one).

As funny as it might be to cut through enemy borders to plant a new city, I think basically every other civilian (workers, settlers, work boats) has no need for either vision or border-ignore.

 

[pineappledan]

Or just drop entirely, because allowing civilian units to have enough vision that they could legitimately perform a tactical role is not something I’m interested in exploring to any extent. At a certain level, diplo units have 1 base vision, 5 moves, and ignore terrain costs. Giving them +2 vision will give them a viable spot in your army as recon units that can stack under your military units, travel 3 tiles out from your main force and back again, giving vision over a massive area.

If you give civilian units vision then it can be used for scouting. If you don't want civilian units used this way then don't give a bonus specifically designed for that purpose.

 

[Rekk]

it is on Hinin's original implementation

Please link to his implementations.

 

[Recursive]

Or just drop entirely, because allowing civilian units to have enough vision that they could legitimately perform a tactical role is not something I’m interested in exploring to any extent. At a certain level, diplo units have 1 base vision, 5 moves, and ignore terrain costs. Giving them +2 vision will give them a viable spot in your army as recon units that can stack under your military units, travel 3 tiles out from your main force and back again, giving vision over a massive area.

If you give civilian units vision then it can be used for scouting. If you don't want civilian units used this way then don't give a bonus specifically designed for that purpose.

I have to agree with this, because the Tactical AI would not know how to do this, will not be programmed to do this in the foreseeable future, and it gives humans an unfair advantage.

 

[hokath]

diplo units have 1 base vision, 5 moves, and ignore terrain costs

Hmm yes the ignore terrain cost part there is problematic.

it gives humans an unfair advantage

Please link to his implementations.

Hinin's Tweaks for VP

Hinin's Tweaks for VP Download here Hello everyone, :devil: Here is the thread where I'll post my personal tweaks for VP. It is intended to grow with time, including more civ reworks, late-game rebalancing and other things. Full credit is due to the original authors of the parts used for...

forums.civfanatics.com

Note it isn't up to date. See link in OP.

Edited OP to
(a) remove vision
(b) specify the units that get ignore borders
(c) reduced ignore terrain cost to ignore terrain cost in hills on Redcoat (too strong)

 

[Civ459]

The revised "Diplomatic Units and Archaeologists ignore rival borders" is too weak and not particularly unique. How about focusing specifically on Diplomatic Units, with "ignore rival borders" and "gain +5 spy points per use (not scaled)"?
This addition of spy points could revitalize England's espionage capabilities and increase policy diversity.

 

[azum4roll]

gain +5 spy points per use (not scaled)

The strategy becomes dumping all diplo units into the closest CS and use all the gained spies to rig other CS elections.

 

[hokath]

gain +5 spy points per use (not scaled)

Spy points don't currently work anything like this so it requires a lot of work to do.
I do want to work work on the spy system more generally but I need Axatin's help

 

[Cebrudras]

Missionaries and diplomats abusing their positions for spy stuff feels too common to be a UA for me.

 

[hokath]

That's not the point of it. The point is you can take people's artifacts with closed borders, and go directly to City-States that are otherwise blocked off (especially good early on).
The real strength of this UA though is that it now actually has a + bonus

 

[Cebrudras]

That's not the point of it. The point is you can take people's artifacts with closed borders, and go directly to City-States that are otherwise blocked off (especially good early on).
The real strength of this UA though is that it now actually has a + bonus

Sorry, I was talking about the idea above to tie spy points to civilians instead, not your actual proposal.

 

[pineappledan]

You could consider the English ability a test lab for a potential general mechanic then.

If it works well with England, and people like it enough that we think everyone should have it, then we can give all diplo actions a spy bonus. Just like the Songhai connection bonus.

 

[pineappledan]

gain +5 spy points per use (not scaled)

For clarification, we’re talking about Spy points, not Network points? So you get an entire new spy every 20 diplo actions? That sounds busted; I thought we were talking about network points.

 

[azum4roll]

The real strength of this UA though is that it now actually has a + bonus

Movement bonus > CS bonus anyway. Especially true for naval.

 

[azum4roll]

For clarification, we’re talking about Spy points, not Network points? So you get an entire new spy every 20 diplo actions? That sounds busted; I thought we were talking about network points.

No, you gain a spy every 12.5 diplo actions in standard size.

 

[hokath]

Updated OP with Azum's Steam Mill changes. I think there will probably be one more to do with the Great Engineer points since the table seems to be working no as intended. Stay tuned.

 

[pineappledan]

No change to your proposal (or mine) required since the bug with steam mill doesn’t affect our desire to have the UB work as described.

 

[hokath]

MAGI: Same DLL bug thing as the base, then it needs a clamp on the number of tiles considered for the promotion (does not affect base game) -- or you could implement a completely new column in UnitPromotions

 

[axatin]

I can fix the bug and implement the promotion.

 

[hokath]

@axatin not that you need the link but I had it on my notepad

https://github.com/LoneGazebo/Community-Patch-DLL/blob/7256adcab209d794bf9f27104e40e1eb6c183cff/CvGameCoreDLL_Expansion2/CvUnit.cpp#L16292