A proposal for deputy governors

[donsig]

Given our recurring problems with absentee governors I am formally proposing that we create the office of deputy governor for each province. Even though we have a new mechanism in place for removing MIA governors this new standard requires a governor to be absent for a week before action is taken. In the week two or three turn chats could take place while the province goes ungoverned. If each province had a deputy governor the chances of a province going unattended are reduced significantly. Having deputy governors would also allow for prompt governing when a governor goes on vacation or experiences internet connection problems - as currently experienced by the governor of Istar. (That's me . )

These are the changes I see as needed to the CoL and CoS is we decide to adopt deputy governors.

Please discuss this idea and these specific changes. (Changes are in bold. Deletions are italized.)

It is my hope that if accepted this proposal will be in place by election time so deputy governors can take office in term 5.

Code of Laws

SECTION D THE LEGISLATIVE BRANCH

Point 1) The Senate (Governors)

B) Governors do not have Deputies but may appoint an Acting Governor when unable to fulfill their duties. The Acting Governor has all powers and responsibilities of the Governor but is a temporary position and must surrender their acting status upon the request of the governor.


B) Each province will have a deputy governor. The deputy governor assumes all powers and responsibilities of the governor during the absence of the governor.

Code of Standards

SECTION G ELECTIONS

Point 6) Eligibility

A) Current officials are eligible to run for President.

(1) Officials include the Presidency, Vice Presidency,
Department Leaders, Department Deputies, Judiciary
and Provincial Governors and deputy governors.

Point 9) Election polls

A) The candidate with the highest votes wins the elected position.

(1) For departments, provinces and the Presidency, the candidate with the second highest votes wins the Deputy position.

 

[Cyc]

Donsig, you're way ahead of where you should be. Why don't you put as much effort into resolving the current issue? Once that is squared away, dealing with new issues like this will be much easier. This issue here deals with enlarging the government we have now, when we can't seem to operate well enough at the size it is (MIA's).

 

[donsig]

Originally posted by Cyc
Donsig, you're way ahead of where you should be. Why don't you put as much effort into resolving the current issue? Once that is squared away, dealing with new issues like this will be much easier. This issue here deals with enlarging the government we have now, when we can't seem to operate well enough at the size it is (MIA's).

Have I missed something? A standard was proposed, passed a council vote and judicial review. Seems to me like that issue is resolved.

As for enlarging the government this proposal will not necessarily do so as someone can hold mutiple deputyships.

In any event this is a seperate proposal. If you like the idea say so. If you don't like it say so.

 

[chiefpaco]

In any event this is a seperate proposal. If you like the idea say so. If you don't like it say so.

Usually, I don't respond in this type of thread, but you asked for it...

I don't like it. I'm generally not in favour of deputies and this proposal adds more. An absent official is a problem, but even deputies have a hard time telling when to step in. Plus, they aren't even someone we voted for.

I don't believe it will solve our troubles. The Deputy system is far far far from perfect - I'd rather see deputies scratched before we burden ourselves with more of them.

Furthermore, I'd rather not change the rules so much at this point. We aren't far from our goals.

However, I admire the proposal and think it was well presented.

 

[Cyc]

Yes, it was well presented, wasn't it chiefpaco. That's one thing I admired about the proposal too...

 

[Almightyjosh]

I think it is a good idea in principal, but not a problem I have encountered. That is, sure we need someone to step in when the governor is away, but what about when they are not, what does the dep. Governor do?? I've got seven mayors and three other officials making decitions for me ( ), there is no place for a depudy. It is not worth haveing a depudy if there is nothing for them to do when the governor is there and active!!
That said, having a depudy would mean that when governors do go MIA, there is at least a stop-gap fix available. Plus, I think we should get people involved in government, the game is much more interesting when you can have some influence!!

 

[Octavian X]

Deputy governors would not be needed. The council positions do need deputies, in my opinion. If a governor isn't there, it's no problem to decide to build something. Council members on the other hand are very important, and their decisions just can't be made by others. An absent governor is easy to deal with, but an absent council member is a different story.

 

[GenMarshall]

I think it is like a Leutenant Govenor in many U.S. States.

The Merriam-webster Dictionary states the Lt Gov to be:

Main Entry: lieutenant governor
Function: noun
Date: 1595
: a deputy or subordinate governor: as a : an elected official serving as deputy to the governor of an American state b : the formal head of the government of a Canadian province appointed by the federal government as the representative of the crown
- lieutenant governorship noun

In other words he acts as an advisor to the govenor. (That means, Ignoring the Canadian definition.) Much like the Military Deputy is an advisor to the Military Leader, and so on.

 

[Zarn]

I think mayor positions should be filled, first. If that happens, then there would be no need for a deputy governer.

 

[Octavian X]

Mayoral positions are not important. Larger cities with more demogame citizens would need them, otherwise they are unnecessary.

 

[Myartar]

I'm in favor of deputy or Lt. governors for the fact it will get more people involved. When you don't have an actual position the game is really dull and it seems your opinions aren't counted outside of polls. If we don't take on the deputy governors thing, we should improve the importance of mayors.
I think you're wrong Octavian when you say both aren't needed, inclusion, not exclusion is the key to all governments. And when there is more and more talk about how polls are pretty much meaning less by higher up officals, I beleive it won't be long before more and more things aren't put to polls. It's really easy to forget how boring the game is when you don't have a role to play and a job to do. Sometimes I think some of our officals need to be brought back down to positionless knaves so they can see this and respect this.

 

[donsig]

What would a deputy governor do? Same thing the vice-president of the USA does - not a darn thing! Deputy governors would only be waiting in the wings until the governor goes belly up.

It is quite interesting to hear all the new governors say they don't need deputies. That's all well and good when you have 7 mayors telling you what to do but believe it or not it wasn't long ago that we didn't have 7 mayors in the whole country! The governor of Asphinxia was the only citizen of that province back in the old days.

It is also amusing to hear our FA leader speak out against deputy governors. Chiefpaco, wouldn't you have liked to have had a deputy governor in Ameri back when Philadelphia was cranking our worker after worker afer worker?

I'm all for having mayors and even giving them a little power. The deputy governor can be a mayor in the province - what's wrong with that?

As for not electing deputy governors, that isn't true. A deputy governor, like any other deputy in Phoenatica, would be the runner up in the gubernatorial election. The deputy would only be appointed if a governor ran unopposed.

Finally, deputies should have no problem telling when to step in. They step in when the leader is absent.

Sorry for being blunt in this post but time is short for me today.

 

[chiefpaco]

Originally posted by donsig

It is also amusing to hear our FA leader speak out against deputy governors. Chiefpaco, wouldn't you have liked to have had a deputy governor in Ameri back when Philadelphia was cranking our worker after worker afer worker?

In the absence of instructions, the DP is allowed to make any decisions. It was a failure in many parts. Adding a deputy who may or may not have been around still at this point might have helped. Having 10 deputies doing nothing in the general case is not a scenario I envision.

 

[donsig]

Originally posted by chiefpaco


In the absence of instructions, the DP is allowed to make any decisions. It was a failure in many parts. Adding a deputy who may or may not have been around still at this point might have helped. Having 10 deputies doing nothing in the general case is not a scenario I envision.

Yeah, that's exactly what happened. In the absence of instructions I (the DP) decided to let Philadelphia build workers.

Having ten deputies doing nothing is no different than having insurance that does nothing. If you want deputy governors to do something then perhaps we should recruit them from the ranks to the provinces mayors. Perhaps a CoC for a province. Biggest drawback there is that deputies would not be elected officials since mayors have traditionally been volunteers.

We should pay heed to some of the newcomers who are reminding us that unless you are an official there isn't much to do here and it gets boring.

 

[Shaitan]

[immaturity] Donsig: Told ya so! [/immaturity]

I'm for Deputy (or Lieutenant) Governors. There are many reasons that have already been mentioned:

• Increased candidate pool for Presidency.
• Backup for governors, especially during unexpected/unplanned/unannounced absences.
• Greater direct participation by citizens.
• Greater opportunity for governmental positions for citizens.
• Direct support and assistance in day to day governing (Except in Asphinxia - they've already got their game together over there!).

The main arguments against a deputy position for governors are that A) they're not necessary and B) they will make the government bigger. Let's assume that both of these arguments are correct (I do not assume this, but for the sake of dismissal we'll do so). Are they valid reasons at all? Let's take a look:

A) They're not necessary: So what? No individual aspect of our government or our game is strictly necessary. Things are added to make things better, not because they are critical necessities.

B) They will make the government bigger: Yay! See items 2 and 3 above. These are good things. The more people who are directly involved in the government, the better.

Disclaimer: No sarcasm was intended in the previous paragraphs. I just finished an excellent book by Vincent Bugliosi and am in a very argumentative frame of mind.

 

[donsig]

Originally posted by Shaitan

Disclaimer: No sarcasm was intended in the previous paragraphs. I just finished an excellent book by Vincent Bugliosi and am in a very argumentative frame of mind.

Your posts are tame compared to mine today.

 

[Curufinwe]

Shaitan actually said that stuff in the "immaturity" tags, amazing, I've always admired his usual speech though. But if we are to implement this then a fatal problem will arise. We may need to relax the "2 elections only" rule. Otherwise we will be at a loss for many of these things./

 

[donsig]

I thought of that also curufinwe but I'm not so sure that relaxing 'run for one office' rule is the answer. If we stay with that rule then we may well end up with some governors running unopposed - meaning they's have no deputy. It may also mean there are good people who lost their election and are out of a job - making them prime candidates for a deputy governorship appointment.

What would be really cool would be to restrict voting in gubernatorial elections to citizens of the province in question rather than nationwide. We could even have mayoral elections restricted to citizens of each city. Mayoral elections need not be handled by the moderators. Since they are local elections they could be held by the local citizenry themselves. Stuff like this would certainly give the demo game a more interesting flavor.

 

[Almightyjosh]

Thats all well and good for the three citites with 20 prople in them, but outside fox-nest and PDX, 3 citizens is an impressive city!! I do think it's a good idea to have governors elected by the people of that province, it makes it more realistic!!

 

[Octavian X]

So I would get to elect myself...