Agricultural overpowered?

Smellincoffee

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It seems that in all my games, the agricultural civs are behemoths that are almost impossible to take down. The American civs, in particular - the Mayans are incredible.

Is agricultural the new industrious?
 
I think it may be. It gives a huge early growth boost, and a lasting one in despotism. The growth from this can be felt throughout the entire game.
 
I guess it depends on the start location. In my latest game I'm sumeria on a Japan shaped island (fun with corruption...) and there are no rivers or lakes (and yes, there are plains.... electricity can't come soon enough). No bonuses for me... yet. I NEED those cheap aqueducts to survive...

Yeah, if they start in a sea of grassland littered with rivers it's quite the trait.
 
Yea I had a game recnetly as the Iroquios with two cattle and my first city started on a river. To say the least even on Emperor the AI never stood a chance. I out expanded all other AI's with only my capital being a settler factory. Come to think of it, that game was the first time I ever won by Domination.
 
It's okay if you want to spam out settlers for a major land grab, just make sure you don't go over your current government's OCN, or you might end up in a situation where you lose almost half your empire to the AI because those cities are only bringing in 1 SPT and maybe 3 commerce with a FP and courthouses in every city. If a civ is Ag/Comm, or Ag/Rel, I might go for it, otherwise IMO it aint all that great. True, I've seen Ag AI civs (dutch, celt, etc) explode in the Ancient and middle ages, but with a Sci or Rel civ you can beat 'em in the tech/culture races and use your superior units to prune some of those unproductive (due to corruption), deadwood cities from their empire.

Another thing I don't like is that almost no city improvements are Ag, while there are a ton of industrial/religious/scientific/commercial/military improvements, although I do like half-cost Recycling plants.

The main thing I like about Ag civs is that settling the Sahara (what I like to refer to ~30+ tile deserts that tend to crop up right outside my territory) is actually a viable option as long as fresh water is available somewhere (I once had to irrigate 15 tiles just to be able to irrigate in a desert city's radius, but it was well worth it).
 
I think I remember reading a thread about this before. Folks eventually decided the AI has trouble with early build choices, and will try to build a settler even when they are 10+ turns away from reaching size 3. Then they just sit there with a full production box, wasting sheilds. The agricultural trait minimizes the effect of this flaw.
 
I agree with ummmm......, the AI takes more advantage of the Agricultural trait because of the things he mentioned.

The Mayans are however not overpowering the Incas or the dominating Iroquis in my current game, but the Iroquis seem to do a lot better with the agricultural trait, I would definitely say if you want tougher AI opponents, select agricultural civs.

For yourself: Early growth is always great. I am just playing Egypt on Demigod, I think agricultural would have helped me a lot more than religious in the beginning, but without able to give better evidence, I do not think it is overpowered for human players.
 
Yes, without a doubt Ag is the strongest trait for the AI.

(IMHO) Industrial was never a very good trait for the AI, it's main advantage is faster workers early. So the AI ends up with a whole bunch of irrigated grasslands, and mined plains instead of not quite as many.
 
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